Partly; it also has roots in the late 19th-century historical and political circumstances surrounding the emergence of Salafism in late 19th-century Egypt, which definitely were influenced by modern western culture. I don’t think it’s really valid to try to claim that any modern ideology literally “predates” the modern world, rather than simply having some historical influences from before the modern world.
I mean, presenting a serious threat to the global political order. Fukuyama is right if you take the long view – we’re not at the “end of history” yet, but you can see it on the horizon. I don’t expect Hindutva, Le Front National, etc., to have much staying power, and anti-vaxxism is but a blip on the screen, no existential threat to any society, no more so than the Hard Greens. Salafism, OTOH, has deeper roots in the affected cultures, and meshes better with their saner dominant paradigms.
Meh, I think it’s unpersuasive to argue for a strict division between “romanticism” and “supernaturalism”. Many Romantics were passionately devoted to pre-Enlightenment ideals of “throne and altar”, and Wahhabism itself is sometimes described as containing a strong strain of “anti-modern romanticism”.
Sure, because India, for example, is a tiny global backwater containing a mere one-sixth of the entire world population.
:dubious: Ooooookayyyy.
Considering that the Hindutva movement is actually older than modern Salafi jihadism and not much younger than Salafism in general, I think the notion that Salafism has “deeper roots” culturally is at best highly debatable.
OK, I can kind of see how you would read my words like that.
Strictly my own viewpoint, but if someone had to live through something horrific, then I can certainly stand to merely look at it. Or read Cartooniverse’s narrative of events, which I have done every year for the past 18 years. Do you view re-reading that narrative every year as “ginning up the fear and hatred”?
Time fuzzes memories. Especially with the amount misinformation spread either unintentionally or deliberately. I re-watch to remind myself of the rawness of what we saw that day, to remember how I felt, not from a standpoint of RAR! REVENGE! but to remember both the horror and the solidarity. I remind myself not only of the emotions but of the facts.
If you don’t know me and you don’t know my posting history (and why should you?) you would be unaware of subsequent statements by me saying things like the going into Iraq was a mistake even before the US did so, and questing why the hunt for bin Laden seemed to be put on a back burner for years, or lamenting how much blood has been spilled since, often for reasons dubious at best, or opposing those who want to re-write history.
Reviewing what happened that day is my way of honoring those who were there. It is what works for me. YMMV.
I came here to post something similar but your post is more eloquent than mine would’ve been.
Excellent post. I dread every September as everyone’s Facebook feed is filled with recreational grief and perpetual victimhood. In the name of 9/11, we invaded an innocent country, killed tens of thousands of innocent people, bankrupted the nation, committed unspeakable acts of torture, and destabilized the entire region. We have defiled the memory of those lost on 9/11 by turning into terrorists ourselves. So fuck your recreational grief that serves no purpose other than perpetuate the hatred that caused the incident in the first place.
Yes - the world must never forget the great atrocity committed on the 11th of September.
Ahhhh, so THAT’S what I’ve been feeling every year since my direct involvement as a First Responder.
Thank you for the clarification.
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Cartooniverse, thank you for everything you did during that horrific time. You put yourself in harm’s way to help others, and you’re certainly entitled to your feelings about that time.
To others in this thread: you’re also entitled to your opinions about that time, and the actions of our government. However…it could have been put in a different thread, so as not to shit on Cartooniverse’s experiences.
Feel free to rag on me all you want - what Cartooniverse did was beyond heroic, and he deserves to have as many threads as he wants to talk about what happened, and how it’s affected him since. What our government did afterwards should be whole other topic.
[The morning of 9/11 my sister decided to get to work a bit later, and went into Century 21 to do a little shopping first. She came out just in time for the first plane hit. We spent over 24 hours believing she was dead (we weren’t sure what floor she worked on). Knowing that so many brave people were putting their lives on the line gave us at least a glimmer of hope that my sister would be OK. I’d like to think that most NY’ers feel as much gratitude and respect for First Responders as I do.]
Kudos to the first responders who did their jobs exceptionally on that day.
But today I feel nowhere near the anger for the terrorists that I do for the cowards who rushed through the Patriot Act and every subsequent degradation of our personal freedoms, as well as the assholes who lied us into 2 unwarranted endless wars.
The terrorist acts on 9/11 were horrendous. But we COULD have recovered from them in a manner that was consistent with purported American values, and which would have created positive longterm results. W, the neocons, the Congressional cowards, and the ignorant revenge seeking Americans harmed the US far more than Bin-Laden and his followers ever did or could have.
What did Saddam have to do with 911?
Nm
Just a moment.
I was living almost next door to LAX. It was genuinely weird.