This is the last chance Republicans will ever get

[adaher]

@foolsguinea

It’s not? Blue-collar workers get retrained and take new jobs all the time, where I’m from. You seem to be taking a quasi-Marxist line, where every man has a sinecure. Well, you’re not just fighting Clinton Democrats, but Reagan Republicans, then.

The federal government has been trying to renew Appalachia since LBJ. Every attempt has been a miserable failure. I don’t think anyone is entitled to their jobs, but they are entitled to have a say on where government puts its finger on the scales. When the government decided it wanted to phase out fossil fuels and the dirtier types of manufacturing, that put a lot of labor union workers into the R column. I’m not sure why Democrats didn’t expect that. Did they really think that promising to “take care of them” was going to be preferable to honest work?

[foolsguinea]

“Honest work”? Mining has always been the “robber industry.”

If it comes down to Appalachian jobs or Floridian land, I’ll keep the land, obviously.

[adaher]

I happen to agree with the climate change forces on this one, but they get a vote and they’ve been winning lately.

That doesn’t mean we need to give up on fighting climate change, but it does mean that trying to phase out fossil fuels through regulatory policy needs to end. If we’re serious, then we will all sacrifice, not expect the workers to be the ones to bear the brunt of the fight like we’re doing now. An increase in gas taxes and additional taxes on electricity usage will spread the burden more fairly while achieving a similar result.

[JRDelirious]

@Fuzzy_wuzzy

I disagree that this will be the final chance Republicans get. I believe that within a decade, as baby-boomers retire, and entitlement spending balloons, there will be a reset in US politics. **This reset is as likely to destroy the Democrats as the Republicans. Anyone confidently predicting the fortunes of either party are wrong imo. **The only prediction that can be made with any confidence is that both parties will probably face an existential crisis. It’s a crisis both parties may well indeed overcome but neither party will be quite the same afterwards.

(emphasis added) Right. The permanent collapse of one party or the other, or the emergence of a natural majority along an already defined political alignment have been announced repeatedly for a LONG time and never arrive.

The two-party alternancy is deeply ingrained in the American body politic, including by design in our mostly first-past-the-post single-member direct-election posts – if anything, just as happened with Trump in the presidency now, a succesful new movement that may arise could more simply* take over either of the extant parties in name*, and reshape it to a new reality.

[elucidator]

Already has. The new Republican Party is the unity of the working class and business/money in nationalist solidarity. Not really a new idea, emerged some time ago in Italy, as I understand it. The shining citadel on the hill.

[Bridget_Burke]

@adaher

I happen to agree with the climate change forces on this one, but they get a vote and they’ve been winning lately.

That doesn’t mean we need to give up on fighting climate change, but it does mean that trying to phase out fossil fuels through regulatory policy needs to end. If we’re serious, then we will all sacrifice, not expect the workers to be the ones to bear the brunt of the fight like we’re doing now. An increase in gas taxes and additional taxes on electricity usage will spread the burden more fairly while achieving a similar result.

The market is what hurts energy workers–but the tycoons who might see some of their stocks drop but don’t lose their jobs like to blame “regulatory policy.” Plentiful oil isn’t doing Houston’s economy much good–at least we’re more diversified than in the last bad patch. So some jobs are gone for now–but the very rich remain very rich. The coal jobs went because natural gas is cheap–not because of those treehuggers.

Let’s see the top 1% “sacrifice.”

[Try2B_Comprehensive]

@JRDelirious

a succesful new movement that may arise could more simply* take over either of the extant parties in name*, and reshape it to a new reality.

This. Trump adviser tells House Republicans: You’re no longer Reagan’s party:

Donald Trump’s economic adviser Stephen Moore told a group of top Republicans last week that they now belong to a fundamentally different political party.

he told them they should no longer think of themselves as belonging to the conservative party of Ronald Reagan.

They now belong to Trump’s populist working-class party, he said.

We have to wait and see how things play out of course, but it looks like the GOP has been taken over by something new. I heard a radio commentator compare “no longer Reagan’s party” to the Pope saying, “Jesus, shmesus.” If you believe that guy, the change is radical.

[adaher]

@Bridget_Burke

The market is what hurts energy workers–but the tycoons who might see some of their stocks drop but don’t lose their jobs like to blame “regulatory policy.” Plentiful oil isn’t doing Houston’s economy much good–at least we’re more diversified than in the last bad patch. So some jobs are gone for now–but the very rich remain very rich. The coal jobs went because natural gas is cheap–not because of those treehuggers.

Let’s see the top 1% “sacrifice.”

By the very nature of climate change, there aren’t many ways to do that other than to make the Kennedys tolerate a wind farm in their view. Climate change at its core is about scarcity, and that’s never a problem for the rich. Current Obama administration policies force energy workers to disproportionately bear the burden. Energy consumers aren’t wiling to pay so much as $10/month more, so coal and oil workers must lose their jobs. Democracy! Except this time the coal and oil workers got a win. So energy taxes going up are the only path forward. Which is fine, because it’s fairer.

[irae]

@adaher

A party that doesn’t offend everyone in sight, doesn’t have scandals, and presides over decent job growth need never fear being turned out of office.

I have a quibble…

[adaher]

Only if you haven’t been paying attention. Obama himself didn’t have scandals, but the government experienced quite a few under his watch. The fact that voters didn’t hold him responsible for them for the most part(he did experience a decline in approval), may have saved Obama himself, but probably damaged the pro-government brand immensely and contributed to Americans’ desire for change.

[BobLibDem]

@adaher

YOu also have to wonder what Obama’s agenda was that he felt the need to make sure religious employers were complicit in abortion. It was completely unnecessary, yet he fought hard to make it happen.

Please explain this one. Those that hate abortion also don’t want to make contraception easily available. The Hobby Lobby suit should have been laughed out of court- corporations do not and can not have religious beliefs. End of story. The whiny bitchy nuns saying that filling out a piece of paper directed others to sin should have earned them nothing but well deserved ridicule. So what religious employers were made to be complicit in abortion?