Well, yes, fresh produce is cheaper than potato chips. But boxed Macaroni cheese and Ramen noodles are the cheapest “food” out there. In general, if you are trying to fill bellies on a small income, you’re going to the “hamburger helper” type foods. And considering that poorer people generally work longer hours for their smaller paychecks, convenience does become important.
I think there’s also a certain “comfort” to be gained through the higher carbohydrate foods which folks who experience the daily uncertainty and frustration of low income come to rely upon. And of course, if you’re headed to the charity pantry, you’re going to be basing your meals on canned goods.
Poor folks also tend not to have the same utensils and equipment. So a crock pot, for instance, which could make cheap beef and potatoes into a filling stew of yumminess is not an option. and in order to really benefit from that you’d need tupperware-type containers in which to freeze the leftovers for future meals. That’s assuming that you have a freezer, and can rely upon the electricity being on until you use it.
I think free kitchen equipment and cook books could help. But it’s just true that we need to find a way to make healthy living more convenient, or make low-paying jobs 9-5.
But that’s not exactly the fault of the food itself, nor even of the people who produce it. It’s the fault of a society where people are too busy to shop every day, and where local grocery stores have often been driven out of business by chain supermarkets, making it more likely that people will make one huge shopping trip per week in the car rather than multiple small trips.
My wife and i like to do one large shop every week or so for non-perishables and for perishable items that have a decent shelf-life in the fridge or freezer (milk, cheese, eggs, tofu, meat). For our fruit and veges, though, we tend to make three or four trips a week, often just to the small independent supermarket across the street. I can go there, buy some veges, and be back in our place in literally 5 minutes. This is one of the reasons we choose to live in the area where we live.
There is nothing magically “healthier” about organic produce. The only thing it will make skinnier is your wallet.
Healthy food is not expensive.
Here are some items from my recent grocery bill:
Tomatoes: $1.69 a pound
Romaine Lettuce: $1.99 a head (that’s enough for like a dozen sammiches)
Pre-chopped broccoli: $3.99 a pound
Black beans: $0.89 a can
Ground turkey: $3.99 a pound (exact same price as 90% lean ground beef, BTW)
Grapefruits: $1.49 each
Bananas: $0.69 a pound (!!!)
Pre-cut celery and baby carrots: $3.99 a pound
Multi-grain bread: $3.89 a loaf
And on and on and on.
I also just got a dozen cans of solid white albacore on sale for a buck each. It’s already cooked and it lasts forever.
I’ve got enough stuff there to feed me completely for a couple weeks while maintaining my calorie restriction, for the price of a couple days worth of Whoppers and fries.
Yes, making a tuna sandwich and peeling a banana is more time consuming than ordering fast food or going to a restaurant with obscenely absurd portions, but it’s really not all that much work.
And if you can’t be assed to do that much work, microwave a fucking Lean Pocket. (3.49 for two!)
Oh puh-leeze. Who do you think these people are who produce healthy food? Magical impoverished food elves who can’t afford bigshot Washington lobbyists?
Healthy food is produced, distributed, and sold by all the same people who make Bon-Bons, deep fried pizza and corndogs wrapped in a pancake.
If you can’t acquire good food it’s because you’re lazy and want super-processed crap which has a long shelf-life, or because you just want the delicious high-fat snackies because they taste good and you want that instead of spinach.
I’m not blaming anyone so inclined; I can relate. It’s taken me years to change my relationship with foods and portions. But I did the work, all without the “motivation” of a sin tax (which we can see has been quite successful with tobacco :rolleyes: ) or subsidies for some government-defined taxonomy of “healthy” food.
I run into that problem with food going bad before I can eat it all the time. The vast vast majority of my food is refrigerated, with some veggies and some meats frozen.
I do have a market about a block from me, but they have limited fresh foods other than a great butcher shop. This time of year they do have spectacular local heirloom tomatoes, but… I can’t really eat tomatoes any longer. sob
What on earth is “heart healthy” butter? Butter is butter.
