The Great Ongoing Aviation Thread (general and other)

(Breaking) Private plane crashes in parking lot near Lancaster, PA airport. The pilot had reported a door was open and he needed to return to the airport.

My instructor always shouted (because this was before people commonly wore headphones), ‘FLY THE AIRPLANE!’ The airplane will fly just fine with an open door. But not if you’re trying to shut it instead of flying the aircraft.

An open door is usually a non-issue with traditional car-style doors. The air flow will suck it out and keep it open about 5 inches in the air stream.

I hope it’s nobody I know. SGH is in my area.

This. Same thing for an unlatched window.

As @Magiver says, in a prop plane you’ll find at the speeds in question the door cannot be closed; air loads prevent it. The door also cannot be opened further, making it all but impossible for anything big (like a human) to fall out.

Even in a jet an open cockpit window is not a disaster. If left unlatched at preflight, it’ll slide open sometime during takeoff and the noise will be incredible. But the plane flies fine with a cockpit window open. And the cockpit is fully survivable, and not even all that drafty. Unless you crash the plane fussing with that instead of continuing the takeoff or immediate climbout.


If that’s the story here we can chalk that up to lack of mental preparation and the resulting dumbness in action.

That only happened to me once (in dad’s Skyhawk). Got my attention. I flew the airplane and latched the window.

I never had a door pop open in a helicopter. [Full disclosure: I almost always flew them without doors. :wink: ]

In your typical high-wing Cessna with doors on both sides and windows set into each door you can fly the airplane using just the windows for lateral control. Because of the way they’re hinged at the top, they’re easy to both open and close at cruise speeds.

Both windows open or both closed goes straight. If you open one, that’s equivalent to applying rudder that same way. Left window open = left rudder. You can meander all over the sky steering that way. :grin:

You can also fly using just pitch trim for pitch control. That’s harder and there’s a lot more meandering. I’d sure hate to try to land on an airport using windows & pitch trim. But it’s sure survivable for landing in something like a lake or even dry lake bed that’s big enough that you’re not aiming for a particular touchdown spot, just controlling for level wings and a slow descent until contact.

Only the pilot’s window opened on dad’s 1970 172K.

I did not know that. Most of my experience was 150s/152s with a smidgen of other Cessna singles. Thanks for the correction.

Not really a correction; just a datum. I think later models had opening passenger windows too.

I think the scenario should be in the written exam and demonstrated in flight by an instructor. If you didn’t know it would only pull out a set amount than it puts people in the position of trying to hold it closed with tremendous effort in the fear it will open wide resulting in a bad event. In reality you risk tearing the door handle off trying it.

In my very first flying lesson, I was at the controls for takeoff. About 50 feet off the ground, the right window opened and swung up against the bottom of the wing.

Looking back on it later, I wondered if my instructor did it deliberately. I never took that item on the checklist for granted, ever.

Open windows never bothered me. My first lessons and soloing were in an Aeronca Champ. There was no door (Stan usually had it off, he flew photographers long before drones were active).

& we have another…

AA plane catches fire after emergency landing in Denver; pax evac & standing on a wing

Another 737. Always Boeing. :wink:

Jail, permanent flying ban (hopefully), and job loss. Just wow! Flight attendants, passengers and pilots are probably happy this was before boarding.

At least it wasn’t a MAX.

They got almost all the way to the gate before the fire broke out. It’s neither prohibited nor recommended to shut down a wonky engine promptly after a precautionary landing. But 737s do taxi just fine on either engine and a wise pilot at least considers that decision.

There are engine vibration monitors and a procedure for high vibration readings. Which amount to reduce power on the affected engine until readings drop to within normal range or you get to idle. Even if vibration remains high at idle, leave the engine running unless it’s really shaking the whole airplane. If so, shut it down.

The pix sure look like a fuel-fed fire.

It sounds like it may be another fan damage/oil dump event that put smoke in the cabin.

I wonder if there’s a practical way to filter out the smoke to mitigate how much reaches the cabin.

Unless you read something someplace about smoke inside the cabin, I doubt it.

From what I can see, it looks like a fuel fed fire in the engine or on the ground that caused the people to panic and try to escape the airplane. Thereby putting themselves outside where the danger is, not inside where it’s relatively safe.

Preventing a passenger-initiated panic evacuation when it’s uncalled-for is a genuine problem.

I could have read this wrong. AP 14 Mar 2025

  • Black smoke filled the cabin as people crowded the exit, but Levi had to remain seated because a handicapped woman was between her and the atisle

It could be smoke from open exits or from the PAC system as they taxied. It does look like a fuel leak feeding the fire.

Small plane crash yesterday in NC

https://www.cbs17.com/news/north-carolina-news/north-carolina-plane-crash-kills-2-near-greenville-airport-flight-tracker-shows-path-of-crash/