Yes they do.
To which claims do you refer ? I will gladly support the claims.
The report, on Randi’s website, quotes Randi directlty from a letter he wrote to Fate magazine:
We can hand pick any one of the 24 points. Here is one:
This is what Randi published in his book
Randi (p. 49): [With regard to the Faraday cage experiments] He could even reach his arm out of the cage. What is to prevent Shipi from signaling these three [targets] to Geller? Nothing.
The actual conditions of the experiment did not allow any arms out of the cage. Randi was wrong.
T&P contend: The Faraday cage is entirely sealed and guarded. Only by opening the door can one reach out. With regard to Shipi acting as a confederate to signal to Geller, again, as in all experiments, neither Shipi nor any other potential confederate was permitted into the target area or knew of the target, a precaution insisted upon and followed as a result ot advice from consulting magicians.
Randi redirects the lie with a bunch of balogna. He was wrong, demonstrated wrong and did not pay.
My Response: I was told that the large mesh of the “cage” allowed one to reach out. I was never able to see the cage, or a photo of it, though opening the screen door is obviously not difficult. Hannah Shtrang was in the target area this time and was a general “gopher,” thus being provided with an excellent opportunity to act as a confederate. Many people wandering by asked to see the target and were shown it. The control on this test was ridiculous.
If you would like to review more of the evidence here, just say so, we can take it point by point.
“The warts were charmed” in the sense that the wart charmer did his thing. I was there, he touched them, whispered, etc. Does this mean they were charmed in a magical sense ? Don’t know.
I can’t answer your questions as presented. Sorry.
I can not attribute them to anything within my knowledge, with any degree of certainty or evidence. He charmed them, they went away within the window of his statement. That’s all I got for you.
It can be seen from all kinds of perspectives and my thoughts on it vary. These thoughts are however, just thouhgts of imagination and imagining how or why they went away. The truth is, I do not know.
But we can continue to demonstrate that Randi does not pay his Challenges, even when proved wrong. Randi published this statement in his book
Randi (p. 52): And is it not curious that this Geller test series was never reprinted or mentioned by any of his SRI disciples? [Referring to the 100-envelope double-blind clairvoyance test that Geller failed.]
**This is really, really simple. It was reprinted and mentioned. **
T&P contend: This test, with its negative results, is also in the Nature paper, fourth paragraph from the end of the section on Geller.
Radi explains that no one could have seen it, although, of course, if it was printed, someone certainly saw it and someone isn’t no one. Besides, it was reprinted, regardless. He was wrong.
My Response: There is no way that anyone could identify the 100-envelope test reported in Nature with the Rebert/Otis tests. T&P say in Nature, “On each day he made approximately 12 recognizable drawings, which he felt were associated with the entire target pool of 100. On each of the three days, two of his drawings could reasonably be associated with two of the 20 daily targets. On the third day, two of his drawings were very close replications of two of that day’s target pictures.” FACT: There was never any provision for “associating drawings with the entire pool.” He was to tell the contents of one envelope at a time. T&P are attempting to salvage something from these failed tests, which they had to report since they were designed by others at SRI. FACT: The episode on the third day took place after the test was officially terminated and involved a special set of six envelopes not in the original target pool. Geller left the room several times during the tests and scored direct hits on two envelopes. Rebert solved that one; anyone could.
I don’t know what wart charming is. I can only tell you my experience with it. Is it magic ? Depends on which sense of the word you mean. Illusion ? An appearance of the supernatural ? Black magic ?
Right. In the sense of verified, tested wart charmers. The odds of them existing are 0.
From earlier, I just wanted to make sure you have noted that the before stated accusation, that Randi failed to pay a $1,000 dollar challenge, has been verified to reflect the truth. It was verified by James Randi.
If Randi will go to such great lengths to avoid paying a measley $1,000 dollar challenge, after been shown exactly wrong, I find it difficult to believe that anyone would think he actually intends to ever pay a million.
I must admit that reading his account of the story is quite entertaining. What a floundering farce !
It depends on your use of the word “magic”. I know folks here don’t agree with umbrella definitions so it is difficult to communicate with clarity here. If you mean “magic” in the sense of some illusion or appearance of the supernatural, like Randi does in his stage act, then yes, it at least had the appearance of “magic”.
Perhaps you can use a more specific term so that we understand each other.
Hah! I catch you contradicting yourself and you go back to another argument to try even the score. Sweet! I’ll take a look at your evidence in the morning and get back to you.
I am the first to admit, and have already here, that I lie. Scientific studies have shown that most people do lie, although most people will not admit it. I may lie out of ignorance, by mistake and yes, sometimes because I want to. I try not to lie at all. You very well may catch me in at least, a vaguely contradictory statement after a few days of seemingly endless statements. I am no saint and no genius (though some people have insisted, of the diabolical sort) however, I know shit when I smell it and I have enough skills to sometimes figure out when someone is being dishonest and deceitful.
I just admitted that I may lie or contradict. Most everyone does. I said I don’t know because I don’t. When he says “magical sense” I can not, by the insistance of people here, rely on an umbrella definition of the word. I would have to get a more narrow definition in order to avoid another huge debate on the meaning of magic.
That’s fine. I assume that you agree there would be nothing supernatural about cold fusion, assuming it were demonstrated?
Do you think someone would come up with a plausible explanation next week? Look how long it took to explain the results of the Michelson-Morley experiment. The only reason I can see for your contention that Randi would sit for years waiting for an explanation is extreme Randi hatred. However, my understanding is that what constitutes success is set down in writing. One of the problems he mentions is that many of those wanting to take the test have no idea of how to document their claim. (Or are unwilling to write down a real claim.)
I’m not a biologist, just married to one. But clearly our bodies heal themselves without medicine, quite often. Clearly our mind is part of our body, and affects it. I was able to lower my heart rate when hooked to a monitor once, just from the feedback and without training. That our minds affect our bodies is not an extraordinary claim. Now, our minds replacing missing organs would be something else, but that’s not covered by the placebo effect.
I could quibble that these things fall under predictions made by theories accounting for existing evidence - but you have a point. Alas, there are no theories of the paranormal that I know, and nothing you’d expect if the paranormal existed (like people who could consistently display these abilities) have happened.
We’ve already seen the full cite about the “out”. Of course he doesn’t think anyone will ever win! He’s not a witling! He’s spent a good bit of his life exposing these clowns, and has never seen a real case. The purpose of the challenge is to make people with these claims, be they honest or charlatans, to put up or shut up. And this isn’t Win Ben Stein’s Money. He already doesn’t have the use of the money, so why would he want to dishonestly keep someone from winning?
Does wart charming qualify as paranormal, per any definition of the word you’d like to use?
Does Randi disbelieve in the paranormal, per any definition of the word you’d like to use?
If paranormal phenomena (per any definition you’d like to use) actually exist, doesn’t this mean Randi’s confidence that they don’t exist is misplaced?
If so, doesn’t this mean Randi is putting the million bucks at some non-zero risk?
I’m not seeing where Randi verifies that he backed out on paying anything that he owed.
You seem to be using this as a main piece of evidence:
Randi didn’t say if any errors are found in his book he will pay $1000; he said if any of the 24 ‘facts’ are found in error he would pay. Something as mundane as a P.R. man quitting S.R.I. is not one of the 24 facts, is it?
Okay? So you just proved that Randi DOES NOT admit to being proven wrong and then go on to claim that he is lying without having evidence that he is. Oh, my bad- you already admitted to being a liar three times.
I’ll take a look at your evidence in the morning and get back to you.