If the business were simply providing gym services, and had a child care available for people who want to drop off their kids there while they exercise, you would have a point. What I’m getting from UC’s missive is that a part of the gym’s promotional material suggests that they provide quality child care for their patrons’ children. This is a selling point for them – and some of the material circulating in the Triangle suggests to me that it’s not uncommon for young parents to patronize places that provide quality child care as an element of their service. If the latter is the case, UC’s expectation is entirely in line with what she was told and sold.
I may not like the overall tone of the letter, but the OP is dead to rights re the ladder. I’m sure the gym would not welcome the inevitable law suit when little Logan or Millicent climbs and falls off that ladder, suffering a concussion.
Something needs to change there for sure. Not much you can do about the ratio, but surely some common sense is in order?
Yeah, I’m wondering if there’s a difference in employment background at work here. “Threatening” or “confrontational” letters from me usually contain the words, “will pursue all available legal remedies.” I’m used to drafting letters in a professional tone.
PunditLisa, I have taken her there a few times since the letter, only at their lowest business times. As I said in the letter, I think the staff are generally reasonable and competent, but when they’re spread too thin they can’t function as they should. So if I bring her when there are five kids in the toddler area, I have a reasonable expectation of safety. (Shortly after sending the letter I heard that the recipient had heard of the ladder incident and acted on it, so that was less of a concern.)
And since, as runner pat quoted, there is no regulation, I’m left with appeals to analogy regarding appropriate ratios. No, it’s not controlling, but my hope is it would indicate my concerns are not unreasonable.
I realize that my ultimate remedy is to leave. But I wanted to give them a chance to fix what was pushing me out the door. Last year I decided to switch pediatricians for the girls, and thought, “I should tell them why we’re leaving,” and never did, and I feel kind of chickenshit and/or lazy for not doing it. But it seems like some people are saying that is the better way to go - just leave, don’t confront the issue. I find it hard to believe businesses would prefer that.
Have we simply reached a point where a professionally composed letter seems offensive to some people? One doesn’t see many cogent complaint letters these days, much less one that offers continued patronage in exchange for a solution as opposed to requesting a discount or free services.
I wish all complaints that I received during my work with end users and other customers were this concise. Formality is not a bad thing.
Really? That’s what you think?
It’s more the extreme sense of entitlement that rubs me the wrong way. If what’s apparently good enough for everyone else isn’t good enough for her precious spawn and hers alone, then she shouldn’t expect the world to adapt to her.
Moderator note:
I’m seeing a few people getting hot under the collar about the difference between professional and confrontational as it relates to letter writing. This isn’t really what this thread was supposed to be about, as best I can tell.
I’m not naming any names in making this statement, hoping that a simple reminder will serve to guide the thread back to topic, and put an end to the kerfuffle.
I have the honor to remain,
Your most humble hominid,
Spectre of Pithecanthropus, MPMIMS Moderator.
So, she should accept that an employee will erect a ladder and change a lightbulb in an overhead environment with children below, and should he happen to fall over while using the ladder, drop a tool on a child, or break a bulb and have her child cut himself upon or injest glass shards? She does indeed have an “extreme sense of entitlement” to expect that child care provided as a service of the gym take prudent steps to ensure the health and safety of her “precious spawn” while in their care. And how utterly offensive of her to lay out her expectations clearly, concisely, and in “quasi-legalese”, whatever that is.
Stranger
I agree. I sell commercial and investment real estate for a living, and I deal with doctors, lawyers, and Indian Chiefs all day long in addition to variety of service providers. Few, if any of them, would adopt the aggressive and extraordinarily obnoxious tone you took in the letter below on the front end of trying to address a concern you have. Most would have the common sense to try and have a person to person conversation with management about the problem before demanding a bullet point action plan about how your dissatisfaction is going to be remedied. The people that do this inappropriate sort of thing are typically middle managers or administrative assistants who, lacking interpersonal skills or a appropriate sense of proportion, think going woofing like big dogs is going to get people to snap to attention for them for problems that would be better solved or addressed much more effectively with person to person interaction.
This isn’t a vendor with a history of mangling critical parts for NASA or a PR firm billing $ 300 an hour that told you it was fine to go to the yacht races while the oil is still spewing. It’s a neighborhood gym with an accessory daycare.
If you think there is no difference in how you should handle this, because after all, they are service provider, and you are a customer rightfully expecting a service, all I can tell is that you are utterly tone deaf in terms of how to effectively deal with people in the initial stages of trying to solve a problem. There is certainly a point at which it’s a appropriate to go nuclear with a formal demand and response letter. Blasting one out of the gate before having any kind of dialog makes you look like a blustering buffoon.
“I would like to receive a written response from you by June 30, 2010, addressing the concerns I’ve detailed, and outlining specific measures you plan to take to fix each problem, including a timetable of their planned institution. (If you prefer you may e-mail me at [e-mail address].)…but I am open to hearing other ideas. In the meantime, please feel free to contact me to discuss this issue as you formulate a solution.”
