Tell me about living in Canada

[Declan]

@BaconAndEggs

Specifically British Columbia or Alberta. Tell me about living there. I’ve lived in So. California all my life. Would it be a big shock to me to move there? Is it hard to get citizenship there? Is the weather always cold? Is the economy bad there too, like it is in the United States? Do you do your taxes like people do them in the U.S.? Is life more laid back there? I know English is spoken there (and French), but if I moved there would a Canadian be able to spot me with my Californian accent? Are houses more money than So. California than in Canada? Tell me anything else I left out in here.

We have eight more provinces that you might want to give a look at before settling on British California, suffice it to say that you might get a better chance of scoring a landed imigrant permit by settling in Sask, rather than Ontario for example.

It should not be a shock to move here, but it might seem like your looking at stuff unfocused, it seems weird but you should pick up everything within a couple of months at most , with the way we do things.

Laid back is relative, Toronto is not a laid back city but quite alot of the rest of Ontario is, I cant speak for the other regions so I’ll leave that to those folks.

Now onto weather , hehe

@bashere

Okay, it isn’t that bad, but asking a Canadian about Winter in March is a bad idea. (Watch this - a bunch of other Canadians will now chime in and talk about how Winter here isn’t that bad. They are lying)

The fact is that by March , everyone but snowboarders, skiers, Icefisherman are in winter fatigue. In Ontario its colder in October/November than it is in December because we have just had several months of 70 to 90 degree weather. Once the Christmas season has past , we want the snow gone. Then from January to March/begining of April the weather can be really erratic, I am expecting what is normally an Alberta thing, a chinook in about two weeks, it seems to historically co-inside with the march break, and usually temps will rise to 50 and we pay the piper with our last major storm of the year, about a week later.

Its a Canadian thing that most people will usually bitch more about temps in July/August prefering winter weather to muggy summer temps.

Other than that , you should do fine here.

Declan

[Le_Ministre_de_l_au-dela]

You might find this article from Maclean’s magazine interesting - this was published last year, and addresses some of the common myths about how the two countries stack up.

[mske]

@KSO

So long as you are a U.S. citizen, you are obligated to pay U.S. income taxes, regardless of where you’re living or where the money is earned. There are lots of books for Americans relocating to Canada–check out Amazon.

To clarify - you still have to file a U.S Tax return, but in 99.9% of the time you will not have to pay any additional tax. Tax treaties between Canada and the U.S. essentially mean that you will pay all appropriate federal taxes in Canada to Canada, and report to the U.S. that you did pay taxes to someone.

[Sunspace]

@Le_Ministre_de_l_au-dela

You might find this article from Maclean’s magazine interesting - this was published last year, and addresses some of the common myths about how the two countries stack up.

Interesting. I missed that. I should mention that it was written in June 2008, when gasoline was US $4 per US gallon and the Canadian dollar was worth as much as the US dollar. Now the Canadian dollar is worth 80c US, so all those wage calculations are now off.

[Sunspace]

@Equipoise

A bit of a hijack, but sometimes I get my comedy kicks by reading Free Republic, the place is just comedy gold, and often there are threads about what people plan to do when the godless communist socialists start forcing everyone to give up their money and guns and marry gay feminazis. Often seen in such threads are plans to move to Canada…

It’s like they don’t know that ‘socialist’ is not a dirty word in Canada, or that gay marriage is legal, or that religion does not impact on the political scene the way it does in the States (at least partly because Canada was created as a compromise between two feuding religious groups, so we tried to shove the whole discussion under the rug for a hundred years), or that everyone pays higher taxes to fund single-payer public health insurance (and the guy who introduced it, a (gasp) socialist from Saskatchewan, was voted The Most Important Canadian, beating out a hockey player), or that guns are much more heavily regulated than in the US… essentially, if you want to see what kind of society Obama is aiming for, look north…

[Gorsnak]

@Sunspace

and the guy who introduced it, a (gasp) socialist from Saskatchewan

And real socialism, too, not this namby-pamby wealth redistribution stuff that passes for socialism these days. The Regina Manifesto doesn’t really mince words:

