Thinking about building my own gaming computer. So many questions

The Game Room
121

Yup.

I have put together many mobos on top of the box they came in (probably all of them which are more than a few).

There is always a risk to this stuff but if you are a little careful handling the components and not touching the metal connectors you will probably be fine.

That said: It is possible to ruin components through a static shock. Small chance but a chance just the same (especially in winter where static shocks are more common…at least in the northern hemisphere and northern climes).

And remember…if you use a static bracelet it needs to be connected to something that is grounded.

122

Looks like I did not properly research usb ports and may want to exchange my still-unopened motherboard for a different one. Maybe. Probably not. Either way, as best I can gather, usb ports go like this:

Debut Core Name Was known as Now known as Speed
1995 USB 1.0 USB 1.0
2000 USB 2.0 USB 2.0
2008 USB 3.0 USB 3.1 Gen 1 USB 3.2 Gen 1 5 Gbps
2013 USB 3.1 USB 3.1 Gen 2 USB 3.2 Gen 2 10 Gbps
2019 USB 3.2 USB 3.2 Gen 2x2 20 Gbps

Looking more closely at my system specs…

Fractal Define 7 Compact front ports:
1 x USB 3.1 Gen 2 Type-C
2 x USB 3.0
2 x USB 2.0

MSI Mag Z490 Tomahawk usb headers:
1 x USB 3.2 Gen 1 5Gbps Type-C port
1 x USB 3.2 Gen 1 5Gbps connectors (support additional 2 USB 3.2 Gen 1 5Gbps ports)
2 x USB 2.0 connectors (support additional 4 USB 2.0 ports)

For the type c, unfortunately it looks like while the case can handle 10 Gbps, the motherboard can only handle 5 Gbps. That’s kind of a bummer. Not the end of the world, but a clear research failure. (I wish Newegg let you filter motherboards by usb headers.)

For the two 3.0 ports, looks like both the case and the motherboard match at 5 Gbps. Obviously 10 Gbps 3.1 ports would be better, but at least they match. 5 Gbps is still pretty peppy, close to 6 Gbps sata iii ssd speeds.

I’m actually excited for the two 2.0 ports: One for the wireless keyboard+mouse dongle, and one for my sandisk mp3 player, which is only usb 2.0 and I’m constantly loading audiobooks onto it. It will make me happy to have an actual 2.0 port to plug it into.

There were a lot of things I liked about the motherboard’s features and customer reviews. I think I like those other things enough that I can live with the 5 Gbps front ports. That kind of feels representative of a 2020 machine anyway. If I were doing this in 2023, based on the trend toward fewer front ports, it’d probably just be two: one each type a and type c, both 10 Gbps. Getting lots of ports but they max out at 5 Gbps seems just about right for this machine.

Anyway, thanks to the snowstorm the case still hasn’t arrived. It got to a neighboring town around 7am this morning, then went out for delivery around 9am but never ended up getting delivered. Hopefully tomorrow.

EDIT: While getting those specs I noticed the Newegg listing for the case shows “Out of Stock.” Here’s hoping the case doesn’t arrive damaged or defective in some way, as it doesn’t appear I will be able to exchange it. Still available on amazon but for $30 more.

123

PCPartPicker does let you filter motherboards by header, but when I filter it to have at least one Gen 2 header, the top choice is my actual motherboard, the one Newegg says only has Gen 1 headers. The MSI official site agrees with Newegg. It’s possible this error on PCPartPicker is why I chose this motherboard in the first place. Ah well, close enough.

I see a discussion thread about a different msi motherboard where PCPartPicker incorrectly lists a Gen 2 type c header when it only has a Gen 1 header, so it’s not just mine. Interesting.

It looks like I could have gone with the msi B460 and been just fine, saving around $50. I think I’m happy I have the Z490. Leaves the door open to maybe in a few years I can grab an i7 700K for a couple hundred bucks and just pop it in.

