English Canadian news tend to oversimplify whatever comes from Quebec. This is what we could call “the two solitudes”: even though we’re a single country, culturally speaking we function as though we were two and we don’t know or understand the other side more than we do any other geographically close but foreign country. Most anglophone commentators have blamed “the separatists” for the opposition to the reenactment, as though there were two kinds of francophone Quebecers: the angry, unreasonable “separatists” who are impossible to please and always complain, and the others who want to live together with their English-speaking brethren in this multicultural utopia. But of course it’s much more complicated than that, and this particular case has nothing to do with separatism, as shown by the large number of federalists who either find the idea to reenact the Plains of Abraham offensive or an otherwise bad idea. It’s not only us who are unreasonable and holding on to the past. If this battle is still that powerful in Canada today, it’s because all sides have allowed it to happen. And yes, many anglophones (I will grant they aren’t usually the most knowledgeable ones) believe, completely ahistorically, that the question of Canada’s language(s) was or should have been decided on the Plains.
In the book by Marcel Trudel I’ve referenced a few posts ago, he compares the French-language and English-language history books used in Canada. They are not the current books, they’re the ones they used in the first part of the 20th century, but the result is interesting because it shows how differently francophones and anglophones in Canada view their history. The fact that the French-language books are heavy on Catholicism and view the Conquest as a “tragedy” while the English-language books view it as a victory (including for French-speakers) is only the most obvious difference. They also don’t mention the same historical characters and don’t put the same slant on other events (including the Confederation). Interestingly enough, English-language manuals are all over Wilfrid Laurier while French-language manuals barely mention him. Trudel doesn’t try to explain why, but I believe I do have an explanation. English Canadians are proud that Laurier was able to become PM as early as 1896 since it shows how open their society is to “minorities” and especially these French-speakers who always complain for some reason (see [post=10415067]this post[/post] for example). Take that Obama! But for French-speakers, Laurier is just any other politician, and they’re not a minority to begin with. This, I believe, is the explanation.
Yes, we’re kind of getting out of the subject, but that’s something I wanted to mention since I believe it helps understand Canada.
If you will check your facts, you will find that New Brunswick is the only bilingual province in Canada. French is official in Quebec and ENGLISH is the only official language elsewhere.
Nonetheless, Quebec supports three English-language Universities, an English school system, offers Englisjh publ;ications and services, has English and French in its courts and assembly. Now look at the language minorities in the other English provinces. They have some of this, but very little compared to Anglos in Quebec.
Sorry, but you are completely wrong about this. Check your facts, will you?
Check your facts. New Brunswick is the only province with two official languages. French is official in Quebec (with many many services and schools offered in English) and English is the sole official language in the other provinces.
At least finish your post objectively:
…and English is the sole official language in the other provinces (with many many services and schools offered in French).
Thank you to Hypnagogic Jerk for expressing things so well. You seriously seem to unsderstand and for that I thank you.
By contrast, thank you to Uzi for being so typically Albertan when it comes to Quebec. I have to get to work now. Yes, Uzi, Quebecers work! No matter how convinced you are that they just sponge off the Rest of Canada. Have a nice day.
That’s because they think they can win the do-over 
You know what is funny? You expect us to understand and commiserate with all the emo issues you have out there, but it seems there never is an attempt to understand our POV. You expect us to shut up and keep paying, but when we ask you to shut up and quite whining we never hear the end of it.
Frankly, I don’t care if you are a net receiver of tax dollars. What bothers me is that you are a net receiver and you keep bitching about how unfairly you’re treated.
But, maybe I’ve misunderstood the point of this thread. Are you saying that the canceled re-enactment has been uncanceled. I can’t find any link saying they are still holding it.
edit: Is this a debate, or should it be in the pit. The OP really seems more of a rant.
One one volley? As I recall, Montcalm had about 50% more men than Gen. Wolfe, and (in addition) had the walls of Quebec behind him.
He should have sent skirmishers around the British flanks, a frontal advance (as he ordered) was a colossal gamble.
Of course, Montcalm only had 3 days supplies; so probably he figured it was all or nothing.
Still, one wonders what Wolfe would have done, had he lost the battle-winter was coming on, and his ship faced being trappedin the St. Lawrence river.
I’ve never forgiven Gen. Montcalm.:smack:
I think an important factor is the fact that history is almost always taught chronologically. Canadian history classes taught in Québec start with Jacques Cartier, and follow to the beginnings of Nouvelle France. By the time the British are in the picture, the story is resolutely French-centered and no matter how neutral the language in the textbook may be, it’s hard to see them as anything but the other.
To all the Americans in this thread please refrain from unnecessarily agitating the French Quebeckers; English Canadians… as you were.
True enough. Section 16(2) of the Charter.
True on its face, but I think a deeper look is needed at this point. While French-language rights in New Brunswick have been enshrined in the Charter and it is true that English and French can be used in all law courts in all the provinces of Canada (section 19(1) of the Charter), a number of the provinces offer varying levels of French services outside of what they are constitutionally required to do. Schools are perhaps the best known (did you know there are French-language schools and even French-language school boards in Alberta?), but other examples are abundant: a trip through Ontario, for example, displays bilingual highway signs in many areas; and certainly, government documents and services in Ontario are in both official languages. If I recall correctly, Manitoba had to go back at one point and translate all its provincial legislation since 1970 into French. There are other examples, but I’ve got to get to work too. 
