The Great Ongoing Space Exploration Thread

They plan on flying this month. They had a seemingly successful static fire of the Ship not too long ago, though there are signs that they might do another.

They haven’t paused at all. In fact, they’re moving fairly rapidly given the circumstances. As I think you know, they had a little setback at the “Massey’s” test facility, where they do static fires of the Ship. That blew up real good.

The only other facility remotely capable of handling a static fire for the Ship is the launch pad itself–but that is only designed to hold the Booster, not the Ship. Aside from diameter, the mounting for the two vehicles is completely different.

But somehow they whipped up an adapter in a matter of weeks and have already put it to use. Quite a risk, really, since if the Ship had another failure it would take out their one complete launch mount. But maybe not as bad as it seems as they’re making progress on another mount.

They still aren’t quite ready yet but August seems at least plausible if there are no more RUDs.

If they launch, and the first stage goes well, and then they have another upper-stage fire and loss of attitude control in mid-course, then one of two things: either they’ve completely botched the design or else I swear they ought to start looking for an anti-Musk saboteur somewhere in the engineering team. I’m serious, there are so many people who hate Musk in general and the Starship program in particular, that if anyone like some of the commentators you read online managed to secret themselves into the program…

Perhaps the Great Galactic Ghoul knows something of musk’s future success trajectory unless interfered with early.

GGG: All these worlds are yours. Except Mars. Make no (significant) landings there.

I would day that the first scenario is much more likely but the second is much more pleasing.

Another great has headed to the stars.

I came here to announce the same thing. TIL that he actually went to the moon TWICE, although never landed. I just wish that he could have seen us return to the moon, and say the same thing about Buzz Aldrin…..sort of.

The “sort of” is because I have a feeling that we are not supposed to go back there, and can’t quite define why.

Godspeed, Jim Lovell!

No, the obelisk in Tycho crater is quite welcoming.

It’s the obelisk on Europa which is the party pooper.

Don’t you mean monolith? (Unless it is a tetrahedron after all).

Yes. Yes I do.

Or maybe we don’t deserve to. But still, it does pain me that it looks ever more like none of that generation of Moon Men will get to welcome home the next.

For the record, five out of the 24 people who flew to the moon during the Apollo program remain living (Buzz Aldrin, 95; Fred Haise, 91; David Scott, 93; Charlie Duke, 89; and Harrison Schmitt, 90)

Brian

This isn’t quite on-point since “walked on the moon” is a subset of “orbited the moon” and Lovell was a member of the larger set only, but:

from xkcd: 65 Years.

So, 4 moonwalkers left (Haise didn’t walk on the moon; the other 4 did). According to that chart, they’re just to the right of the shaded zone. I wonder if Randal found a table to use that allowed him to account for the astronauts having been selected from a much more physically fit population.

OTOH, each of them spent a bunch of time in space and the radiation appurtenant thereunto. Either prior to, during, or post-Apollo. Seems like that might be a decent offsetting penalty for their better-than-normal health status.

Heck, it’s pretty clear that simply being US upper middle class college educated white is worth an extra decade or so above the US average and 15-20 above the US non-white low-education poor folks.

The point on the chart that matters is the drop from 5 to 4. The probability centerline has that occurring in 2020. Our cohort is outlasting the predicted average by 5 years. The 95th percentile confidence interval drops to 4 in about 2024, so our cohort is even outlasting the 95%ile confidence line. Suggesting our cohort is much healthier than whatever table he did use. Despite the radiation. Fierce men of fierce constitution indeed.


The only tables I’ve been able to find and use are SSA’s which are all-USians, segregated only by sex. See SSA - Actuarial Life Table if interested.

If anyone has a cite to more sub-grouped tables I’d be interested in those.

