It does matter what happens. Truth always matters.
You made an absolute statement about Obama in a press conference. Cough up a cite.
Truth matters, but that’s not the issue at hand when we’re talking about what people believe. THe truth is that Republicans aren’t racist, but more important is that a lot of voters believe they are. Since Republicans feel that Democrats set them up at these types of public events, they are wary. Just as Democrats are wary about Fox News and refused to let Fox News moderate the debates.
Ah, here’s a good cite. even comes with Obama’s excuse:
From Obama’s speech.
Something wrong with telling the truth?
Ryan’s plans for SS, Medicare and other programs is the work of an asshole.
He wants to eliminate the very benefits he once received.
From Wiki.
So once again the old Republican “Fuck you, I got mine.”
(bolding mine)
Here’s the very first sentence from your cite:
Is that your idea of setting someone up at a solemn occasion, a budget speech that mentions a budget proposal from someone they didn’t even know would be in attendance?
I said EVEN on solemn occasions. The budget speech wasn’t an example of a solemn occasion, but it was an example of Republicans feeling like they were set up.
It’s low class to attack people when they are unable to respond and have to just sit there like they are being taken to the woodshed. Heck, our President even does it to the Supreme Court.
If Republicans are wary of Democrats because they’ll believe they’ll be set up (whether it ACTUALLY happens or not), are minorities justified in not voting for Republicans based on just a belief that they are racist?
Then, by all means, give us an example of that having happened.
I cited the Wellstone memorial. We can go round and round about what actually happened, but Republicans felt like they’d gotten burned. And it’s not as if it was just them, Jesse Ventura was disgusted as well.
Three posters cited the account of Al Franken, who was actually at Wellstone’s memorial. (And the cite was from a book, even; we know you find those to be credible.) You replied that it doesn’t matter what actually happened.
Is that your idea of going round and round?
On second though, never mind. First you cited that it happened, then that it didn’t matter if it happened, now you’re repeating that you cited it. You are going round and round.
Because Al Franken, a Democrat, is so much more credible than an independent who was there and walked out.
Help us out here. Are you now saying that it did happen and that does matter?
I’m saying that it’s pointless to go back and forth about it, because for the purposes of this thread it’s only important to understand that Republicans THINK that’s how it was. And it’s not crazy to think so, because a) even reasonable Republicans thought it went overboard, b) Jesse Ventura was sure it went overboard, and c) Democrats apologized.
Now whether objective reality determines whether it actually happened or not is an academic exercise, and one that has no real answer. Democrats admit Lott got booed, just not by a lot of people. I would counter that when you set a memorial up as a political rally, it’s going to fire up some passions even if you didn’t intend to do so. It was inappropriate, and there’s good reason to believe it would happen again. Which is why Republicans made suggestions for the MLK commemoration, which were rejected, and which in turn made no Republican want to do it.
You say it’s pointless to go on about it, and then you go on about it. You seem to want to slip a few more points in under the wire, or to have your cake and eat it, too.
I’ll respond only to this:
Then I’ll say that for purposes of this thread it’s only important to understand that minorities THINK Republicans are racist. And it’s not crazy to think so.
If you disagree with this, go back and read that thing about cake again.
This thread illustrates the problem the Republican party has with black voters in 2013.
“The Democrats are the party of slavery.” This is a slogan designed to appeal to stupid people. Which shows how the slogan makers of the Republican party see black voters.
The Republicans need to stop imaging black voters are stupid and are only voting for the Democrats because they fell for some trick. And all the Republicans need to do is come up with a better trick.
Black voters, like most other voters, are voting for the party they see as better attuned to their interests. They’re looking at the issues and making an intelligent and informed choice of who to vote for.
If the Republican party wants to ever win back black voters it needs to start respecting them and offering them real reasons why it’s in their interest to vote Republican. The Republicans aren’t going to fool black voters with tricks and slogans.
They aren’t trying. Mainly they are treating them with benign neglect. Like whites, they are in demographic decline. Republicans haven’t needed them to win in the past and will need them even less in the future.
:mad: Oh, don’t you dare go there!
:mad: :mad: :mad:
If you want the Straight Dope on Wellstone’s funeral, go to Lies and the Lying Liars Who Tell Them: A Fair and Balanced Look at the Right, by Al Franken (Penguin Group 2003), Chapter 25: “‘This Was Not a Memorial to Paul Wellstone’: A Case Study in Right-Wing Lies”:
The next day the Republican Noise Machine cranked into action. Vin Weber called the event a “complete, total, absolute sham,” and that dishonest and despicable meme was fertilized and sown throughout the media. Kellyanne Fitzpatrick Conway claimed that the audience was instructed by a screen when to cheer and when to jeer, like a game show audience. (Not true – but there was a monitor for closed captioning for the hearing impaired. Would you expect less at a leading liberal’s funeral?) Rush Limbaugh claimed the mourners of one of the most beloved politicians in Minnesota history were a “planted audience” and “bused in the by AFL-CIO.” Neither statement had a shred of truth in it. 20,000 mourners attended – much more than the organizers expected; the stadium was only built to hold 16,000. The booing of Trent Lott was embellished into an orchestrated mass demonstration of anti-Pub hate. Christopher Caldwell wrote in The Weekly Standard that viewers “turned on television to watch a solemn commemoration and found a rally devoted to a politics that was twisted, pagan, childish, inhumane, and even totalitarian beyond their word nightmares.” The liars just kept repeating their damned shameless arrogant lies until they became the common wisdom.
Og damn them all! May their hemorrhoids resist surgery! May their tongues swell and their genitals wither! May the fleas of a thousand camels infest their pubes!
:mad: :mad: :mad:
Sounds like a winning attitude. Combine that with the ramblings of the likes of Steve King, and you’ve got yourself a party of the future.
You know, not only that, but who would come out looking worse if some prominent Republican had been booed at the MLK anniversary? Suppose the Wellstone memorial had happened just as adaher alleges; Trent Lott suffered a few seconds of boos and got a talking point being cited more than 10 years later to try to impeach Democrats and their motives. That folks like Limbaugh repeated the story (whether it’s true or not) means they thought there was something to be gained by making the Democrats look like meanies.
It makes no sense to say that Republicans avoided the MLK anniversary because it would have made Democrats look bad. They would only stay away if their attendance would make Democrats look good, or if they just didn’t think it was important to be there.
There are only two possible ways to interpret these statements.
-
Blacks **should **think that Republicans are racist, since Republicans value perceptions over the truth.
-
Republicans really are racist, because what people believe about them **is **the truth.
You might want to stop arguing. You’re like a quarterback who loses yardage on every play. You’re not merely in your own end zone; you’re a good way toward circumnavigating the globe.
Ooh, clever! Refute an argument that Republicans are the Party of Stupid by pointing out a particular prominent Republican who is stupid.
And if the invitations to the MLK memorial were a trap, it’s only because the Republicans made it so. Why are the Democrats now able to point to the Republicans and say “See, they’re racist”? Because the Republicans decided not to attend. Why were the ideas presented in the speeches mostly liberal ones? Because there were no Republicans there to give speeches. If they had really suspected a trap, then they would have made absolutely certain to be there, to foil the trap.
Santorum reflects the GOP itself, he was almost your nominee. If he isn’t smart, it is because stupid people vote for him and keep him around. Guys like him represent a very vocal percentage of the GOP who hates intellectuals yet have graduated college, or hate science but purport to be scientific. What people say about Santorum is reflected on the Republican voters themselves, except for the frothy anal sex stuff