Sounds like you are trying to eat “healthier” by buying stuff that says “healthy” on the package rather than learning about proper nutrition and cooking.
If you’re concerned about butter, then don’t buy some sort of weird concoction. Learn to cook things that don’t rely on butter. And if you need the flavor for something, learn to use it in such a way as to maximize the flavor impact.
“Healthier” versions of processed crap are indeed more expensive than the regular versions of the same crap. Food that is actually good for you isn’t.
Not true.
People like to eat processed food because it contains salt, sugar, fat, flavor enhancers, artificial flavors and colors, etc. The recipes have been created in food labs by experts who know what factors make people want to eat a food. Even the “mouth feel” of the food is a deliberate decision.
Modern processed foods are engineered to be appealing to our palates. People eat that shit because it tastes and looks and feels good to them.
If the processors can fool you into thinking it’s “cheap,” then so much the better.
DON’T buy a mix of frozen vegees, or some pre-seasoned bag of stuff like “Oriental Flavored Stir Fry Medley!!!”. Buy bags of basic vegees like frozen carrots, peas, broccoli, etc. Take out just what you plan to eat from the bags. Reheat in microwave, or cook in various dishes. Works as good as fresh, but keeps a lot longer.
I’m a little agog at some of your prices. I’m going to suggest a few ways to bring down the cost, in case anyone else here is living on the same restricted budget as I am.
I discovered this year that lettuce is ridiculously easy to grow. I got 3 dozen heads out of a $1.69 packet of seeds.
:eek:
I’d buy it either non-pre-chopped or a bag of frozen chopped - under $2 for the frozen where I live.
Good lord - you realize that the non-pre-cut is MUCH cheaper? No one makes carrot sticks anymore? I understand my husband not doing that, as he is disabled and his manual dexterity is impaired, but most of us could managed to cut these ourselves in just a few minutes.
Outlet thrift store - day old bread in multi-grain, rye, pumpernickel, etc. for $2.58 for two loaves, or $1.29 each.
I disagree when it comes to carrots. Carrots last a long time in the fridge, and frozen carrots have a weird consistency. Peas and broccoli and cauliflower and beans are great frozen.
There’s this phenomenon in poor neighborhoods called “food deserts.” There’s a wikipedia entry on it if you’re wondering. The deal is, in these neighborhoods, it’s impossible to get healthy food, like fresh produce. These neighborhoods are inundated with fast food joints, bars/liquor stores, and convenience stores, but no real grocery stores with reasonably priced items so people can make fresh, home cooked means with healthy foods.
This is the real problem with just telling poor people to eat healthy. If they have to make 2 bus trips, or take an expensive cab, laden with grocery bags, that is a real deterrent to eating healthy, esp. when Burger King has a 99 cent value menu across the street. This is a public policy issue, not so much one of pricing per se, but it does provide an explanation of why poor people tend to be obese, have diabetes, etc., even though they have less money for food.
Another thing to consider is the time factor. A lot of the working poor work more than the nice 9-5 job. If they have a salary position, they’re often expected to work 60-80 hours a week, and if they don’t, they may be scrambling for as many hours as possible to make ends meet. If you have that kind of work schedule, making tomato sauce from scratch or taking the time to chop and simmer and season, etc., can be taking time out of things like sleep. Eating healthy is easy if you have an hour to cook and eat every night. That’s with an estimate of 25 minutes of cooking time, 15 minutes of eating, and the remainder the clean up. If you don’t have that hour, then the tomato is going to rot on the shelf, because you don’t have the time to chop, cook, and season it into a nice tomato sauce. It takes five minutes to walk across the street to McD’s and grab a $1 cheeseburger and $1 fries.
Do you honestly think this is what most poor people pay for groceries?
