Fair enough…and you made some excellent points. I definitely have my own biases and blind spots, so I honestly didn’t see it that way, but I can see where you are coming from and can see the merits of that position.
Absolutely nothing has changed. Here you are, portraying policies supported by most Americans as far left, claiming that these are “progressive” demands when in fact they are strongly supported by the overwhelming majority of democratic party politicians.
As for anyone being a traitor - please, don’t be dramatic 
our resident pair of DINOs are certainly not guilty of treason in any kind of legal sense. One could poetically refer to them as “traitors” to the progressive cause, I suppose, but one would be foolish to do so because to be a traitor to a cause you must have once supported that cause.
This - especially considering how it cheapens such accusations against people who come much closer to deserving the label, like politicians who support the 1/6 insurrectionists.
Thanks, I appreciate the conversation! FWIW, while I disagree pretty strenuously with you, it’s a disagreement that’s very different from a disagreement with someone like Ted Cruz, and I wish it was folks like you who formed the bulk of the Republican party. It’s the kind of difference that falls under reasonable opposition, or, to use PJ O’Rourke’s brilliant phrase, you’re “wrong within normal parameters.”
The thing is, we should be able to have a normal conversation and disagree about stuff and still be civil. Also, I don’t always see beyond my own biases on things…I form ideas, sometimes half-baked or sometimes just on the little I read in the headlines…so, rationally explaining why I’m missing something is a really good way to get it through to me. I still might disagree, but I always listen and try and see things from the other side’s perspective. In this case, I really think that you made good points and I can see a bit better why the Progressives are upset by things. I concede that, despite my bias, they seemingly do have a point and this may not (probably is not) all on them. Your point about Biden especially made me think a lot harder about this in the context of an overarching program, while I’d been looking at this as stopping a key part and risking everything to get everything.
The progressives demanded they two bills be tied together because of Republican obstructionism and anti democracy. It was seen that way by the POTUS and most dem voters too. And agreed to by everyone at the time.
It’s being held up by 2 democrats who have loyalty and self dealing issues. They are not moderates, just cloaking themselves in something to get over with.
I don’t get where you are coming from. You still know it can be scuttled but you want to wave it away and say “If they do that that’s a good point but we don’t know that yet”. LOL. I never say that but LOL.
It is a problem talking about parsing liberals from progressives and moderates and assigning blame around and ignoring the national context of anti democracy.
How much antidem trolling has been going on in the last 6 years? As if the Dems job is to save the right to vote against a malicious counterparty or else we all deserve fake democracy?
To remind people: There is a sedition caucus in congress. They are what the R party has become to our peril. So not insignificant. A couple of Dems are in total denial of the danger and refuse to join with their own party facing this problem, and stop thinking of them as well intentioned when they are not. They are even using the rhetoric of the sedition party to justify not voting with their own. No traitors around here. Just seditionists.