Yes, English is the day-to-day language of the people in most of the provinces of Canada; but to imply that other than Quebec and New Brunswick, the ROC is some kind of monolithic English-speaking bloc that never provides anything in the French language is simply absurd.
I did not say I was unfairly treated as a whole. That is why I am a strong federalist. What I am saying is that many English Canadians cannot strop bitching that they have been deprived of their celebration of the British victory on the Plains of Abraham. For example, just yesterday an article in the Globe and Mail said cancellation of the re-enactment was simply due to “separatist thugs”. The inability of English people to understand the hurt they would be inflicting is what is sad.
Just for the benefit of our American friends, the “net receiver of tax dollars” to which he refers is simply an arrangement in which the federal government and the provinces have agreed for several decades now that the less prosperous provinces will have their budgets topped up with federal “equalization grants” to allow equal quality of social services across the country. Quebec actually receives the least amount per capita, and these grants represent a small proportion of Quebec’s budget.
But Albertans, who had the intelligence and foresight to have oil under the ground in Alberta, never tire of throwing that up to provinces that receive such grants. One Alberta politician went so far as to accuse the Atlantic Provinces, who are much bigger per-capita receivers of equalization grants, of having a culture of welfare and handouts. Needless to say, the Conservatives under Stephen Harper do not do well in (English-speaking) Atlantic Canada.
Before any smart-ass asks.
Was it filmed and on the net anywhere I’d like to see that.
For someone who is so obsessed on the issue you’re strangely ignorant on it. So here are the facts.
Most provinces don’t have an official language. People can speak whatever they wish and the government accomodates them according to what people are actually speaking.
In terms of the law, only two provinces have official languages. New Brunswick is officially bilingual, with French and English as its official languages. While not provinces, the Yukon Territory also has French and English as its official languages; Nunavut had French, English, and Inuktitut as its official languages; and the Northwest Territory has eleven official languages - Cree, Dene Suline, Dogrib, English, French, Gwich’in, Inuinnaqtun, Inuktitut, Inuvialuktun, North Slavey, and South Slavey. Which I suppose makes street signs in Yellowknife something to see. On a federal level, French and English are both official languages for national affairs in Canada.
As noted above, the provinces of Alberta, British Columbia, Manitoba, Newfoundland and Labrador, Nova Scotia, Ontario, Prince Edward Island, and Saskatchewan do not have any official languages. Quebec enacted The Official Language Act in 1974 and made French the sole official language of Quebec.
So let’s look at the numbers that result from all this. How many Canadians are living in an area where their official language is different from their native language?
Anglophones in Quebec - 787,885
Other non-Francophones in Quebec - 562,860
New Brunswickers who speak a language other than French or English - 8,913
People in the territories who don’t speak Cree, Dene Suline, Dogrib, English, French, Gwich’in, Inuinnaqtun, Inuktitut, Inuvialuktun, North Slavey, or South Slavey - 10 (okay, I couldn’t find any number for this)
You are using specious reasoning. For example, English is an official language used daily in Quebec’s legislature. Quebec’s court system is entirely bilingual. All the laws of Quebec are published in both languages. The Quebec government voluntarily produces manuals, pamphlets, etc. for the benefit of the English minority. Quebec fully funds and supports three English-speaking Universities, and a complete Kindergarten to College school system for the English minority.
On the other hand, if you care to do a bit of reasearch, you will find that about 20 years ago, Alberta and Saskatchewan learned that an old law governing the territories in the 1800s made French an official language. But the court said they could by retroactive legislation declare this null and void. Guess what they did? They passed legislation declaring that they were English only. Look it up, why don’t you?
Of course, it was explained to me that this was just to be “fair to everyone”. Funny how that works. If English is the only official language, you are just being fair. If French is the only official language, it is a travesty of justice, even though the English minority in Quebec is one of the best-served in Canada.
Finally, if you think that anglophones in Quebec can’t speak whatever they wish, you are completely off base. Take a hike down a street in the west end of Montreal and listen to people, why don’t you.
You are using specious reasoning. For example, English is an official language used daily in Quebec’s legislature. Quebec’s court system is entirely bilingual. All the laws of Quebec are published in both languages. The Quebec government voluntarily produces manuals, pamphlets, etc. for the benefit of the English minority. Quebec fully funds and supports three English-speaking Universities, and a complete Kindergarten to College school system for the English minority.
On the other hand, if you care to do a bit of reasearch, you will find that about 20 years ago, Alberta and Saskatchewan learned that an old law governing the territories in the 1800s made French an official language. But the court said they could by retroactive legislation declare this null and void. Guess what they did? They passed legislation declaring that they were English only. Look it up, why don’t you?
Of course, it was explained to me that this was just to be “fair to everyone”. Funny how that works. If English is the only official language, you are just being fair. If French is the only official language, it is a travesty of justice, even though the English minority in Quebec is one of the best-served in Canada.
Finally, if you think that anglophones in Quebec can’t speak whatever they wish, you are completely off base. Take a hike down a street in the west end of Montreal and listen to people, why don’t you.
I was looking up the Battle of the Boyne when I found this relevant quote from remarks made at a reenactment in 2008.
"We should not and must not forget our history. But as we gather on this famous battlefield, it is not history that concerns us now. It is the future. In the future, let us respect each other and our different identities’’ –
(Former) Taoiseach Bertie Ahern at the Battle of the Boynesite.