List of people who have orbited the moon:

Name Birth Date Death Date Mission(s) Age at death Current age
Frank Borman March 14, 1928 November 7, 2023 Apollo 8 95.7
Jim Lovell March 25, 1928 August 7, 2025 Apollo 8, Apollo 13 97.4
Bill Anders October 17, 1933 June 7, 2024 Apollo 8 90.6
Thomas Stafford September 17, 1930 March 18, 2024 Apollo 10 93.5
John Young September 24, 1930 January 5, 2018 Apollo 10, Apollo 16 87.3
Eugene Cernan March 14, 1934 January 16, 2017 Apollo 10, Apollo 17 82.8
Neil A. Armstrong August 5, 1930 August 25, 2012 Apollo 11 82.1
Michael Collins October 31, 1930 April 28, 2021 Apollo 11 90.5
Buzz Aldrin January 20, 1930 N/A Apollo 11 95.6
Pete Conrad June 2, 1930 July 8, 1999 Apollo 12 69.1
Dick Gordon October 5, 1929 November 6, 2017 Apollo 12 88.1
Alan Bean March 15, 1932 May 26, 2018 Apollo 12 86.2
Jack Swigert August 30, 1931 December 27, 1982 Apollo 13 51.3
Fred Haise November 14, 1933 N/A Apollo 13 91.7
Alan Shepard November 18, 1923 July 21, 1998 Apollo 14 74.7
Stuart Roosa August 16, 1933 December 12, 1994 Apollo 14 61.3
Edgar Mitchell September 17, 1930 February 4, 2016 Apollo 14 85.4
David Scott June 6, 1932 N/A Apollo 15 93.2
Alfred Worden February 7, 1932 March 18, 2020 Apollo 15 88.1
James Irwin March 17, 1930 August 8, 1991 Apollo 15 61.4
Ken Mattingly March 17, 1936 October 31, 2023 Apollo 16 87.6
Charles Duke October 3, 1935 N/A Apollo 16 89.9
Ronald Evans November 10, 1933 April 7, 1990 Apollo 17 56.4
Harrison Schmitt July 3, 1935 N/A Apollo 17 90.1

The remaining cohort is certainly getting up there. According to the linked actuarial table, they all have around 3-4 years left. So the xkcd chart looks reasonably accurate. One of them might last to 2035 but only if we’re lucky.

The astronauts do seem to have somewhat bimodal longevity. Lots of them reached >85; way more than the average US male life expectancy. But a handful died quite early.

Ronald Evans, 56.4: heart attack

James Irwin, 61.4: heart attack

Stuart Roosa, 61.3: pancreatitus

Jack Swiger, 51.3: respiratory failure

I wonder what risk factors they might have shared in a pool of candidates chosen for their health back in their prime.

Quite a few potential astronauts died in plane crashes, as test pilots, and there’s also Apollo 1.

I didn’t know that two other astronauts, besides Lovell, also went to the moon twice. Wow.

And Vulcan finally flies a national security spacecraft:

Not that interesting in the grand scheme of things, but we can finally close out this little chapter:
Imgur

Tentative date is August 24:

Also, they released a report on the Flight 9 and Ship 36 problems:

In short:
The booster was lost because the propellant downcomer failed during descent, caused by heavy loads from the aggressive angle of attack. They don’t explicitly say so, but IMO this wasn’t especially unexpected. They intentionally went for a high angle of attack as a test, and had always planned on ditching in the ocean. They have a better idea now of their structural margin.

The upper stage failed due to damage to the “main fuel tank pressurization system diffuser”. I don’t know exactly what this does, but the failure affected both the reaction control system and the cargo doors. This was clearly not an expected failure, but also seems to be novel.

Ship 36 was lost on the ground due to the COPV failure, as we already knew. They’ve reduced the pressure and improved testing.

Overall, this seems fine. The failures are still new ones, not a repeat of old ones. Obviously I’d like to see them have a total success on the next flight, but clearly they’re still making forward progress with the failures. And the failures wouldn’t even exist if Starship was an ordinary rocket.

Frankly after the latest string of failures Starship seemed to be losing ground. The upper stages need to survive to splashdown before they can even evaluate whether the heat shielding is working. Two years ago I’d have thought they’d be test-landing upper stages back at the launch site by now.