When Ireland was part of the United Kingdom, the monarchy created heredity peerages, just like the peerages in England and Scotland. As far as I know, the Republic stopped this practice. Are there any of the old titles left, and are they recognized by the Republic of Ireland (which I doubt), or by the United Kingdom? Are there any Northern Irish peerages left, and if so, do Northern Irish nobles have the right to sit in the House of Lords?
Here’s an artlce and list of Irish peers
Answering your questions:
Yes, many of the old titles still exist, but there’s nothing attached to them: there hasn’t been an Irish House of Lords since 1801, and the last of the representative Irish peers died in 1961. Those that were (as many were) part of the peerage of England, Great Britain, or the United Kingdom were eligible to set in the House of Lords until 1999, when most peerss lost that right.
Irish peerages continue to exist, being hereditary in nature. Extant Irish Peerages
However, it appears that their right to sit in the House of Lords, even as an elected representative of the Irish peerage, has terminated. (Cite.) (Wikipedia on Representative Peers.)
Now I’m confused, though, because I just found this article, from 1999:
Our 2nd house now is The Senate (Seanad Éireann).
.
There is no peerage or royalty offically recognised in the Republic. Elected Head of State
Two of the better known Irish peerages were those of:
- Henry John Temple, 3rd Viscount Palmerston, the Prime Minister; and
- George Curzon, who was created Baron Curzon of Kedleston in 1898 on his appointment as Viceroy of India. I believe this may have been the last creation of an Irish peerage. The use of the Irish peerage allowed him, during the lifetime of his father, to re-enter the House of Commons if he so desired.
A ‘life peerage’ is just for you. It’s not for your descendents. This is how the slightly-reformed Lords works…people vagely enter our world, and dump us with a big chasnge
Northern Ireland is part of the UK not The Rep. of Ireland.
UK life peers are selected by Government and the Queen and sit in the House of Lords. The position is not inherited it dies with them unlike the hereditary peers who are being removed from the Lords slowly but surely.
Right, I knew that Northern Ireland is part of the UK. My confusion was related to Polycarp’s statement that Irish peers aren’t allowed to sit in the House of Lords anymore, when she seemed to fit the category of being an Irish peer (as opposed to an English or Scottish one).
Maybe part of it is just that I don’t fully understand how the peerage works. I know, and people, including you, have pointed out to me, the difference between hereditary peerages and life peerages, but what’s the point of the nobility now? Why would somebody want to be a noble nowadays, in other words. I understand that in the old days it was fun. You got to go around whomping peasants, and making kings sign the Magna Charta, and being an unelected legislator, and having heroines from Jane Austin books fall in love with you, and all that, but what’s in it nowadays?
An “Irish Peerage” was being created a noble of the Kingdom of Ireland, which was a separate kingdom “owned and operated” by the Kings of England/Great Britain prior to 1800. Apparently the Crown retained the right to create Irish peers after then, because Lord Curzon in 1922 (you were correct about him being the last, according to what I found, Cunctator) was made an Irish peer.
There were English and Scottish peers prior to 1707. At that point, no more peers of England or of Scotland were created, and the new peers created were “of Great Britain.” This was the precedent in 1800 when Ireland was united to the Kingdom of Great Britain to create the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland. Peers created after that date (except, apparently, a few Irish peers) were created peers of the United Kingdom – including some Irishmen and Anglo-Irish. “Irish peer” does not translate to “nobleman who is Irish” but to “nobleman in the peerage of Ireland.” There are Northern Irish people who are peers of the United Kingdom, a completely separate item.
Pretty much the only thing it’s good for nowadays is scoring with American chicks.
Note that some of these families have lots of money and houses and suchlike, but thats only if they actually have that money in their own right. They don’t have the money and property because they are aristocrats, they have money and are also aristocrats.
The 1898 barony granted to Curzon was an Irish title. I think the later marquessate was a UK title. By the time of the marquessate Curzon had already succeeded to his father’s titles and there was no longer any possibility of his being able to sit in the House of Commons - hence there was no need to go via the Irish peerage route.
Ha. Like Jamie Lee Curtis. Married to Lord Baron Haden-Guest or Christopher Guest to us commoners.
Frank Packenham, Earl of Longford (1905-2001), was a campaigner against pornography and for prison reform. Because the Longford peerage was an Irish one it did not entitle him in itself to sit in the Lords. As it happened he had already been given a UK peerage for political services to the Labour Party in the degree of Baron before inheriting it - and when the hereditary peers were excluded in 1999 was promptly given a life peerage in the degree of Baron to let him go on sitting there.
Inheriting a title doesn’t really have any use much any more, besides the social cachet. Some peers never use their titles in daily life. The actor Timothy Bentinck is the 12th Duke of Portland, but you have to do some digging to find it out.
He’s the **Earl ** of Portland, not the Duke. The Dukedom of Portland beame extinct in 1990.
It should also be noted that the 28 Irish representative peers retained their right to sit in the House of Lords at Westminster after 1922 and a number of them continued to exercise that right. The last of them did not die until 1961. But the elections to fill the vacancies ceased to be held, although it remained an issue of some uncertainty as to whether the right to hold such elections had actually been abolished. This article gives the full details.