We aim to replace the present capitalist system, with its inherent injustice and inhumanity, by a social order from which the domination and exploitation of one class by another will be eliminated, in which economic planning will supersede unregulated private enterprise and competition, and in which genuine democratic self-government, based upon economic equality will be possible. he present order is marked by glaring inequalities of wealth and opportunity, by chaotic waste and instability; and in an age of plenty it condemns the great mass of the people to poverty and insecurity. Power has become more and more concentrated into the hands of a small irresponsible minority of financiers and industrialists and to their predatory interests the majority are habitually sacrificed. When private profit is the main stimulus to economic effort, our society oscillates between periods of feverish prosperity in which the main benefits go to speculators and profiteers, and of catastrophic depression, in which the common man’s normal state of insecurity and hardship is accentuated. We believe that these evils can be removed only in a planned and socialized economy in which our natural resources and principal means of production and distribution are owned, controlled and operated by the people. (link)

[KSO]

@mske

To clarify - you still have to file a U.S Tax return, but in 99.9% of the time you will not have to pay any additional tax. Tax treaties between Canada and the U.S. essentially mean that you will pay all appropriate federal taxes in Canada to Canada, and report to the U.S. that you did pay taxes to someone.

Yes, that’s an important clarification. My point was simply that not living in the U.S. doesn’t mean you’re off the hook to Uncle Sam as many people assume.

[Sunspace]

@Gorsnak

And real socialism, too, not this namby-pamby wealth redistribution stuff that passes for socialism these days. The Regina Manifesto doesn’t really mince words…

Ah yes. Prairie Socialism.

My grandfather was in it. He moved his wife and young daughter from England to Saskatchewan in 1928 just in time for the Depression to hit. His two other daughters, including my mom, were born on the Prairies at a time when people were literally starving. My grandfather was a quartermaster for the army; he and the mayor of the town were the only people in Weyburn whose families had regular access to meat. Then the war came and they came east to Ontario.

Grampa spent his life working for ‘a fair deal for the working man’. He supported and was a member of the unions. He ran for Parliament back in the fifties. If you google ‘Peterborough Labour Collective’, you used to be able to find a history page with his picture.

One of the great unsung political-social stories of the past fifty years is how the average factory worker, the Joe and Jane Sixpacks, went from political left to political right.

Even in the seventies, when my mom worked with Ed Broadbent for the NDP (a real socialist political party, egad! and direct descent of the crew who put out the Regina Manifesto) in Oshawa-Whitby, that riding was still electing NDPers such as Mr Broadbent on the basis of the votes of the auto-workers at GM. Now it elects Conservatives on the basis of those same voters.

I miss Grampa.

[Equipoise]

@Sunspace

It’s like they don’t know that ‘socialist’ is not a dirty word in Canada, or that gay marriage is legal, or that religion does not impact on the political scene the way it does in the States (at least partly because Canada was created as a compromise between two feuding religious groups, so we tried to shove the whole discussion under the rug for a hundred years), or that everyone pays higher taxes to fund single-payer public health insurance (and the guy who introduced it, a (gasp) socialist from Saskatchewan, was voted The Most Important Canadian, beating out a hockey player), or that guns are much more heavily regulated than in the US… essentially, if you want to see what kind of society Obama is aiming for, look north…

I know! Bizarre, isn’t it? These people rant about Obama’s birth certificate and daydream about liberal blood running in the streets one minute, then think Canada is the land of their dreams another minute. Totally disconnected from reality. If they’d let me post there I’d copy and paste your paragraph whole just for the satisfaction of seeing some heads explode, but they don’t let godless communist socialist leftie liberal 'RAT sympathizers post lest the place get too enlightened. I did read one thread where someone tried to say, quite gently with no details such as what you’ve listed, that Canada probably wouldn’t let political refugees in. I don’t have the response for a cite, I wish I’d kept the URL, but someone else actually said to hell with what Canada wants, if enough conservatives got together, they’d storm the damn borders. I laughed for a couple of hours at that one. Comedy gold, I tell 'ya!

