TVAA, you have absolutly no understanding how mathmatics works. Take for example the Pythagorean Theorem: A squared plus B squared equals C squared.
Since there is an infinate number of numerical values and also an infinate combination of them, you cannot empirically prove that the theorem is true for every value of A, B, and C.
Even if you were supplied with the worlds supercomputers it would be impossible, because infinity never ends, dimwit.
A lot of these issues wouldn’t come up if you’d just stop and
think for a moment instead of accepting the positions you can
find official cites for.
Firstly, I curse TVAA for broadening this trainwreck to become the mother of all trainwrecks, his position, that mathematics is empirical, is not broadly received, and is contentious to say the least.
Secondly, consider Newton’s law of gravitaional attraction, something like:
g=GMm/r[sup]3[/sup]
which is wholly empirical. Do you suppose that this has been tested for every pair of masses at every radius?
Ooh, that really proves your position. Nice going, greck.
The Great Unwashed: Lynn Bodai has requested that we avoid GD material in the Pit. I’m waiting to see if Lib will actually start a thread on this topic; if not, I’ll probably start one myself.
I am a clinical psychologist. I don’t believe that one should be required to have a degree in clinical psychology in order to express opinions about it or be critical. However, repeatedly saying “I am trained as a cognitive psychologist” is clearly an attempt to blur the lines between studying (either currently or a failed past attempt) and actually completing a course of study leading to the status of being a cognitive psychologist. More importantly, I do feel that TVAA calls his credentials and experience into question with the arrogant manner in which he makes assertions as if they are beyond question, proclaims himself to possess godlike superior knowledge of the topic, and incessantly throws out a variety of statements purportedly factual, but without citation and eventually shown to be false.
It is this last behavior that I do feel warrants some sort of intervention, not that it is really my place to say. I do worry that those interested in the topic, those casually reading these threads, and those suffering from problems like those we are discussing may be done a great disservice when reading the misleading, erroneous and biased allegations presented by TVAA. He simply appears unable to bring himself to provide reference material that allows others to determine the nature of the support for the many and varied claims that he makes. As one example from this thread, he has stated that schizophrenia expresses itself differently in Africa than elsewhere, and implied that this may implicate the validity of the condition, in that it differs when regarded differently by different cultures. Presumably this statement is intended to influence others, and could easily influence someone with such difficulties regarding how they should think about and seek help for their problems. Yet, his only cited reference on the topic expressly states otherwise (that schizophrenia appears to express itself the same in Africa as elsewhere), and when pressed on it, he is unable to give any support. He merely spews out a number of statistics on the topic with still no indication as to the source of these numbers.
In sum, one should not be required to be a professional, nor licensed, nor accredited nor trained in some fashion to express opinions and make observations. However, one should certainly be held accountable for the statements that they do make, particularly when these are intended to be seen as something other than opinion. A history of distortions and misstatements presented as fact should not be tolerated.
The “position” I was trying to “prove” was that you had stated that you weren’t an expert. Much as people had been harping on you to do. If anything, I was defending you.
dumbass
If there’s any other “position” I have, it’s that you’re a prick, and possibly a delusional one.
But let’s hear more about this ethical problem you had with a career in clinical psych.
that, and the bit about how his ethics wouldn’t allow him to pursue a career in psych. is why I think may be delusional.
He wouldn’t be very good at having delusions if he didn’t have some irrational beliefs like he can ignore what he’s said in the past, now would he?
I did see in GD where he qualified some of his misinformation with “in my experience” or something like that recently.
progress!
No, I know more than the average clinician. They’re not the experts – which is one of my points. You’d have realized this, Zoe, if you spent time actually reading my posts to find out what I’m saying instead of hysterically ranting about what you think I’m saying.
Hentor, your claims haven’t held up in discussion. You can’t simply dismiss opposing claims by suggesting that they’re “misleading, erroneous and biased allegations”. Heck, you can’t even interpret a research article correctly – I can see why you’re concerned that ignorant Dopers might get the wrong ideas from these discussions.
I fail to see how questioning the nature of psychiatric diagnoses can hurt anyone. If they’re genuinely supported by objective research, won’t the debate reveal this? The recent discussion of whether AIDS is actually caused by HIV was quite useful in examining – and discrediting – the claim that the virus doesn’t necessarily cause the disease. I’ve yet to see Hentor present any genuine arguments for his position, although he’s repeated it dogmatically – what’s keeping you, Hentor the Barbarian?
After a while, if you’ll look over in great debates, TVAA, you’ll find that I’ve apparently read your posts more carefully than you have. But you’ll have to wait a bit.
Hentor, I posted the response that you refer to much to quickly. I did not mean to suggest that clinical psychology is not an empirical science. When I think of the “soft sciences” I think of social science, political science, linguistics, and so forth.
Back in the 1960’s when it was all ahead of me, I came very close to going to Vanderbilt’s graduate program in clinical psychology. The professor who was backing me had worked with Carl Rodgers. I have asked myself a thousand times “What if?”
I went straight into teaching instead and did a little graduate work later. But it still fascinates!
I figured something like that, and appreciate the clarification.
Well, it’s never too late! I myself studied under Julian Rotter, quite stellar in his own right of course, but also himself a student of Alfred Adler. It is fortunate, I think, when one is exposed to those whose thinking has been so impactful.
And I had thought about teaching as well. Teaching psychology will have to suffice, although I am not doing any teaching at present.
I would love to go back to school. I miss the process! But short term memory problems prohibit.
How sad that I’ll just have to settle for two weeks on the Left Bank in April with my sixteen year old granddaughter in tow. Life’s little “passages,” you know.
I’m still wondering what to make of our last exchange. Can you not do me the courtesy of at least letting me know that 1) you still hold me in low regard, or 2) you misunderstood my previous posts, and don’t hold a grudge?
I think she’s too pre-occupied with her Five-Minutes’-Hate to respond. Give her some time, and I’m sure she’ll be back to offer more of her “analysis”.
Hmm… I believe it was when the people first failed to understand what was said (both in and out of context), charged me with being a lying, ignorant, mentally ill scumbag, and made utter and complete fools of themselves.
Have you ever actually examined the ways in which people are diagnosed, Zoe? Do you have any idea whether the procedure for said is circular or not? Are you or are you not aware of the implications of activated placebos? What about the eventual resistance effect of antidepressants? Do you know anything about psychiatry, the supports that were offered for past treatments that are now discredited, the degree to which key concepts are debated in the field?
In short, can you offer any positions beyond “Nyaah nyaah Aide’s a crazy liar”?
