Tell Me About Small Claims Court

In My Humble Opinion
1

For those of you who aren’t familiar with the Broomstick Saga, in mid-March an employer stopped paying me. Being patient to a remarkable degree, I didn’t immediately quit but stayed on a bit hoping things could be straightened out. That didn’t happen, and I subsequently got a job doing the same thing but working for someone who does, in fact, pay his employees. Yay.

That still left $1,626.75 still owed to me by my former employer. I think, perhaps, the owners though I would walk away from that. Ha.

After attempts to contact them were fruitless I contacted the Indiana Board of Labor and submitted my side of the story, and they have since decreed that, yup, the former employers DO, in fact, owe me $1,626.75 and gave them until June 24 (Monday, that is, tomorrow as I write this) to issue me a check. A good check, not like that rubber one they gave me last time.

I’m more than a bit doubtful this will happen. Hence, this thread.

TL:DR - I anticipate taking these yahoos to small claims court next.

I’ve never taken anyone to court of any kind. While none of you are my lawyer, and if I feel a need for actual legal advice I’ll go find a lawyer in real life (and yes, I know, you don’t bring a lawyer to small claims), I wouldn’t mind hearing from folks with some experience in these matters. Anecdotes, general advice, whatever. As noted, the state is Indiana, in the US, and the sum is $1,626.75 What should I know?

Oh, and if that’s too grand a sum for small claims where do I go next?

2

Oh, and I’ve already located the applicable website for the Small Claims Court in my county which has their rules and “manual” for us laypeople. Just sayin’

3

Before taking someone to small claims court you should determine whether you’ll be able to collect the money when you get the judgement. Getting the judgement is the easy part. The sheriff can do amazing things for you when you a have a court judgement, but if they don’t have any money you’re SOL. I suggest a trip to your local library to find any helpful books. Ask the librarian to help you. Often, the court clerk can help you with logistics of filing papers. If you have time, drop in on some actual small claims court sessions in your area. Watch a couple episodes of Peoples Court but keep in mind that it is mainly entertainment and only loosely follows reality. Make sure you have all your ducks in a row before you appear in court. Good Luck.

4

I think you already have, in effect, a judgement. Thus SMC wouldn’t help.

You could hire a lawyer to send a demand letter, mine charges $100-$200.

Or hire a collection agency, they will charge up to 50%.

To answer your question in the abstract, your amount is just about right for SMC, they usually handle up to $10K

ianal.:stuck_out_tongue:

5

It was quite a few years ago But I sued my former employeer. When I was laid off they paid me my wages but did not pay any of my vacation pay. I had been there only 8 months and they claimed they did not have to pay me any vacation time.

I got a ruling from then state labor commissioner that because I was laid off and not quit or been fired for cause they owed me 2/3’s of a years vacation. Plus a penility of $100 for not paying me. The employeer refused to pay either. The labor comissioner told me I could either get a lawyer and sue or use small claims court.

I went to small claims court and fillled out the papers, they had peoplethere to help me fill the papers out properly. I had too pay a filling fee and a fee to serve someone at the store.

Always bring all your papers with you to court. answer the judges questions simpely and straight. If he needs more information he will ask.

It started by the judge asking me why I was sueing and what I hd done to collect. And how did I justify the amount that I was suing for. After he asked me a few questions he asked the lawyer for the company uestions. The first uestion was about the amount of money I was asking for, did he agree with my calculations or did he think it should be a different amount. The lawyer began to argue with the judge stating that it should be for no smount. The judge spent about 15 minutes arguing and explaing that he was not asking if theyagree that they owed the amount, but wanted to know if my figures were bogous or not. Finally the lawyer admit the wage amount would have been about right, but did know where the extra $100 came from. the judge asked me and I explained that the labor commissioner said I was entitled to $100 penilaty.

End result the judge ruled that insmall claims court he could not award any penilities but I was due the wages, filling fee, and the serving fee.

The fun part for me. We had to be there at 9:00 AM our case was called at 4:00PM. Witing with me was he store manager, the corp head of personal, and the company labor lawyer. I often wondered just how much did it cost the company to not save paying me any vacation time,

6

I’m not a lawyer, but I sued a lawyer in Small Claims Court, in Indiana, and won!* I have also filed a claim in New Mexico Small Claims Court, which the defendant settled two weeks before the court date.

Actually, in Indiana you can bring a lawyer to Small Claims Court. Cite; Indiana Rules of Court, Small Claims- Rule 8 (C) (1)

The defendant can also bring a lawyer, and if you lose you are responsible for any legal fees they incurred. So make sure you have a good case! The Board of Labor ruling will help a lot.

You can also claim any additional costs you incur in filing the claim. In New Mexico, I couldn’t serve the papers myself, I had to pay the County Sheriff’s office to serve them (I recovered that fee, as well as the filing fee and the original amount I sued for).

Make sure you have everything in writing, and copies to give to the judge.

As Carlarm stated, getting them to pay could be the most difficult part. It is not the job of the court or the police to collect payment, it is up to you to pursue it if they don’t pay up.

Good luck!

*It was 25+ years ago. I sued my landlord for keeping part of my security deposit. I didn’t find out he was a lawyer until after I filed my claim. But the judge agreed with me and I got my money!

7

In re-reading my own cite, it appears that your former employer may be required to bring a lawyer since the amount is over $1500.

Indiana Rules of Court, Small Claims- Rule 8 (C) (2) & (3):

So I would suggest hiring a lawyer since you can recover any legal fees if the ruling is in your favor.

8

The fact that they issued you a bad check shows that they agreed that they owed you the money. But my understanding is that issuing a bad check is a very bad thing and would be more fruitful to follow: http://www.ckfraud.org/penalties.html

9

Nolo Press, publisher of legal self-help books, has a title on the subject: Everybody’s Guide to Small Claims Court.