Check out this thread. That’s pretty typical.

[matt_mcl]

By the way, re: citizenship, the difficult thing is to get permanent resident status (a lot of people call it “landed immigrant,” the older term), which lets you stay in the country indefinitely, use government services, enter and exit the country freely (IIRC), and work for whomever you want.

Once you’ve got that, getting citizenship is relatively easy – you just have to live in Canada for four years and pass an easy citizenship knowledge test.

(Did you know that Canada has one of the world’s highest rates of immigrants eventually becoming citizens?)

[Seven]

I moved to Vancouver BC from Portland OR a bit over two years ago. I’m currently in country as a permanent resident and in two years I can apply for citizenship - which I will do.

The process was quite long and cost a fair amount. I haven’t added it all up but at the end of the day, start to finish, I think it was about $2500-3000 each. This includes medicals, filing fees, notary fees, background check fees, work visa fees, permanent resident fees, etc. The entire process took a over a year to get our work visas in line before we moved and we applied for permanent resident status after we were in country - which took about a year and a half to get.

Would it be a big shock to me to move there?

Perhaps. Depends on where you live now and what it is like. Vancouver is quite international. You can walk through a neighbourhood in town and not find someone who speaks English (it has happened to me several times). Personally, I like it.

The one stumbler might be the metric system. I already knew metric measurements (km, m, cm) but temperature got me. Someone said it was going to be 20 degrees and I had no point of reference of what that felt like. Was it cold? Hot? It sure sounded cold. The first week here I changed all my thermometer to Celsius and never converted. It took about a year to get a feel for it.

Is it hard to get citizenship there?

Citizenship? No. I think the only real qualifier for citizenship is being in country for four years. But the first part, being in country for four year under a work visa or as permanent resident can be. It depends on what you do for a living and how easy it is for you to get in. It is all based on a point system. Some Americans don’t have enough points to qualify. Immigration Canada website has a quick online test to count your points. That is a good place to start.

Is the weather always cold?

The weather in Vancouver is much like the weather in Seattle or Portland. That said, we’ve had a bit more snowfall this winter then any other west coast city I’ve lived in.

Last summer I bought my first AC unit because it was too hot to sleep at night. It was quite warm for about a month. Perhaps coming from SoCal you would shrug it off, but I’m a northwest kid and it was too hot for me. (oh yeah, once you cross the border you no longer are in the “northwest” - you’re in the southwest. When people asked where I was from I’d say northwest area mostly and they’d ask me about living in the artic. :))

Is the economy bad there too, like it is in the United States?

There is a lot of talk about it in my town but I have yet to personally see any real problems. I do know several large construction projects are on hold or have been canceled.

Do you do your taxes like people do them in the U.S.?

Yes and no. In the states I did my taxes by hand. Here I use the software because I’m not up on all the ins and outs yet. But it is about the same.

People have said above that Canadian’s pay more in tax then in the states. This is true but there are other expenses you no longer have. Medical being a major one. My wife and I added up what we paid in income tax and medical in the states versus just income tax here. We are taking home more here. Granted we both make more money here than we did in the states (I’m a computer geek and my wife is a nurse) but the percentage of what we keep is higher. Of course we moved from Oregon which has no sales tax to BC which has PST and GST tax… so we might be lower in the long run.

As for US taxes. As stated the US requires all citizens to continue to FILE taxes. If you live and work out of the country 365 days a year and receive no income or benefits from the states, then your tax dept should be zero. You file a regular 1040 and a couple extra worksheets. Myself, I don’t plan on ever returning to the states so I haven’t bothered. My aunt moved here in the 60’s and never bothered either. Recently she inherited some US savings bonds and had to jump through some hoops, but there wasn’t any fine for not filing all those years. The IRS was just a little pissed at her.
Is life more laid back there?

I wouldn’t call it laid back as much as a different outlook on life and what is important.

I know English is spoken there (and French), but if I moved there would a Canadian be able to spot me with my Californian accent?

Yes. Probably.

