I wanted to get to the end before posting this but this is moving quickly, and here seems like a good spot:
There was an entire squad of cheer leaders on the field still visibly cheering. Why exactly weren’t the police telling them to leave? If there was pressing reason that everyone had to leave asap, why weren’t there cops pushing out the the cheer squad, the random people on the field, or the other side of the stadium where there were still people visibly sitting in the stands? Why the urgent focus on the bands to the apparent exclusion of other groups present?
I just don’t understand those here who so blindly want to follow authority to the point of excusing bad behavior because it’s the police behaving badly. Even to the point of excusing physical assault on an ordinary citizen because he didn’t kiss their butts properly. Those kids don’t need to learn blind obedience.
We are all aware that this isn’t the civil rights era (though as a country we’re moving back to reliving all of that) the reference to that was clearly an analogy. However, allowing the sort of bad policing displayed by these officers is just another step in that direction.
And it’s sort of irrelevant weather you feel, no “sympathy” for the director, or side with the police, their use of force was completely inappropriate to the, “threat.”
Look. I didn’t mean to get involved in a big debate over police actions or if they are right or wrong.
I’m not a debater. I just want everyone safe. Kids, most especially.
I think adults around them should behave in a law abiding manner.
I think the band director, for whatever reason decided to fight back.
I don’t like how young people act nowadays. Maybe I’m getting old or something but it seems they are unruly, bad-mouthed and untrained. Some carry weapons and engage in unlawful activities that endanger the public.
They drive like jerks and treat the other sexes in awful ways.
Some one needs to try and stop this trend. Or we’ll be in an awful mess.
It starts at home.
School carries it on, in optimal situations, which isn’t to say that’s guaranteed.
When that fails we lean on law enforcement to get them. The jails are full to the max. with young adults who have followed this path.
I think one man, a simple band director could have, should have taken the police at their word and complied with the order as soon as stated. Packed his band up and left. For the good of the children. If nothing else.
Bullshit and overly dramatic. As I mentioned upthread, I have a law enforcement background and have worked with law enforcement agencies for more than 30 years.
And this is relevant to the arrest of the bandleader how exactly?
So you are justifying the tasering of a high school bandleader because the cop might have been disrespected during the day? Seriously?
I don’t have an anti-law enforcement sentiment. I’m very much in favor of the laws being enforced. That’s a large part of the reason for my anti-police sentiment.
Unless the criminals are wearing uniforms?
So the band director should have initiated ALICE protocols against the dangerous intruder?
Meanwhile, I’m still puzzled by @Beckdawrek 's view that, after two hours of muscular, armored young men giving each other brain damage, it’s the folks playing songs at each other who pose the risk of violence.
The band director wasn’t the one using lethal weapons. The students were in harm’s way as soon as the assailants showed up. Just giving in to the assailants would not, in any way, have protected the students.
They did. Conducting a band is perfectly legal.
Well, the adults other than the police, at least. Assault with a deadly weapon isn’t legal.
I think you are getting old. That’s been an age-old complaint.
The band director did not “fight back”. He argued. He non-violently resisted arrest. But he didn’t fight. I think that’s a really important distinction. Maybe he shouldn’t have resisted arrest. But that’s not a crime that ought to be punished with tasing, not unless there’s some other risk. Which there wasn’t. He was standing still. Apparetly surrounded by cops. Offering no violence, and no threat of violence.
I have to admit that I live in a different world from a lot of you. I’ve been to a lot of high school football games. Other than the violence of the game itself (which is a rant for another thread) there’s been no violence. Underage kids making out, kids smoking tobacco and weed, sure. Maybe some underage booze. But that’s the level of law-breaking that’s common. The band plays at the end as the spectators file out. It’s muddled, with people greeting each other and standing in the way of foot traffic, but not scary. That’s my world.
So I don’t get the “it’s dangerous, we need those cops!!!” on an emotional level. The games I’ve been to have had cops directing foot traffic, but it could just as well be teachers or janitors or volunteer parents wearing reflective vests and carrying cell phones to communicate in case something comes up.
But okay, I grant that y’all attend games where the spectators get into fights and kids are at risk.
How does the band playing increase those risks?
How do the cops ordering around the band director mitigate those risks? If the band cuts off in the middle of a song, won’t that create some confusion? Does it even get the band off the field faster?
Again, the bands aren’t fighting, they are busy playing their instruments. Isn’t it SAFER if they stay in their clumps and don’t interact with those violent people?
How do the cops escalating to violence possibly help?
I don’t think any of this was about public safety. I think that either the police were cranky because the game ran a little long, or they were cranky because their team lost, and they decided to take it out on the band. And they created a public disturbance and then escalated it to potentially deadly violence.
There is plenty of blame to go around. The band director should have accepted his arrest quietly and let a judge sort it out. But the police were totally out of control and created violence instead of preventing violence.
The band leader’s error is boring and minor and unimportant and would never have made the national news. The police officers’ error is scary and draws attention to the excesses of police. It threatens the legitimacy of police, quite frankly. That’s why it made national news.
This seems to be a recurring question that’s not been directly addressed, so I will address it (against my better judgment). Festive public events are celebrated and marked by music. When the music starts, the event starts, When the music stops, the event is over.
If you’re trying to bring a public space into its intended emptied state, then ongoing music is an obstacle to that, because it sustains the festive atmosphere that makes people feel there’s still an ongoing event worth lingering around for. And there’s the basic mathematical fact that the band itself is composed of 100-300 people who should be packing their things and leaving like everyone else.
Again, this is not a confusing concept, the away team’s band was apparently able to exit the premises with no arrests or tasings involved, which begs the question of why the home team couldn’t seem to manage it.
apparently because the police jumped into the face of the band leader, barking orders he might or might not have heard clearly, instead of doing the normal thing, and tapping him on the shoulder to ask him to wrap up at the end of the song.
You keep repeating this like it’s some big gotcha. It’s not. Lots of reasons have been provided. You’re the only one that can’t see the myriad of reasons why this might be.
That’s been an age-old complaint.