Poor people where I live are buying the ramen noodles (10 for $1 on sale), generic mac and cheese for 25 cents, and 99 cent loaves of bread. It is much, much cheaper to eat peanut butter sandwiches on white bread than a tuna and romaine sandwich on multi-grain bread that’s nearly $4 a loaf. Hell, I won’t even pay that much for bread on a regular basis; I stick to buying a few 100% whole wheat loaves on sale and freezing them. Something that’s twice as much money adds up fast in a family of 5 or 6.
Don’t get me wrong. There are ways to eat healthier on a budget than existing on junk food. Bananas, dried beans, tinned tomatoes, canned tuna… these are indeed less expensive options. However, if you are barely getting by and you are shopping for the cheapest food you can manage to get full with, it’s more than likely going to be processed and full of carbs. That’s a fact.
Further, time is money, and healthy food requires more prep time. I know it’s easy to dismiss people as lazy, but there are people out there working two jobs and trying to raise their kids on practically nothing, and they often don’t have the time (or the kitchen resources) to cook for hours.
There is no “heart healthy” butter. I think he’s referring to margarine blended of the oils containing plant sterols (canola seed, olive, fish, soybean, and flaxseed). Although, I will admit the jury is still out on whether these cholesterol reducing phytosterols are actually beneficial in reducing the risk of cardiac events, I can’t imagine they do even as much or more harm than butter does.
For those of us with high cholesterol, however, butter is a distinct no-no. Smart Balance is my spread of choice when I do eat something I used to eat with butter (such as corn on the cob or a multigrain muffin). Oh, that reminds me, I pay a premium for fruit spread that doesn’t have high fructose corn syrup or artificial sweetener. That kind of ticks me off, actually.
Yes, there are expensive substitutes for things we used to enjoy eating, where even moderation is not advised. It doesn’t mean that all healthy food is expensive, but some of these alternatives are, in fact, very pricey.
Right, but isn’t that precisely one of the points of this thread? That convenience costs money.
You said “Healthy food is not expensive,” and then listed pre-cut celery and carrots as an example. But 4 bucks a pound for celery and carrots IS expensive.
That may be, but this thread seems to be more about general “healthy eating” than dietary modifications needed for specific health problems. If a person is generally trying to eat healthier, eating a muffin with a huge glob of Smart Balance Buttery Spread instead of butter isn’t going to help as much as finding something to eat that doesn’t require a huge glob of something buttery.
There are a lot of very good points here about how difficult it can be for low-income people to cook healthy food. Another issue may be pressure from peers and family. It can be hard to maintain a different food-style than those around you, especially if you live in close proximity.
Regarding friedo’s examples–we’re not only talking about the truly poor here. Yes, his specific grocery list costs more than many people can afford, but that doesn’t invalidate his point–that healthy food isn’t necessarily more expensive even when looking at convenience food.
p.s. 3 handy carrot tips–buy the package with thinner carrots. They taste better when eaten raw. Get a peeler that’s shaped like this instead of this. It makes things a lot easier. And try the organic carrots. I find that they taste better, the packages tend to have thinner carrots, and the price difference is small.
So, they should offer their expensive food cheaper and take a chance on going out of business? If they manage to sell their product at a certain price why should they sell it at a lower one just to make you happy?
No one is shoveling ‘fast food’ into people’s faces. They manage to do that all on their own.
I can guarantee that the day someone makes broccoli taste like a Big Mac or chocolate, then people will eat healthier. But, I can also guarantee that at that point some busybody will start complaining about how people are having bowel obstructions due to all the broccoli fiber people are eating and that we should penalize the broccoli industry for not making a lower fiber version.
It isn’t impossible, nor is it expensive. Nor is it the fault of the ‘fast food’ industry. They just cater to their market. You don’t have to shop in that market if it bothers you so much.
This is not as black and white as you might think. See my post above about food deserts. In some neighborhoods, there are no grocery stores and nowhere to buy fresh produce and other healthy foods. However, there is easy access to convenience foods and fast food, so that’s what people eat. This is not an issue for people with cars, or people in middle class or better neighborhoods. It is a problem in low-income neighborhoods, and rural communities were transportation is problematic for a lot of people.