strength training and sore muscles

Factual Questions
1

I’m assuming there’s a factual answer to this, though perhaps there isn’t actually any consensus…

When strength training, is it better to allow your muscles to rest until they are no longer sore, or to keep going after a day or so of rest? I’m currently taking an Aerial Circus Arts class, and some weeks it can leave me sore for 3 or more days straight (for example, this week: my class was Wednesday, and I’m still sore). My goals are to increase strength and muscle tone – eventually I want to be able to pull myself up on the trapeze and pivot around my shoulders in a controlled fashion and without looking like a total clod. :smiley: I don’t want to sabotage myself by overtraining, but I don’t want to stop improving, or improve much more slowly, because I’m not training enough, either.

2

I would be interested to see if anyone knows of any solid research that offers an answer to this. From what I’ve read – and I try to stay well-read on weight training – there’s still no consensus as to what causes muscle soreness. There’s a lot of old disproven theories that are still batted around (i.e., lactic acid), but there’s been no definitive answer. So, if we don’t know what causes it, I don’t know that there would be an answer to what’s best.

My gut says that most experts would say that working out while sore isn’t a problem as long as you’ve had adequate rest, i.e., at least 24 to 48 hours. If the soreness interferes with your range of motion or prevents you from working at the same weight/intensity, then you should rest until your workouts can be consistent. Also, if you’re too sore to maintain proper form or control the weights, then your risk for injury increases.

Here’s a good article on rest/recovery; she doesn’t mention soreness, but there’s other relevant info you might find useful: STUMPTUOUS.COM Sit yo ass down! The importance of rest - STUMPTUOUS.COM

3

That’s interesting… I didn’t realize that there wasn’t even consensus on what causes soreness. I’d always figured that lactic acid was responsible for the “burn” you feel while exercising, but ongoing soreness the next day (or next several days) was the result of the micro-tears you get in your muscle fibers when training (which eventually heal into stronger-than-before muscle fibers).

4

Soreness the day (or days) after exercising or strength training is not caused by lactic acid. The body clears lactic acid in a matter of minutes. It is caused by minute tears in your muscles. When the tears heal, the muscle is stronger. This is known as eustress (good stress).

The burning you feel in your muscles as you do sets is caused primarily by lactic acid, but other physioliogical factors are involved.

5

I don’t even think there’s a consensus. It seems that results vary person to person, and may even depend on genetics.

You can deal with all the factors besides genetics, I think. What I’ve learned, and haven’t seen anything contrary, is the following:
[ul]
[li]You need time to recover. You don’t grow stronger when you exercise, you grow stronger when you’re recovering.[/li][li]Recovery time varies according to the type of exercise. For “strength”, you need at least one recovery day.[/li][li]Recovery time decreases a bit as you get stronger, but increases as you get older.[/li][li]You need to sleep to recover, because growth hormones are only secreted when you are asleep. I’ve even heard it said that you need a certain type of sleep for this to happen.[/li][li]Good nutrition helps recovery.[/li][li]I don’t think they know exactly what causes soreness. It certainly has something to do with both damage and byproducts.[/li][li]Stretching and massage/foam rollers, etc. seem to help, too.[/li][/ul]

6

Yes, and that’s widely accepted in the exercise science community.

One of the best takes I’ve seen on training through soreness came from Chad Waterbury, who noted that soreness is something of a vague term. He gives three levels of soreness: pain at maximal contraction, pain in motion, and pain all the time. For the first, there’s no harm in training after some rest. For the third, something’s gone wrong and you need to focus on recovery. For the second, it depends on whether you need to be able to act through soreness. Police, firefighters and soldiers do, so they should train, but us regular folks don’t and therefore don’t need to.

7

Train in pain? Problem: Inflammation.

Problem with that?

Impingement.

What’s that? Reduced range of motion from inflammation.

Problem with that?

Tendinitis: an innocent sounding word that means “DAMN, that m-fer HURTS”.

Problem with that? Arthritis and an inability to move a body part, let alone train it.

Sincerley yours,

A guy who trained in pain, on top of fighting in pain, and doing carpentry in pain.

Rest. Trust me. Or, pay for an orthepedist’s next yacht…

…just to get your shirt off in the morning.

8

It is possible to have a productive workout that builds muscle without experiencing soreness.