Regionally, there are different pronunciations for words (NO ONE says a-boot around here). If you call the last letter in the alphabet “zee”, that is a dead giveaway. If you say pra-sus instead of pro-sus for process, that’s a giveaway (but oddly produce, as in veggies, is pronounced pra-duce instead of pro-duce for some reason). There are lots of phrases and things as well that are different - like any town.

I’ve met some French speaking people here (or thick accented French Canadians) but not a ton. They are mostly in Quebec. But there is French and English on everything you buy and any government publication.

Are houses more money than So. California than in Canada?

I can’t say for sure because I don’t know house prices there. The entire process of buying a house is different here. The banks works a little differently and realtors aren’t as much like used car salesmen here. One of the first things we wanted to do after the move was buy a house. We had to wait until our permanent residence went though. We were also limited in how much we could borrow as we only really had two years of credit (it’s a different credit system up here - you pretty much start from scratch). With our limited credit and our wage we were limited to about a half-million dollar mortgage. It was difficult finding something in the greater Vancouver area move-in ready for under $500k. Crappy run-down shacks in Vancouver proper were selling for $450k+. We caught the market at a downswing and after a month of looking found a couple who had been trying to sell their house for almost a year and we fought to get it. We REALLY lucked out.
It’s a great place.

Tell me anything else I left out in here.

Leave the idea that Canada is just a little brother of the US at the border. It’s better if you think of it as England’s little brother.

Get used to people making fun of Americans.

There are a handful of common products you buy at your grocery store that you can’t get here. That one really got to my wife because she cooks so much. She’s at the store looking all over for something and not finding it. She had to figure out the Canadian equivalent. Not a big hurdle, but something you don’t think about.

If you smoke or drink, these things cost a lot more here. BUT, you can get Cuban rum and cigars.

Car insurance and licensing cars is different here and the drivers SUCK. I’ve never seen such bad driving in my life. I don’t know how SoCal is, but this place is nuts. The only way to explain it is imagine being on the road with thousands of drivers who think THEY are the only car on the road. People blow though stop signs, cut you off, make illegal turns and all kinds of crazy stuff. I seen several people come to a stop light, make the free right turn, pull a quick u-turn and take another free right just so they don’t have to wait for the light. I hardly ever see a policeman giving a ticket and I think that’s the reason people drive like there are no traffic laws. If you move here, avoid the town of Richmond for at least a year. Just trust me on that one.

If you move here, don’t pick Surrey as a place to live. Just trust me on that one as well.

The major life-altering thing about moving has been the medical. I’ve always had crappy medical converage in the states and it seemed most time I needed emergency care I was “between” insurance plans. My last emergency visit in the states cost me around $2000 - I had just started a new job and my old insurance had just expired. Even when I had coverage it seemed I always had this on-going medical dept for something or another.

I fell off a ladder two weekends ago and mashed my arm. It was really nice to visit the ER, have a picture taken and not have to worry about how much it was all going to cost and if my insurance was going to argue with me. I showed my Care Card at the door, got treated, walked out (not broken by the way). That was the end of it. In the states I don’t think I would have visited the ER until after stressing about how much money I would be wasting if it wasn’t broken. I’ve actually been injured and bleeding, standing outside the ER in the states contemplating if I should go in. (I really SHOULD have had stitches in one case…).

Last week at work I realized my ear ache was a budding infection and decided to visit a walk-in clinic. I’d never been to this walk-in clinic before. I filled out a short info sheet - name, address, phone, care card number, etc - showed them my Care Card, saw the doctor, got a prescription for antibiotics, had it filled and was back at work in 25 minutes. The prescription cost me a whopping $6. That was my only expense.

It really is a huge weight off ones shoulders to know if you need medical care you can get it and you don’t have to worry about being able to afford it.

Personally, I LOVE it here. My family does as well. We had been wanting to move here for years, then figured out a way, moved, and only regretted we didn’t move earlier.

[BaconAndEggs]

Seven: How is car licensing and car insurance there? Why is it different from the U.S.?

