Thoughts on the 2004 election

Some thoughts on the 2004 election:
[ul]
[li] 65,000 voters in Ohio could have overturned the will of 3.5 million Americans. That would have been an interesting challenge to the EC system.[/li]
Disregarding who the two candidates were, I would have loved for someone with a 3.5 million lead in the popular vote to lose the EC, because it would have created a huge outcry against the EC. Of particular interest is what the Republicans would have said if this had happened to them.
[li] “Why Bush won” and “Why the Democrats lost” discussions:[/li]
They are pretty useless because:

  • The states went basically the same way they did in 2000, so Bush did not magically convince states to switch en masse. This is true even at the county level.

All he did was convince more of his supporters to show up to vote.

Hardly an accomplishment that needs a detailed explanation, or that needs an explanation of the failure of Kerry. It seems that people are quite set in their ways and vote for “their side” no matter who the candidate is.

  • Also, 65,000 voters in OH could have changed this election, and so all the arguments about “this is why Bush won” are useless, because if these 65,000 people (a tiny fraction of the population) voted differently, people would be giving grand theories trying to explain “this is why Kerry won”.
    [li] Without 100% voter turnout, it’s hard to say whether the country “has become more conservative” and that “liberals are out of touch with the mainstream”, or simply whether more conservatives came out to vote that day.[/li][li] Some people said that they didn’t vote for Kerry because of how shrill and whining a lot of his fans were and because of how his fans consider Bush-supporters to be stupid: Come on! [/li]
    These people weren’t going to vote for Kerry anyway, so this is just mock horror at the “elitist” attitude.

In any case, in many Republican-leaning websites and other media there is open utter contempt of liberals (considering them stupid, deluded, traitors, “drink too much Kool Aid”, etc), so why aren’t people turned off by this, and are only turned off by some liberals’ contempt for Bush supporters?
[li] Long poll lines and polls in danger of closing before everyone gets to vote:[/li]
WTF? Couldn’t they have planned better to be able to serve all voters before closing time? (Since everyone expected a “record turnout”)

Are the election officials incompetent? Or, worse, was this done on purpose?

This is not the first presidential election they have organized (more like the 54th one), so you’d think they would have gotten the hang of it by now, and have learned to plan ahead.

In any case, there should be a law that clearly states what happens when people don’t get to vote before the polls close. Why should there be a need for judges to decide this on a case by case basis on election night?

[/ul]

Some minor points:
[ul]
[li] Each county in Ohio has its own method of verifying and counting provisional ballots: [/li] WTF? Why doesn’t Ohio have a state-wide rule?

[li] The “four more years” chanting at Republican rallies was waaay too Orwellian.[/li]
[li] In his acceptance speech, when Bush was thanking various people, when it came time to thank Rove, he paused, put a big smirk on his face and referred to Rove as “the architect”.[/li] I’m curious exactly which part of the Republican’s strategy was Rove’s brainchild.
[/ul]

I guess I didn’t frame this in terms of a debate. So, here goes:

  • If 65,000 voters in Ohio overturned the will of 3.5 million Americans, would that have created a huge outcry against the EC system?

  • Are “Why Kerry lost” arguments useless because the results are identical to the 2000 results (and because the election was so close [65,000 voters])?

  • Without 100% voter turnout can anyone really claim that the country “has become more conservative”?

  • Why do people claim to be turned off by the “elitist” attitude of liberals, when many conservatives exhibit utter contempt for liberals and their ideology?

  • Was anyone else freaked out by the groupthink “four more years” chanting at Republican rallies?

  • Exactly which part of the Republican’s strategy was Rove’s brainchild?

Or, maybe I should have named this thread “Bush is Hitler” to get more replies :slight_smile:

Since you need some attention… :slight_smile:

I agree with your idea that much hasn’t changed… just more bibles showed up for the election. Especially as regards with the idea that the left loses voters due to “arrogance” or whatever.

Now considering all that Bush did (Iraq war, deficit, no WMD, etc…) and still things barely changed… should be a major dissapointment. If voters can’t care about what Bush did… well then what would make them change their minds ?! What is necessary for 18-25 year olds to get out of bed and vote ? This election shouldn’t have been “just another” election.

False. Michael Moore did more to convince me to vote Bush than Bush ever did.

So if it wasn’t for Moore, you would have voted for Kerry?

Michael Moore wasn’t running. Why did you let his histrionics affect your decision? Are you really comfortable with Michael Moore making you vote Bush, rather than your own analysis?

The same chant was made in 1996 at Democrat rallies. What’s your point?

What about the increase in GOP seats in the House and Senate?

What *about * the increase in GOP seats?
According to the results at CNN, for the Senate, the Republicans got 37,850,613 votes, while Democrats got 41,253,684 votes.

So, the Democrats got more votes from the American public. Why is this an indication that the country is becoming more conservative, or that the liberals are “out of touch” with America?

Of course, the Republicans gained 4 seats while the Democrats lost 4 seats, but this is an artifact of the population distribution into the various states, and also due to the fact that the Republicans had 36 seats not up for re-election, while the Democrats had only 29 seats not up for re-election.

In any case, even if the gain in seats is “real”, more Americans voted for Democrats than for Republicans, so that hardly justifies saying that liberals are “out of touch with America”.

(BTW, I haven’t checked the House results, because its too much of a hassle, but go ahead and check them if you want. I wouldn’t be surprised to find out something similar to the Senate case)

The youth of the future are smart voters.

People should use the cartogram instead of the red/blue map.

A lot of it depends on voter flow. All over my county, people swarmed to the polls in the morning, lining up well before the polls even opened. Some people waited well over an hour to vote in the morning. Most precincts reported that by lunch, however, the wait was 20 minutes or less and there was no line at all when the polls closed. Veterans of previous election days thought this was highly unusual–usually with big-turnout general elections they had an evening rush (and by the way, in some states the polls don’t close right at poll closing time. Everyone who was already in line at that point will vote, no longer how long it takes). Anyway, you really can’t predict all aspects of voter turnout.

For an explanation of this map, see here.

Pretty cool analysis!