Also, it is known that negative muscle loading causes more soreness than positive. That’s why you get more sore, for example, if you walk down into the Grand Canyon than when you walk back out.

These guys seem to think they know all the answers but I’m not so sure.

9

The one thing you’ll learn quickly about weight training is simple. CHANGE is what makes muscles grow.

It is true you don’t gain muscle while working out but you gain when you rest. How long you rest it, MUST vary.

Your body will always take the line of least resistance. If you do a routine and rest for 24 hours between workouts that’s great. But you know what. After about two weeks your body adapts to that and you’ll start noticing your progress slows or stops.

Why? 'Cause you’re body is adapting. It doesn’t matter what your routine is the important thing is you don’t do that routine for any more than 2 weeks. The key to real growth is keep your routines varied because your body will adapt and take the line of least resistance.

Why do you get muscles? Because your body is taking the easiest way out. If you lift a weight your body says “Ok we’ll this is dumb but we’ll cope with it.” If you keep lifting the weight, your body says “OK enough of this, let’s make the muscle bigger so we don’t have to use so much energy to move it.”

As for soreness, you should feel a “discomfort” after you work out, but pain? I don’t think so. A discomfort says “there was a slight tear in the muscle and your body will rebuild it.”

A good general guildine is within an hour after working out with weight you should not be feeling any discomfort. Another good guildline is if you over do it. ONE SINGLE DOSE of aspirin or Tylenol or ibuprofen should stop the pain. If after one does, like four or six hours later you still hurt and the OTC pain med didn’t work, you messed up and did something wrong.

Two other hints I can add is look at people who have nice bodies and see what they are doing. And try to copy them. Also at the gym find machines no one uses. You know why no one uses them, because they are hard to use. These are the machines that will vary your routine, as I said "it’s not really your routine that matters, as much as doing a different routine and mixing it up from week to week.

People say don’t do too much too fast 'cause you’ll hurt yourself, get discouraged and quit.

The only real warning I have is free weights. If you feel you must use them get a personal trainer or an experience friends. I have just seen SO MANY people chip teeth and break toes because of free weights. They are good but you have to know how to use them. A couple of sessions with a personal trainer is much cheaper than capping a chipped tooth.

10

I would be wary of this. Lots of people know what they’re doing but I have seen a few built people using poor form when they work out. If you don’t use proper form, at best you could be missing the potential benefit of some exercises, and at worst could be courting injury.

11

You should not feel any discomfort immediately after working out, but when you wake up the next day. That is why this is called Delayed Onset Muscle Syndrome (DOMS). Google DOMS for more info.

Although lactic acid is the primary factor for the “burning,” other metabolic reactions do play a role.

12

Ah, nevermind.

13

A lot of this is great, but it doesn’t really address my specific question. I’m not using weights or machines. I’m climbing a Spanish Web and hanging in an upside-down pike from a trapeze. (Also silks, silk knot, and lyra.)

I’m not talking about injured muscles. I’m talking about being sore because I did all sorts of things my muscles are unaccustomed to doing – normal, next-day soreness.

During some classes I may be actively climbing or otherwise hauling my weight around by my arms for 35-40 minutes of a 45-minute class. After a particularly active class, I can be sore in the arms and shoulders for upwards of three days afterwards. I’m happy to give myself a full day of rest – I know that much. My question is, is it better for me to continue to rest until the soreness goes away, which may be 3 or 4 days of no muscle training at all, or should I do the standard day of rest, and get back to it the day after that?

My goals are reasonably steady improvement in strength and muscle tone. When not at the aerials gym I can do calisthenics type stuff at home: pushups, inclined pullups, that sort of thing.

14

YES. REST until no longer sore.

It will allow longevity. Workers, athletes and poor laborers do NOT get this chance. It can lead to chronic inflammation, arthritis, tendinitis and myriad issues.

Sure, a dock worker can work the same muscles daily… but only for so long…

Young people, like Michael Phelps, can get away with it… but on borrowed time and because they are pursuing short-term world-record greatness.

For longevity… for sake of feeling good 20 years from now: REST until no longer sore.

(Even when you feel good and not sore, anecdotal evidence suggests some light or ‘off’ weeks, too)
**
Go back and read my previous post**, because I am the classic example, to my docs, of a person who disregarded rest. I never stopped, and trained through soreness, and then did side work (tile, carpentry) through further soreness, which led to my chain of events outlined above. That is a case study per my orthopedist!