124

I have yet to find anything that comes close to saturating a USB-C 5Gbps connection.

You have gobs of bandwidth but it will still be the USB stick or memory card severely limiting throughput.

It is nice to know it is there and maybe it is future-proof which is not a bad thing but my dreams of downloading video from memory cards at blinding speeds still has not happened. I see specs for some memory cards that might take advantage of those speeds but I have never seen one in real life (maybe someone else has).

125

That’s good to hear, thanks much.

I’m thinking of (eventually) upgrading my external HDD backup drive with an internal 2.5" SSD in an enclosure. Theoretically, the 5 Gbps limit of the Gen 1 ports should let it perform competitively with my internal SSD D: drive, which of course has the 6 Gbps limit of sata iii.

Slapping an internal SSD drive into a $9 enclosure is a nice way to save money on a speedy backup unit, but hard drives in general are still a bit too pricey right at this moment. Something I’m definitely keeping in mind though.

Would my actual d drive (Samsung 860 Evo 2.5") be a reliable enough backup drive, do you think? If I bought a second one and popped it in an enclosure, I mean.

Are internal 2.5 SSD drives reliable enough in general to use for backup purposes? It kind of feels like a flash drive, which is widely regard as not reliable enough. But if they are, cheaper ones than Samsung can be had for around a hundred bucks for two terabytes. That would be fantastic.

126

As with so many things…it depends.

Are they reliable? Yes. Very reliable.

But things can go wrong. Same as anything else. PC could be stolen. Fire or natural disaster and so on. Or shit just goes bad for no apparent reason (not common but happens).

I have had my Samsung 840 running for several years with no problem. I use Samsung Magician and have TRIM automated and I have also over provisioned it (the drive sets aside some space…10% in my case…to use when other parts go bad which absolutely happens on SSDs).

When it comes to backups ask yourself what if the worst happens (you lose it all) and how bad that will be? It will inform your decision on what lengths you need to go to if you want to ensure you don’t lose stuff.

It is a question of effort and (usually) money. The more reliable and secure you want your backups the more money and effort you will expend making sure you have them. If you are a bank you need to be super-duper careful with that reliability. If you are grandpa with a few pics of his grandkids…not so much.

The best backup solutions these days tend to be to a cloud service like Amazon. Depends on how much stuff you have (which also goes to internet bandwidth…upload in most homes is super slow) and how quickly you would like access to those backups and it comes with a monthly fee.

Or use an SSD. Or build your own RAID. Many options and the best choice goes back to money and effort you want to spend depending on how secure you want your stuff to be.

127

You’re probably okay with the 3.0 USB actually. There’s not many USB products which would exceed that bandwidth. Maybe a 10G Ethernet adapter? Getting 10G on a desktop is much easier, you just install a new NIC.

128

Connected everything, turned it on, failed to POST. The monitor doesn’t respond to the computer at all. I verified that the HDMI cable works.

The computer appears to turn on. All the fans spin, albeit slowly. The motherboard debug LEDs initially showed no boot device, but after turning it off, plugging in my Windows flash drive and turning it back on it no longer shows any error. It has 4 error LEDs total: for RAM, video, CPU and boot device.

I see on Tom’s hardware that some HDMI connections won’t work until you install drivers. Unfortunately I don’t think I have a DVI cable so I guess I’m headed to Walmart to buy one unless anyone has another suggestion.

129

Actually, I do have a DVI cable but there’s nowhere to plug it into the io plate. The two choices are HDMI and something called “display port”, which looks very similar to the HDMI connector.

If I need drivers to connect via HDMI, and the motherboard only offers hdmi, do I take the whole computer to a repair shop?

I’m at a bit of a loss at the moment.

130

Ha! Nevermind, I’m an idiot. The old computer used a DVI cable, so the monitor was set to DVI input. It was remarkably difficult to change the monitor’s input, but once I switched it to HDMI everything worked great. Windows installing now on the super fast 3.0 USB drive. Everything seems automatic so far.