ETA: I notice on their page, they also have another similar title specific to California. I don’t know if they have volumes for other states. (More ETA: Upon closer reading of the OP, I see that this is far from relevant – unless they have a volume for Indiana too. :slight_smile: )

10

How do you expect to collect?
The Sheriff’s office would be my first line - call and explain that you have the decision of the labor people - is that enough for them to begin action? If not, what do they need.
Probably a Court Order - so yeah, back to Small Claims.
It may be worth a consultation with a real lawyer to see if the employer’s actions have been such that a penalty could be anticipated.
As mentioned, Small Claims don’t do penalty/punitive awards - you would need to go to whatever they are called there - Municipal or Superior or ? -Court to get a punitive award.
A real court would also require a real lawyer or a legal-oriented person to go Pro Se.

Would any likely penalty be enough to pay the lawyer. If the lawyer offers to work on contingency, it means he/she thinks you have a really good case AND COLLECTING it would easy.

Bottom line: the rule is: “Getting a judgement is easy; collecting it is another thing”. If there is no attachable income and no seize able assets, that judgement might make a nice wall decoration.
Don’t spend money for a piece of paper you can’t cash in.

11

I am trying to research that now. My preliminary information is that SCC in Indiana can order wages garnished or liens against property

The Labor Board told me that if no check is forthcoming and/or is written on rubber they will direct me to the appropriate court.

Well, yes, I’ve already been informed that failure to pay by June 24 leaves them open to penalties of 2-3 times what I am owed (potentially). Personally, I’d much rather have a solid check now for the amount owed than go through the hassle of court but if I have to take them before a judge I will. In which case I will not be inclined towards mercy.

SCC is, in fact, a real court. It’s limited in scope but it’s not imaginary.

Losing party pays court costs outside of assessed penalties, it’s an additional penalty.

One of the owners has a day job with at least a $50k/year income. The business is still conducting business and money is still coming in the door. Aside from that, there is machinery and tooling. Also, the owner with another job owns a house, which is definitely an asset.

In other words, there’s money there, it just has to be pried loose.

12

Forgot that we were discusing wages n ot paid - that is an actionable tort known as “Theft of Services”, and IIRC, carries treble damages - that is why they told you the date - up until then, they owe you the money; after that they commit theft of services (the boss being a day late on a check doesn’t get you 3x; being x months late does. X varies by jurisdiction.

A court on which daytime TV is based, which can’t award punitive damages - can they issue bench warrants? Yeah, Small Claims falls a bit short of what I think of when someone says “Court”.
And they probably have fringe on their flags, too

14

You are going to find most these items off limits, things like the personal income and property. You are going to sue the company, not the owners personally. You can only go after business assets, not personal assets. We have laws that actually protect company owners from these types of things depending on how the business is set up, an LLC, 501(c) corp., etc.

Do check out the NOLO site and get the book for your state.

15

It’s not a corporation. It’s either a sole proprietorship or a partnership, and I have reason to believe neither of the two principals have taken steps to protect their personal assets from business debt. One of the two (who may or may not be a legal owner, and I personally think has been played by the other party) has very little in the way of assets, the other has, as I said, another job and house.

These two are not very good business people. They do not employ an accountant, they take their legal stuff regarding the business from the internet rather than paying a lawyer, and they are not as savvy as they think they are. While I may be wrong on the exact legal structure here there is definitely a possibility their personal assets are on the table.

Even if not, they do have an on-going business which does have assets that could either be taken or sold off to pay a debt. I realize that people do not want me to become over confident, and as I noted I will consult an actual lawyer in real life should that become an appropriate action, but this is not a sophisticated and well-run company I am confronting.

16

Just a thought, and it costs little.

I would write to them (snail mail - recorded) stating that they have missed the deadline and if they don’t pay up in [say] seven days, you will go to court. Make it look as formal as you can.

If they pay up - great. If not then it gives you one more stick to beat them with - ie you have bent over backwards to give them every chance.

17

Legal advice is best suited to IMHO.

Colibri
General Questions Moderator

18

I already did that BEFORE going to the Labor Board. I have already made numerous attempts to contact them, work out a plan for them to pay me over time, etc. If I feel a need to send them another letter it will be one drafted on my behalf by a lawyer.

It is my belief that the owner was somehow convinced I’d just walk away and/or didn’t have the resources or the right to fight her on this. I can’t afford to lose 1/10 of my yearly income and while I’d prefer a quick resolution I do have the patience to see this to the end.

19

I really must protest - I have repeatedly said I am NOT asking for legal advice and I want information about small claims court. Because some posters feel compelled to disregard that I must be regulated to a [del]court[/del] thread of opinion rather than a thread seeking facts? Would it not be better to simply tell those posters not to interject opinions into a thread about facts?

20

Sorry, but if they were going to pay her, they would have. Asking repeatedly does nothing. They owe her. They have no intention of paying until someone makes them. It costs them nothing to play the waiting game to see if she gets tired and frustrated enough to go away.

Deadline is the 24th. She should be paying for a consultation today to make sure she is filing correctly to get the maximum (treble damages, etc) and be first in line to file the paperwork tomorrow.

If they suddenly cough up the money, she can always dismiss the case.

21

If you are less concerned about actually receiving that amount of the money, and more concerned about the “fairness” of the situation, or getting anything out of them, sell the debt to a collection agency. Depending on the finances of the business, the collections could give you as much a 75% of your claim, then go get it themselves. Most likely, you would have to settle for 25-50% of it, but at least you would have it now, and not need to worry about collecting anymore. Your old employers can now be hounded by the collection agency while you go on with your life.

You may lose out on some of the potential amount that they owe you, but if you are feeling like you aren’t going to get it anyway, might as well get what you can.