Swearing in atheists

From here: How do courts swear in atheists? - The Straight Dope

Cecil said:

I’ll put my money on the court tossing someone’s butt in jail for perjury over the idea of Big Juju In The Sky getting him in the head with a lightning bolt, any day. Cecil, it’s not the best judges can do; it’s the only thing judges can do.

The fear of the Almighty is hopefully not limited to what can be done to you THIS lifetime. :wink:

Hi Cecil

have spent some time registering to point out that in the “Good Book” there are two, that I know of, exhortations NOT to swear by God.

It never ceases to amaze me that people who profess faith in an ancient and questionable tome, do not understand this word of the lord fully. Rather, they choose those parts that they believe and discard what is not in accord with their idea of religion.

For those not sure of where to look for the quotes I refer to, here they are.

Matthew 5:34-37

James 5:12

I am sure you will realize that I no longer take what is said in these writings as gospel. It took some time to reach, not only maturity, but the space needed to look at my belief in this travesty of religion, and make the most wonderful of discoveries, that we can all be free of superstition if we choose to let it fall from our backs.

The truth is I do not recognise your description of folk like myself as “godless heathens”, nor even as an athiest. I simply cannot take seriously anybody who tells me that their brand of superstition is the only brand that will “save” them. Save from what? I died in an ambulance and saw no pearly gates or lake of fire. It really is santa claus all over again, but for grown-ups. Very sad, all that wasted time and effort placating nothing at all.

The “Godless heathens” remark was a joke, lighten up. This atheist thought it was pretty funny.

Yes, Uncle Cec often cracks jokes in dubious taste. However, he was not saying that only atheists refuse to swear an oath in court. I’s just criticise him for not making JohnR’s point, that many Christians take the injunctions against swearing in both parts of the Bible (it’s in the third commandment for Protestants, and the second commandment for Catholics) seriously enough to want to just affirm in court.

Ah, I misunderstood part of what JohnR was saying. But Cecil obviously wasn’t saying that everyone that “affirms” in court is an atheist, he was just answering the question, which was specifically about atheists.

What grieves me most are the epithets to describe anyone unable to follow arrant nonsense. If I do not believe in fairies, and I don’t, no one calls me a fairy denier or any other name. But because I do not believe in a spooky being in the sky I am ascribed various designations that just seem silly.

No spirit no other place no “thing” called a soul inside me.

And no, I don’t like athiest, because it smacks of afairiest, see above, and gives superstition a form of verification to which I will not subscribe.

Here’s a link, by the way, to the article in question: http://www.straightdope.com/columns/read/134/how-do-courts-swear-in-atheists.

I’m curious about something else – at the end, Cecil says “It’s not an ideal situation, if you want my opinion, but I suppose it’s the best the judges can do under the circumstances” – is that another joke (i.e., ideally everyone should fear the wrath of god)? Or if not, what would be a better situation? I know there are a lot of jokes in the article, but for some reason that last sentence didn’t read like one to me.

Most courts now simply say “Do you swear or affirm that the testimony you will give in this matter is true?”

Or something very similar.

Read some more of Cecil’s columns. Yes, those are jokes, that’s his shtick.

I missed this thread when I posted in the other “swearing in atheists” thread. I’m glad I’m not the only person who thought Cecil’s last sentence didn’t sound like one of his typical jokes. I also asked myself “what else could they do?”, but maybe it was just part of the joke afterall.

I’m going to take that fairies crack as a sign that you’re an Invisible Pink Unicorn (May Her Hooves Never Be Shod) denier.

You do believe in the FSM, though, right?

Given that we all believe in different gods, and some prohibit using their name in vain, why doesn’t everyone take an affirmation oath? Separation of church & state and all that. It seems to me that if the jury hears you take a funny oath, you may have automatically prejudiced some of them against you.

As an atheist, I’m now quite eager to be sworn in for something just so I can say “You got it, Jack”.

Edit: I should note that I was sworn in for Jury Duty recently (although not sworn into an actual jury, just the pool) but it was a mass swearing-in and I reeeeeeeally didn’t want to make waves in that situation.
Powers &8^]

Imagine how cool, though, when you say that and two or three others say it at once. And you all share a secret smile.

Clothahump said:

Psst, I think that’s Cecil’s joke. In other words, if the witness is a Christian, the judges can’t make God strike them down or send them to Hell or anything. If the person believes he will be held accountable, that is great, but the only thing the courts can do is the same thing they do to atheists.

Since there were two threads on the same column, I’ve merged JohnR’s into the slightly earlier one started by Clothahump.

bibliophage
moderator CCC

An earlier thread that may be of interest: Should people be able to testify without being put under oath? - Factual Questions - Straight Dope Message Board

An atheist can be very honest. Swearing him in is just a waste of time. Swearing in church goers does not guarantee the truth either. If either lie they can get in trouble. It is much about nothing.

Isn’t the silly business of going up and sitting in the special chair enough?

What’s the big deal about the witness stand anyway? You’re in court, so you’re not supposed to lie… but when you’re in that chair, well, you really-really aren’t supposed to lie.