Western NY Buffalo weather belt baby … with an October birthday, I got my learners permit at the begining of winter.
i had hours upon hours upon hours of fun in huge empty parking lots learning how to start, stop, slide and recover. I learned how to control various sizes of cars from nash metropolitan through 73 chrysler new yorker urban tank in all kinds of winter conditions. I learned to keep a set of chains, a shovel[actually an entrenching tool, it folded up and was more sturdy for its size, and could be used to chop wood or ice=)] a bag of sand and a set of expanded metal traction tracks in the trunk.
I am fully confident in MY ability to drive in nasty conditions, what scares me is all the other assholes on the road who cant be arsed to learn to drive [going by their GOOD weather driving habits … ghu alone knows what goes through their little pea brains when a snowflake hits the ground]
I grew up and learned how to drive in Southern California. I’ve since lived in various places with “winter” but this is the first winter I’ve had a car. I aspire to be a 2A when I get more used to the snow and ice (I don’t think my town allows chains or snow tires and I don’t drive in the country often). For now, I just drive slowly and hope everyone around me sees my California license plates and gives me lots of space.
I’ve spent most of my life in Minnesota, and I still do this. Towards the beginning of each winter, I like to find an empty parking lot, and go put my car into spins, to practice getting out of them. I want a reminder of how this car reacts.
I’m not sure this applies if you have a more modern car with anti-lock brakes. With anti-lock brakes, you might be better off slamming the brakes on, as opposed to squeezing them. Or at least no worse off.
Braking distances with anti-lock brakes, especially in deep snow or gravel, are often longer then without. Anti-lock brakes help you control the car in these conditions, but if you can control the car with otherwise you may stop sooner without. I won’t buy a car without ABS but it has it’s limits.
I’ve slid cars with ABS; it’s not hard to do on very slick roads. At that point good tires and good skills come into play. Actually, both come into play before you skid.
Good driving skills also relate to knowing how much gas to give the car when going up hills, how to never lose momentum without being out of control. One of the biggest problem I see in winter driving is people getting stuck on hills because they panicked at the first sign of slippage and let off the gas. Steady acceleration can be just as important as steady braking.
The other big issue I see is inability to correct oversteer or get out of a skid. ABS can help, but you really need to understand what to do with steering, gas, and brakes.
If I did, I’d go with 2A. I’ve never used chains or snow tires… thought vaguely about getting the latter, but not enough to actually look for any. If I lived anywhere hilly, or where it was actually icy, I’d totally have them both.
I guess I don’t really follow your “I never lose control of the vehicle” bit either. I was doing 120 on the way to work along with random other people, but we all knew that braking had to be planned way in advance, and wouldn’t do that if traffic didn’t permit it. And I’ll admit to trying to break the back end loose just a bit this morning on a 4-lane curve 'cause there wasn’t anyone else behind me and it’s only 50 there.
Also I get to use the handbrake in empty parking lots and doing the U-turn outside my house.
#2 here. Since Im Canadian and learned to drive near the top of alberta where it gets -45f or colder every winter and snow throughout all of the winter i am very comfy with winter driving. (we had 3 months of spring, summer and fall so thats a lot of winter) BUT you do have to slow down way before the intersections and around corners. I dont drive slower on a highway, if you dont touch your brakes you shouldnt get into trouble. Driving on ice is easy, i change lanes like im carving through the air real slow, its the slowing down part thats hard. And as others have noted, 4 wheel or awd does nothing to help you stop. I in Calgary now where and we have to same trouble with people not knowing how to drive in winter. I have no idea what thats all about, we get snow every winter but it seems to catch people by surprise every time…
2 and 3, with the note that (1) I tend to be very cautious, particularly on snow and ice, and (2) under proper conditions I also get out and play in the snow and ice, which aside from being fun, is very good for helping develop a feel for how to handle snow and ice.
I was just trying to describe driving habits as the driver himself might see them, under the assumption that most drivers consider themselves to be competent but everyone else is a lunatic.
Otherwise, you’d see the descriptions go like, “#5. I’m an incompetent schmuck who has never in my lifetime ever seen snow, yet armed with arrogance and ignorance of my own mortality I am fully prepared to steer a two-ton vehicle into oncoming traffic in the hopes that four-wheel-drive and airbags will save me from my own stupidity that I might live to disrupt traffic again next winter.” Somehow I don’t think anybody would pick that option.
I guess I’m #2. I’m still resentful at the 3-series BMWs that try to re-live Pole-Position at 70 MPH through traffic during heavy snow and ice storms on Rt 78 though.
I also must work harder on my empathy when I drive past them 10 minutes later with either 10k in body damage with smoke rising from their hood or hopelessly stuck in a ditch off the shoulder of the slow lane, saying ‘hi’ to the tree-line.
