Team Bush and "Best Info Available @ the Time"

From the OP:
( the probability of Hussein initiating an attack in the foreseeable future is low )

Intl law aside, it’s so by a matter of definition. It’s what the term means.

No. Intl law has very little (if anything at all) to do with point I’m making. I’m saying that the terms used by Team Bush to sell the invasion did not fit with what the US intel community’s assessment was.

There needs to be a reasonable certainty that it’s about to come to pass.

It depends, did Clinton try to sell it as preemptive war or as some other thing?
If he tried to sell it as something other than preemptive war, then there would be no point in bringing up the preemptive war issue.
In the case in point, TB brought up the preemption issue. If they had sold the war as something other than preemption, then preemptive war issue would be moot.

Please understand that I’m not trying to make the case here that the invasion wasn’t a case of preemptive war and therefore wrong. (This seems to be the argument you’re rebutting.) Instead, I’m saying that TB invoked preemptive war when there was not an imminent attack to preempt. I’m not addressing the rightness/wrongness of the invasion in and of itself on this point.
I’m solely addressing the case made for the invasion. The case was not based on the best info available at the time.

As I noted above, these conditions are pretty much irrelevant to the point at hand which is about the sales pitch made for war rather than the actual conditions necessary. If TB had made a case that invoked something other than preemptive war, then this issue would not exist. Without an imminent threat, a war cannot be preemptive. It may be justified, but it’s not preemptive.

Yes, you are. His death may be inevitable, but, barring special yet unspecified circumstances, his death would not be considered “about to occur.”

elucidator:

Lust is not a fault. It’s a blessing.

Especially at your age.

A Wonder of the Ancient World perhaps?

You fantacize, I reminisce. Eat your hearts out.

And get off my lawn.

Newly Declassified Intelligence Documents on Iraq-al Qaeda Relationship

The CIA called bullshit on the Prague meet between Mohammed Atta and Iraqi officials way back in January 2003.

How interesting. It manages to be totally expected yet new at the same time.

I’m glad that Levin decided to bring this to our attention. I expect that there’s much more ofthis sort of stuff where that came from.

The SSCI (Senate Select Committee on Intelligence) has decided to make noises like they may still release the second report on the pre-war intel re Iraq, the one that focused on the use of the intel by our politicians. See this transcript.

Those of you unfamiliar with the SSCI reports there’s this introductory thread Put an End to the Well-Founded Rumors Surrounding GWB Admin’s Use of Intel re Iraq.

However, compare the original ‘terms of reference’ for the second report with the t of r from the MtP transcript:

Original Terms of Reference for the second SSCI report re Iraq intel :

B. the collection of intelligence on Iraq from the end of the Gulf War to the commencement of Operation Iraqi Freedom;

C. whether public statements and reports and testimony regarding Iraq by U.S. Government officials made between the Gulf War period and the commencement of Operation Iraqi Freedom were substantiated by intelligence information;

D. the postwar findings about Iraq’s weapons of mass destruction and weapons programs and links to terrorism and how they compare with prewar assessments;

E. prewar intelligence assessments about postwar Iraq;

F. any intelligence activities relating to Iraq conducted by the Policy Counterterrorism Evaluation Group (PCTEG) and the Office of Special Plans within the Office of the Under Secretary of Defense for Policy; and

G. the use by the Intelligence Community of information provided by the Iraqi National Congress (INC).

Meet the Press 2005-04-10:

SEN. ROBERTS:… There are three[??] phases to phase two. One is to compare the public statements by the administration on all public officials, including the Congress, with the intelligence matrix that we have. …

One is the Office of Special Plans under the Department of Defense. Now, we’ve had a statement basically saying that some of the activities may have been illegal. Everybody down there got a lawyer. …

And finally, there’s the prewar intelligence on the postwar insurgency in Iraq. …

A close reading of the interview will let one notice what was emphasized -that intel estimates were flawed- and what was not -the roles of the Office of Special Plans (OSP), Policy Counter Terrorism Evaluation Group (PCTEG), Iraqi National Congress (INC), et al.

Wish us members of the US electorate luck in being allowed to see the bottom of this.

Too bad Mr Moto hasn’t cared to comment. This thread was inspired by his contention after all.

He’s admitted to lurking in this thread elsewhere on the SDMB, but doesn’t bother to reply.

Things that make you go hmmmmmmmmmm…

I suppose it’s resolved then.
Fair enough.