You are open to hearing other ideas? Thats awfully big of you. :rolleyes:
I’d expect a paragraph like that from the fucking owner of the company, or from an insurance assessor (or something similiar).
You may be the customer, but you do not get to dictate to anybody like that. I think this is worth quoting:
Unlike Spectre above, I’m going to name names – astro, you went over the line here. We’re in MPSIMS, not the Pit – dial back the personal insults.
No warning issued.
Thanks,
twickster, MPSIMS moderator
UC, does the name of this gym rhyme with “Fifetime Litness” by any chance?
Baracus, that definitely rings a bell. I take it you’re familiar with them.
[And yes, please let’s all not discuss the letter itself anymore. I only posted it because I had already written out the problems, and it was an easy way to outline what was going on. Obviously this had the practical effect of exposing it to criticism, but that was not the purpose of the thread. This thread is for mundane, pointless whining about my gym situation.]
Yes and I would agree with you that the childcare sucks. Given all the extra staff just hanging out in other parts of the gym, it seems a little ridiculous that they can’t spare a few to interact with the kids rather than just checking kids in and paging the parents of the kids they can’t handle every five minutes. I don’t expect constant one-on-one interaction for my “precious snowflake” but when my child is shyly standing in the same spot against the wall five feet from the desk for 30 minutes, it would be nice if she were not completely ignored.
Same for me - I’m looking at childcare options for out daughter, and the ratio is my state (Vic Australia) is 1:5 under three years of age, and 1:15 over that. My gym creche has a max number of kids allowed for the 3 staff on duty, and we have to book ourselves in a week in advance (a pain in the bum, but I won’t go to the gym otherwise!)
If the ratio was 1:12 for a toddler under 3 (my baby’s only 7 months), there’s no way I would have gone to that gym, no matter how nice.
Pehaps a slightly more conciliatory tone in the letter might have helped? Yes, it’s business not a personal friend, but there is a person at the other end of that letter. You want the staff to feel like there is a chance of making you happy - otherwise you’ve given them the easy out - you’ll leave, taking the problem with you.
Child care doesn’t make or break a health club. It’s a courtesy service.
If you look at stats, you find in your average health club 90% of the members don’t use the club more than 1 time per month. About 2/3 go less than 5 times a YEAR.
Less than 3% use it more than 4 days a week.
You see how health clubs work. They DON’T want you to come in.
Look around your gym. If it’s a national heathclub chances are for every one person you see there TEN are not there. Can you imagine how crowded the gym would be if EVERYONE WENT.
Healthclubs thrive because people don’t go. If everyone went there would not be enough equipment or staff.
Most people using gyms don’t use the child care. If you want high quality child care to get it you’d have to raise the cost of the operation and divide it amongst all the members. Since a huge majority of members never go anyway, they’d be paying MORE for something they never use.
As it is healthclubs use every trick in the book to keep people paying even though they never use the membership. Jacking up rates isn’t going to help keep the members who don’t go regularly to keep paying. And if they were say, “We’re raising the cost of your gym membership to give child care.” That would be death.
Most people would say “Kids don’t belong in the gym anyway. If people can’t afford kids why have him. Why should I pay more for someone else’s kid.” Etc etc etc…
Now the OP may have a valid complaint. But a valid complaint doesn’t always translate into profit or even a good business decision.
Since the OP already said they Y has better child care, she has provided herself with a resonable alterntive. This is the free market in action.
Let the people with kids go to they Y and the others who don’t need child care service stay at the gym.
Lemme guess. You ain’t got kids. If you did, you’d recognize that a kid-to-caretaker ratio of 15±to-1 isn’t just reckless… In most states, it’s illegal.
And if you had kids, you’d understand how a parent might not want their child(ren) to, you know…die??
Apparently it’s not in North Carolina. And, once again, I don’t really care if it’s legal; what matters is whether or not they meet MY standard of appropriate childcare. They don’t meet Cinnamon’s standard and that is what truly matters.
My local tennis club has a summer “daycamp” that I signed my children up for years ago. On day two, I discovered that a dozen or so 7 and 8 year old kids were being supervised by ONE 13 year old. And it included swimming! I was aghast. I didn’t even bother to complain because the gulf between what I’d consider to be appropriate and what they deemed to be appropriate was so wide that there would never be resolution.
Just wanted to say that I think you are a really amazing person to remain so calm and poised when all about you are critical carping people whining about your letter! I thought the letter was fine, and was astonished to find so many people didn’t. But I am totally impressed at your ability to remain above the fray and focussed on the issue. Nice job, Cinnamon!
An “amazing person” is defined as one who accepts bland criticism (this isn’t even the pit!) from a half a dozen people on a website? Oookay!