[mantra]“Schadenfreude is wrong. Stop laughing.” deep breath, repeat [/mantra]
I’d say I was a combination of 2a and 3. I drive a Jeep, so I know I won’t have problems driving on an unplowed road, but that doesn’t mean I drive as if there were no snow. I adjust to the conditions by leaving a larger space between me and the car ahead of me. I slow down earlier, take turns slowly, and keep my speed reasonable.
It probably helps that I learned to drive in snow on a rear wheel drive 1986 Chevrolet Caprice that had no ABS, no traction control, or limited slip. Compared to that 4x4 is a piece of cake.
I guess I’m something like a 2A.
I’ve driven in lots of crappy, crappy winter weather (including the tail-end of a blizzard, and some wonderful 6 inch deep snow, completely unplowed, with more coming down at a rate of 2inches an hour). All this snow driving has happened in my little bitty Ford Escort, with regular tires on it. The bonus of driving this car is that the ABS/brakes are… unpredictable in the winter (meaning they occasionally are somewhat reluctant to actually stop the car). I’m good at telling just how fast the road conditions will tolerate, then go a little bit slower than that.
My keys to winter driving are:
-do everything really gently, like you have something very fragile (or sloppy, like a full bucket of water) in the car. Take turns and lane changing nice and easy, give yourself plenty of time to brake, accelerate slowly, etc.
-take how often you usually monitor the cars around you, and then up that amount to “as much as possible while still monitoring your own progress/vehicle”. People drive like complete morons in the winter, and are often completely unready for things such as needing to apply the brakes. Always ALWAYS keep an eye out for ways to escape the cars in front/behind you if they get out of control.
-Headlights are not just for you to see better, they are also very useful for making sure other people see you. This particularly applies in whiteout/near-whiteout conditions. It may be so bright outside you need sunglasses from all the snow, but turning the headlights on will allow the people in front of and behind you to have a better idea of where you are.
I’ve gone off the road a couple times due to unexpected ice at corners I was trying to turn, but have never damaged the car, and was always able to get myself back out. The only time I’ve actually ever gotten the car stuck in snow was trying to get out of a parking spot. The plows had been by several times, and then there was ice over top of the snow drift, which was tall enough that my car got hung up on it. A kind person helped me shove it off, but I’ve harbored a grudge against the parking lot plow crews ever since.
Any advice ya’ll would like to give a Florida girl moving to the Smokey Mountains? I have no freakin’ idea how to drive in snow. This thread has been very informative. Should I mention I’m moving to the top of a mountain?
How the hell do you go down a mountain without using your breaks? What is the best way to learn? Spend weeks in vacant parking lots? Also, I have a minivan with ABS breaks. I’ve caught the hints to have a bag of sand, a shovel, water, coats/gloves/boots in the vehicle all the time.
Bring it to me folks, I’m scared more of the ice/snow driving down the mountain than I am of the bears (mostly).
Auntbeast, the best thing to do is to make sure you have good winter tires (all-seasons don’t cut it) and do everything in slow-mo. Slooow on the gas, slooow on the brake. Also, you may not have noticed, but most automatic vehicles have a 1, 2, and sometimes 3 gear. Use those. In a standard you obviously just gear down.
Don’t slam on your brakes, you’ll slide. Pump them.
Take your car to an empty parking lot and put yourself into a skid/spin. Practice getting out of it (foot off the brake, stear IN TO the direction your skidding).
ETA: Keep both hands on the steering wheel, but don’t white knuckle if you can help it. You’ll be fine!
Less short answer: You avoid going down the mountain if the roads are bad. If you have to go anyway, you use the fiercest dealing-with-snow devices legal in your area, particularly (IME) chains. You practice on littler hills first, ones with nothing especially dangerous at their bases to bump into if you lose control.
Type 2 here, use snow tires on all four corners, take extra time to reach the destination, increase following distance on slippery roads, and also have a snow preparedness kit in the trunk;
backup snow clothing (gloves, hat, ski jacket, ski pants, boots) ice-melter, two window scrapers (one for use, one for backup/loaner), a set of jumper cables, emergency flashlights, a couple folding knives, and three types of fire starting supplies, a magnesium brick, a Swedish Firesteel, and a butane lighter, as well as a winter sleeping bag
in the case of a breakdown or accident, or sliding off the road, I’m somewhat prepared…
Back when I lived there there were no problems, but the town has grown quite a bit since then. I didn’t live all that far from campus, but I was a lot more scared of the drunks during Homecoming Week than people who couldn’t drive in the snow.
The only time the University closed was because of blowing snow, not snow coming down.
Cold and snow are not related, of course. I don’t think it snowed very much in the cold month. It was more a comment on how feeble native Californians are. Last night one of the TV news reporters said “It is so cold (40 degrees) and people are still going shopping!” :rolleyes:
