There seems to be a lot of confusion among the various articles about him, with ‘prove’ and ‘confirm’ being used interchangeably. Example, from our favourite reliable source. I’m pretty sure he wasn’t asked for ID, though, because since when has being asked for ID been described as ‘confirming’ one’s age?
From Morrisons directly:
"*We have also introduced the TASK 21 Scheme which ensures that if we believe a customer wishing to purchase alcohol is under the age of 21, they will be *asked to provide recognised ‘proof of age’ ** documentation."
http://www.thepublican.com/story.asp?storyCode=54673
So if the checkout staff were following corporate policy, they would have requested proof-of-age. Otherwise saying “of course I’m over 21” would count as “confirmation”, which seems rather weak.
hmph I’ve been in Morrison’s and have never been asked to prove my age. And I don’t even look like a pensioner! Should I be offended? Should I contact my local Morrison’s store and complain?
Huh? You’re saying the shop staff genuinely thought he was under 21?
Course not, but it looks like at certain stores (where there is a higher level of underage purchases) local management encourage their staff to ask every customer.
This is standard in corporate hotels in America now, and has been discussed here before - it’s about 100% risk-avoidance, and is a response to the increased penalities for serving underage customers with alcohol.
Yes it’s daft, but it allows Morrisons to guarantee they are not serving underage customers.
Asking young (16-17 y/old) staff to use their judgement on age purchases is a sure-fire way to get stung by Trading Standards. If the occasional grumpy OAP is unable to buy his two bottles of cheap plonk… well, that’s less of a problem that losing your alcohol sales licence.
No. Some Morrisons stores had instituted a “always ask” policy to avoid the need for staff to make a challengeable judgement on whether someone looked 21. These stores may have had prior issues with underage sales, and were at risk of losing their license. So corporate policy (Ask 21) had been enhanced with a local policy that allowed no discretion.
Si
Aren’t they required to have the sale (verbally) authorised by another member of staff? (Not that it affects the gist of what you said.)
Yeah, think that’s right.
No kidding. I was asked for ID when entering a tequila bar in the People’s Republic of Boulder, despite having grey hairs scattered through the fringe surrounding my Mr Burns-style dome. It was a minor inconvenience, although very good for taking the wind out of my girlfriends sails.
“Ooooh, they asked me for ID! I must look under 21!!” 
“I doubt it, they asked me too” :mad:
On the Morrisons question. I was just thinking:
How many UK Dopers actually carry proof of age around with them? I carry an assortment of credit/debit cards but I don’t carry my driving license or passport - no reason to in this country.
Your assortment of credit/debit cards won’t be any good as they don’t show your date of birth on them. If I have my usual “work” bag with me, it’s got my driving licence inside because that lives in my diary/organiser thingie…but I don’t usually have that with me when I’m in Morrisons. The best I could do would be my European Health Insurance card thingie which has my date of birth on it, but no accompanying photo so they’d have to assume I really was who I said I was.
That’s just the point - nothing I carry has my date of birth on it. As to photo ID - this would have to be my passport. I’ve had my driving license so long it’s an old paper one without a photo. Maybe that’s why I never get asked for proof of age when I buy wine.
It’ll all be different when Nanny Bottler insists we all have ID cards, 'cos that’s going to stamp out terrorism, right?
My driving licence lives in my wallet. It does come in handy at occassional times when I need ID, e.g. collecting special delivery mail, and also should I be stopped by the police (although I’m a perfect driver, so that would never happen 
). However, it’s entirely my choice to do so, if I don’t have my wallet with me then I have no ID, and I’m vehemently opposed to ID cards.
Do you carry both sections though, photocard and paper bit?
Because I’ve been told that without both you’re not carrying a licence.
Last time I got ID’d in Sainsburys was this summer - I didn’t have any photo ID, so I pointed to my selection of organic veg, a copy of the Guardian, and 4 bottles of Aspalls cider, and asked whether that was honestly the purchase of a 17 y/old 
I carry my drivers licence in my wallet, and I’d have no problem carrying an ID card as proof-of-age (I’d just refuse to show it for certain other transactions).
Just the card. Strictly, both parts are needed for it to be the complete valid licence, and I presume if you were required to present it at a police station then both parts would be needed. But purely as a widely-recognised way of giving my identity, including if stopped by the police, then the card is enough. It’ll correspond to my car registration and insurance details, etc.
Re: The 21 rule. I work for the Co-operative Food Group. We follow this “ask if they look under 21” rule. We also have to fill out a quick quiz on Age related sales every 2 months.
This is purely to save the Co-op’s arse if I do sell to a kiddie mind you, they can then say “look we’ve trained him! It’s not our fault.”
One of the latest questions is as follows…
A customer who appears to be under 21 attempts to buy 4 cans of cider. You ask for ID and he provides proof that he is over 18. He then comes back the next day to buy 4 more cans. What do you do?
The correct(!) response is to ask him for proof again.
My answer was “Ask him every time he comes in, until he gets so sick we lose his trade to one of our competitors.”
As for Health & Safety legislation. A friend of mine runs his own funeral directors. He has been told, that as his hearse is a works vehicle that carries passengers (or passenger to be more accurate) he has to have no smoking signs on the driver and passenger side door.
Plus one on the tailgate!
I agree with the concensus of the reason for the “always ask” policy.
I also think it’s fucking ridiculously stupid, and I applaud the pensioner for taking it to the media.
Though I have to say this particular type of story is nothing whatsoever to do with the UK being a “nanny state”. This kind of story way, way more common in the gung-ho US, as evidence by several heated threads here (and by my 50+ cousin-in-law being refused beer at a baseball game in Boston, while his son, who was celebrating his 21st birthday, was able to get served because he was proudly wielding his driver’s license.)
The hearse thing is tragic, as are the “no smoking” signs in cathedrals. One must ask though: who is actually imposing this nonsense?
How about “Ask him every time, until he starts sending his son to fetch them instead”?
As for no-smoking signs, they’ve appeared in little rain shelters along the riverside here, which house perhaps three people each, but have gasp brick walls on three sides! (I suspect it’s partly the fuck-witted council thinking this will stop “the young people” from gathering there in the evenings and drinking the aforementioned cider.)