Yay!

131

Man, it’s not as though USB installations or SSDs are new at this point but each time I install Windows these days, I am amazed at how fast it is compared to the old days (optical media to HDD) where a new Windows install was a “Guess this is what I’m doing tonight” affair.

Glad to hear it POSTed and you got it running. Don’t forget that XMP setting!

132

I’m so happy I can’t wipe the grin off my face. Without any side panels, just open air, I could not hear the fans turning. Granted they weren’t turning fast but still. No demonic noise detected.

My big hurdle now is researching how to move the entire user folder tree over to the d drive like it is on my old system. I think I used sysprep last time; not looking forward to this at all, but I very much want my AppData folder on the d drive.

Can you manually move AppData (roaming) like you can Documents, Pictures and Videos? I would much rather do it an officially supported way if I can.

133

HDMI when it first came out was graphically identical to DVI, but it came with added audio channels in the cable, including an audio return channel. It is a licensed standard that was created by display and TV manufacturers. Display Port is an open source standard that was created by chip manufacturers. It also was the only way to get GSync/FreeSync support for monitors, since HDMI didn’t support those technologies.

Here’s an article with more info on the difference: https://www.barco.com/en/news/2018-11-20-what-is-the-difference-between-displayport-and-hdmi

134

Everything I’ve done with this computer build and set up so far has been excruciatingly slow; full of trepidation and confusion. But each time I end up finishing the task at hand with newfound knowledge and the confidence that brings. It’s really quite rewarding.

Case in point, the fan curve settings in the BIOS. I was totally confused until finally it clicked, and then I was able to tinker to my heart’s content. Here’s what I settled on:

Up to 32c: 0% (off)
32c to 55c: 120mm = 35%, 140mm = 45%
55c to 70c: 70%
Over 70c: 100%

All four fans (3 case, 1 CPU) are set to the same curve as detailed above. As far as I can tell, the fan that came with the dark rock slim is exactly the same 120mm silent wings 3 as the regular case fan I bought, which isn’t even the high-speed version. Works for me.

Idle temp is high 30s to low 40s, which is warm but not bad. Specifically, CPU and CPU socket are both 36c, while System is 42c.

I have the CPU fan based on CPU of course, but then the three case fans are based on System. The idea being, if the CPU runs hot for a while, the case heats up triggering the case fans. But when the CPU load is lifted, the residual heat is still in the case so the case fans keep running high until the excess heat is dissipated.

Something I didn’t know beforehand is that PWM fans have a minimum speed below which they stall out. Thankfully I bought only regular speed fans. I would have been pissed with high-speed fans that stalled out below like 700 RPM or something ridiculous.

The 140s stall out at 40%, but seem to work reliably when set to 45%, at which they only spin at 35% in practice. The 120s worked reliably at 35%, which was my first choice so I didn’t check lower. This puts all the fans at idle in the 300s for RPMs. I can’t hear them at all, and they’ll stay that way until the CPU or System gets above 55°. We’ll see how that cut-off works in practice, but for now I’m happy with the theory.

I couldn’t figure out how to delete a “dot” on the fan curve graph so I just set all the first dots to the bottom left to be ignored. Effectively making all of the curves start with “up to 55°…”

Oddly, the default fan curve for the CPU cooler fan was 13% up to 40°, and of course since my CPU was in the mid-30s the CPU fan never came on until I adjusted the fan curve. Weird.

135

I built a new build PC last march, needed one to work from home for my company, and a few things I found:

A samsung M2 970 EVO Plus SSD had a read/write rate of about 1150 GB/second.
A crucial SATA 2.5" SSD was read/writing around 450MB/second
A samsung SATA 2.5" EVO SSD was about 550MB/second

(all 1TB, crucial one is a couple of years old)

So it really does make a difference when dealing with 100GBs files copied around. It hasn’t really been noticable when playing a game.