Are there a lot of people moving there just for the healthcare? So you only pay for prescriptions?

So if I wanted to live in Canada…I would move there and then file for a resident visa and then wait 4 yrs. and then I could be a permanent resident? Can people have dual U.S. and Canadian citizenships?

What are the American products that you can’t get there that you miss?

[mske]

@BaconAndEggs

So if I wanted to live in Canada…I would move there and then file for a resident visa and then wait 4 yrs. and then I could be a permanent resident? Can people have dual U.S. and Canadian citizenships?

What are the American products that you can’t get there that you miss?

You need to apply for an immigrant visa before you move there - you can’t show up to the border with all your belongings and say “let me in”. You will not have any sort of legal work status without an immigrant visa. I will not speculate on your chances of qualifying for an immigrant visa as there are (obviously) many factors in each individual case.

In addition to some products being unavailable, be forewarned that many grocery products appear from the box to be the same as what you are used to, but the formulation is totally different. Too many examples to list - soft drinks are made with real sugar in Canada, Kraft Macaroni and Cheese, flour, milk comes in bags (at least in Ontario - that may not be universal in Canada), etc.

[Northern_Piper]

right - it’s after you get the permanent resident permit that you’re entitled to stay and work in Canada indefinitely (work visas are also available, but I believe they’re for a limited time). That application is done from outside Canada, and that’s the hard part - making the case that you should be entitled to immigrate to Canada, have valuable work skills, you’re not a security risk, won’t be an undue burden on the health care system, etc.

Once you’ve got the permanent resident status, you have to wait the four year period before applying for citizenship.

[Spoons]

@BaconAndEggs

What are the American products that you can’t get there that you miss?

My US-born-and-raised wife misses Red Vines. She stocks up every time she visits family back in the US.

[Northern_Piper]

What’s Red Vines?

[mske]

@Northern_Piper

What’s Red Vines?

Twizzlers with a nasty taste and texture. But my wife swears by them also.

[Northern_Piper]

What are Twizzlers? (I don’t get out much. )

[Spoons]

@Northern_Piper

What are Twizzlers? (I don’t get out much. )

Red licorice. Twizzlers are a little chewier than Red Vines, with a slightly different flavour.

[Northern_Piper]

@BaconAndEggs

Seven: How is car licensing and car insurance there? Why is it different from the U.S.?

It varies from province to province, but in some provinces, such as B.C. and Saskatchewan, you get your basic plate insurance from a government insurance Crown corporation, as part of the plates themselves. So if you have valid plates, you also have valid insurance automatically. If you want more than the basic plate insurance, you can go to a private insurance company for a package policy to give you greater coverage than the statutory minimums.

@BaconAndEggs

Are there a lot of people moving there just for the healthcare? So you only pay for prescriptions?

I’ve not heard of a lot moving just for the healthcare - because to immigrate here, you have to show that you won’t be a burden on the healthcare system, and that you have a reliable workplace skill so you won’t be a burden on the welfare system. The healthcare system may be a reason some find it attractive to move to Canada from the U.S., but the immigration process is fairly rigourous.

Medical care is covered by the health care systems - medical meaning medical doctor related. Dentistry, optometry, chiro, physiotherapy and similar related areas are not covered by the provincial plans, but some employers offer them as benefits. Pharmacy is not covered for most people, but again, employers may offer a drug plan as a benefit.

@BaconAndEggs

Can people have dual U.S. and Canadian citizenships?

See this Government of Canada web-site:

Dual Citizenship.

@Citizenship and Immigration Canada

Unlike the law in effect in Canada up to 1977, the current Citizenship Act allows Canadian citizens to acquire a foreign nationality without automatically losing their Canadian citizenship. Since February 15, 1977, a Canadian citizen who acquires another nationality may retain Canadian citizenship, unless he or she voluntarily applies to renounce it and the application is approved by a citizenship judge. The current act thus makes it possible to have two or more citizenships and allegiances at the same time for an indefinite period.

For the situation from the perspective of the US government, see Bricker’s excellent staff report from last month: How Do You Become a Dual Citizen?