Motie culture resembles a rather two-dimensional Western-centric view of Japanese culture, IMHO. Is there a common figure the Japanese use to refer to the person who sticks out, goes a different way, changes tradition, makes a mess that makes people rethink their routine, etc.?
Really? Niven and Pournelle described lasers in space as pretty glowing lines?
:: shrugs ::
Obviously lasers are different by 3017.
Paleoconservatism is stupid objectively, therefore it is reasonable, and no “personal failing,” to assume most paleocons are stupid, even the pundits, and experience largely bears that out – I’ve read Pat Buchanan’s Death of the West; no smart guy wrote it. But Pournelle is smart, and that is worth remarking on.
Let’s keep this thread to TMIGE and the cut chapter, please, and not the politics of either author. Thanks.
ROFL! Thanks for demonstrating what I was saying. It’s definitely a personal failing.
Well, I don’t think the deleted scene would have at all detracted from the novel. But perhaps it made sense to cut it, because it is not at all necessary to the main story – the revolt on New Chicago is only a setup for Blaine and the MacArthur being near (by interstellar-distance standards) the Coal Sack when a Motie ship is detected. Of course a coherent novel can also include lots of side-bits not necessary to the main story, but it should not begin with such, at least not in SF, the readers want to get right into the action.
It also provides the background for Horace Bury’s character, which was important to TMIGE, and absolutely vital to the sequel. Besides, his Excellency is one of the most interesting characters in any science fiction novel I’ve ever read.
Everyone let’s keep the political discussion out of here. Start a GD or Pit thread if you want to discuss paleocons and their IQ level.
Ah, yes, the sequel. We have two near-mint hardcover firsts, one bought by each of us just before we met. They live on a shelf together… the shelf of I Can’t Believe I Actually Paid for This Shit, and Don’t Do It Again. Next to Hannibal, State of Fear and Prey.
Interplanetary space isn’t perfectly empty, and the lasers are terawatt or more. (Okay, weaponized lasers might not be in the visible range of the spectrum…)
There are a lot worse problems in the book than a little scattered light!
The sequel, “The Gripping Hand,” quietly ignored the speed-of-light lag in communications: a lot of messages are depicted as being answered right away. This might just be dramatic compression, with the authors sparing the readers repetitions of “Four hours passed, and then the response came.”
This is even worse in the second sequel by Jennifer Pournelle, “Outies,” where interstellar communication is depicted as instant or almost instant, considering that (in the Mote universe) such communication has to go vie messenger spaceships.
That gripe aside, Outies is actually a right fine novel, and adds some remarkable new surprises to the Mote universe. I recommend it.
Of the three books, I was least impressed by “The Gripping Hand” which consisted in large part of a completely pointless chase scene.
What I disliked about The Gripping Hand is that it seemed to suggest that birth control for Moties was a great new idea, even though in the first book the Moties specifically state that they tried birth control and it never worked.
(It could be that I’m misremembering it, considering that the book was so dull that I never felt like reading it again.)
Eh, I liked The Gripping Hand. Certainly not as good as the original, but still a good story most of the time. Of course, I’m just a guy who likes what he likes, not some famous sci fi critic.
Mind if I ask for a “if you liked X, you’ll like this book” comparison?
I have a copy floating around somewhere, but from what I remember the opening of the book started describing someone, essentially (and again IIRC), as one of those renegade mavericks that will just have to be trusted. I put the book on the back burner after that.
Is it worth taking time to get into?
I’ve read the Mote in God’s Eye (and, unfortunately, The Gripping Hand) and also the cut chapter. I personally have never cared for Niven and Pournelle’s space battle scenes or their action scenes in general, so I didn’t have a problem with it being left out. As for the novel itself, it was good but I personally think it lags behind their other works together.
Is it possible that the Empire has developed an ansible, subspace radio or the like since the events of TMIGE, perhaps with some technical limitations, and it just goes unremarked-upon?
Are you asking, is TMIGE worth trying again? Yes, I would say - absolutely. No question. Not a perfect book, and I have some nits I’d pick, but overall it’s a very interesting first-contact story with well-developed alien and future human societies, and some great twists and turns.
It’s been a while since I read it, but I believe the basic communication model is explained in Outies as being the same as in TMIGE: speed of light in-system, and FTL, but dependent on ships, between systems.
I believe Jennifer Pournelle simply ignored this when it was awkward for the pacing of the story, just as Niven and Pournelle seem to have ignored the speed-of-light delay in TGH – but, again, I’d be open to an argument that in the latter case, they were simply abridging a lot of delays for a cleaner presentation.
“What’s up?” Jack asked.
Forty hours later, Bill answered, “Not much. How about you?”
Forty hours and ten minutes later, Jack answered, “Engines are running a bit hot.”
Forty hours and twenty minutes later, Bill answered, “When did you last give them a tune-up?”
N&P might have been presenting these sorts of things as ordinary conversations, to spare the reader the grisly details.
Or they might have gotten lazy and contradicted the laws of physics to let them tell the story the way they wanted. I’m not at all sure.
Jennifer Pournelle, I think, did the latter.
(Shrug. Such nitpicks! All three are well worth reading! Don’t anybody skip 'em on the basis of this kind of complaining!)
(I wave “The Griping Hand!”)