I went for 32GB for my work, but the extra ram is useful running up a spare VM to do other things, like some linux VMs.

Also I went for an Nvidia GTX 1660 Super as a graphics card, mainly because I don’t think Ray Tracing will make much impacts in games for the forseeable future, and also I’m sticking with 1920x1080p monitor and the higher ends seemed to be aiming at the 4K market. So this was enough for me. Not seen any drop in performance, running all the games I want at full settings now, Metro Exodus, Borderlands 3, Doom Eternal, AC Odyssey, Far Cry New Dawn, RDR 2, nothing has seen any need for settings changes.

Probably too late for this to make much difference though…

136

Playing Red Dead Online, I’m at about 13.5GB between the game, Firefox, Discord and a couple background programs like Steam and Afterburner. So I think having 16GB is a minimum and 32GB is a good place to be these days.

Speaking of (sorta), I recently bought an EVGA Z10 keyboard to replace my ancient Logitech G15 which was 14+ years old. I really liked having the LCD display on the G15 for my system info and so the screen on the Z10 was a big draw. The keyboard itself is a solid and impressive piece of hardware and is only $41 from Amazon right now (for the non-RGB, brown switch version) because EVGA has discontinued the Z10 and has a Z15 & Z20 on the horizon.

In a way, the screen is a disappointment because EVGA half-assed their commitment to the idea and never opened the API for other companies to code their own applications to it like Logitech did with the G15/G19 boards. So there’s not a ton you can do with it and no displays for hit points and ammo in games or that sort of thing. And the actual EVGA software for it kind of sucks. Buuuut you can display AIDA64 on it which is what I actually wanted: Mine is set up to display CPU clock speed, core temp and utilization, GPU frame rate, temp and utilization, RAM usage and VRAM usage. Nice to have it all at a glance and without a screen overlay.

For a name brand and quality built full-size mechanical gaming keyboard, it’s a nice buy for only forty bucks. Even better if you’re going to use the display like I am.

137

COOL! My Orion Spark recently gave up the ghost, and I’m looking for a backlit Brown-switch keyboard. The EVGA z10 looks interesting. I’ve been using my old g15, which I’d used scripts to display time, day, date, UL/DL speed, free space on my drives, etc.

So, the EVGA z10 doesn’t have a scripting language? With my Spark, i was running ARX on my old cellphone to display CPU core speeds, GPU speeds and temp, etc. I was always disappointed that ARX didn’t have scripting like the g15 display did.

138

Don’t think so. I think EVGA said they were going to open it up and then just never did. No idea why but the Z15 and Z20 don’t have displays so I guess they just shrugged off the whole concept. I wouldn’t get too invested in the display unless you intend to run AIDA64 on it. Like I said, EVGA also has their own software for it but it’s not well regarded and I haven’t used it for anything past the initial setup. That said, I think most of what you listed can be displayed through AIDA64.

139

If I can ever get ARX to work again, I’ll just use that. I used it for over a year, then it stopped working for no apparent reason. If Logitech put half the effort into their software that they did their hardware. . . actually, to all appearances, that’s exactly what they do.

The z10 has a worrying amount of bad reviews on Amazon that state it starts working erratically, or stops entirely. Pity, it looked about perfect for my needs. I’d just stick with my 15-year-old G15, but the keyboard backlight is so dim, the monitor light makes it hard to read the keycaps in the dark.

140

Most of the negative reviews seem to be about the software which is admittedly pretty bad. I’m not using the software though so I’m not worried. A couple about the physical product but not a worrying amount (in my opinion) and a few weirdo one-offs like whining about no RGB. Not trying to talk you into it, of course, was just my evaluation since I read the Amazon reviews and product reviews elsewhere before buying. Always the chance that I’m being optimistic because I’m just happy to have found a replacement keyboard with a display :wink: