Video shows police handcuffing 5-year-old

More people need to realize that those “morning magazine” shows are not news shows. They have a great deal of opinion and fluff, and the rest all seems to be promotion of the other shows on their network. Katie Couric is nobody’s example of a real reporter.

Back to the topic, though, this is the kind of discussion I get into with my wife (a school board member) after school meetings. What on Earth is the school supposed to do in cases like this?

Physically stop the kid from misbehaving? Mom gets upset that her baby was touched and the school gets sued.

Lock the kid in another room to calm down? The kid hurts herself and the school gets sued.

Let the kid finish the tantrum? She hurts another kid and the school gets sued.

Call the police? Mom gets outraged by “overreaction” and the school gets sued.

Punish the child? Don’t even start down that road.

Basically, any action–or inaction–on the part of the school is a setup for a lawsuit.

Good point InvisibleWombat.

He can’t. It’s shorted.

A few more details from Court TV right now: One of the police might have known the child from before, and might have said as he approached her, “I told your mother next time I’d handcuff you!” This might have been the unseen fourth officer, the commander on the scene who was giving the orders (and BTW, he’s black). Perhaps she sat down because she recognized him?

Apparently she had been in such trouble before, although I’m not sure that police were ever involved.

The teachers are now being accused by the mother’s lawyer (and I guess this is another fatherless family, that accounts for a lot) of “hovering over” the child and “escalating” her tantrum. So, hands off, hands on, they can’t win.

Did anybody else read the related story from March 18 .

If it’s the same kid, this has happened to her before:

and

.

In the video, it sure looked to me like the girl didn’t expect any kind of repercussions from the teacher or the AP. She did control her own behavior when approached by folks that she knew could actually DO something to her.

I vote for undisciplined brat.

I find this passage from the article Archergal linked to be saddening. Elementary schools now must have their own police. :frowning:

Bolding mine.

Does it make a difference if you take note of the likelihood that these two stories are talking about the exact same incident. Reported by the same reporter.

I vote for pathetic whore of a reporter making it sound like an old(er) story is new again because there is video now.

Aye, it’s the same news story, just now there’s “incriminating” video released by the incompetent mother’s lawyer. Though, if you listen to the end of the second clip, you will here a policeman imply by what he says that he’s had an encounter in his duty as an officer of the law with this child before. (In my mind he says she told her mother he’d handcuffed her, not that he’d told her mother he’d handcuff her next time, but listen for yourself. It helps if you turn up the volume a bit, I found.)

I’ve got 9 years of 7th grade at a rather urban school under my belt. I’ve seen my share of crack babies too (strong little suckers, aren’t they?). I’ve also seen my share of kids who were never told “no” when they were younger. I honestly had a Grandmother (most of the Moms have either given up or are in Jail) say “But I give her all she wants, why is she acting this way?”
uh, HELLO?!?!? Maybe if you didn’t give her everything she would behave!

Unfortunately, the new trend tend to be Middle School Mommies. Last year, I had a girl with a 6 month old at home. This year, one of them has a 1 year old, and another one is about 3-4 months along.

::raises glass of adult beverage:: AMEN! The biggest reward I get is when the kids get older, come back, and apologize for “being mean” to me. They always say “Now I understand what you were doing.”

You see, I don’t just teach my content. I (and Wallet and all other teachers on this board) am teaching the Future of this Country.

Can you read? Can you think? I said I would interpret the video. I have not viewed the video but I will. Nowhere did I offer to “diagnose” a person. Nowhere did I offer to “guess”. I offered to interpret the video sequence. Nowhere did I “insinuate” I could “prove” how wrong everyone is. When I stated “You’re wrong” I clearly tied that to the comments **that teachers cannot restrain children. **

Please take a moment to read and reflect on comments here before you misrepresent them. My comments will not be based on "guessing with (possibly) a bit of experience in the realm of child psychology. They will be based on 20 years of experience interpreting children’s behavior, teaching teachers and parents how to guide behavior with successful outcomes. Does that help?

My best guess is that the video is too brief to fill in the informational gaps. I can, however, interpret what I see. You certainly are under no obligation to read it.

regards,
widdley

I can’t view the video because I’m not entirely certain how to download the Quick Time player. When I tried to do so, it seemed to be downloading the I Pod. Anyway, I’ll comment as best I can, using the text of the link supplied in the first post of this thread. Placing my comments in ().
ST. PETERSBURG - Videotape was rolling March 14 when the 5-year-old girl swung again and again, her bantam punches landing on the outstretched palms of Nicole Dibenedetto, the new assistant principal at Fairmount Park Elementary.

She tore papers off Dibenedetto’s bulletin board and desk. She climbed on a table four times. About an hour had passed since she refused to participate in a kindergarten math lesson, which escalated into a series of defiant and destructive acts.

(The video tape represents a **30 minute piece of a total of 1 1/2 hour ** behavior/interaction sequence. Keep that in mind as I continue)

Dibenedetto had used tactics from a Pinellas school district training called Crisis Prevention Intervention:

Let the child know her actions have consequences but also try to “de-escalate.”

Give her opportunities to end the conflict.

Try not to touch her, defend yourself and make sure no one else gets hurt.

(These are **incomplete guidance techiques/strategies to use with a tantruming 5 year old child. ** I will comment on that soon in this post)

As St. Petersburg police officers arrived shortly after 3 p.m., the girl suddenly sat quietly at Dibenedetto’s table. And, just as suddenly, the tactics used by educators gave way to the more direct approach of law enforcement.

An officer sternly said the girl’s name. Then: “You need to calm down. You need to do it now. OK?”

(Notice that in the above comments, the child **had already discharged ** and the tantrum sequence was over. The child was able **to respond ** to the direction of the police officer and comply)

Seconds later, three officers approached and placed their hands on the girl’s wrists and upper arms. They stood her up, put her arms behind her back and put on handcuffs. She bent over the table and let out a terrified scream.

“No. Nooooo. Ahhhhh.”

(Right there, folks. The child had complied, the child was able **to gain ** control and the actions on the part of police officers at that point were not only unfair, they were confusing to the child. **She had followed the direction ** of the police officer and was met with physical force. Of course she let out a terrified scream. You would have too. She did as she was directed. )

The tape ends there.

Largo lawyer John Trevena provided it to the St. Petersburg Times this week after obtaining it from police.

“The image itself will be seared into people’s minds when you have three police officers bending a child over a table and forcibly handcuffing her,” said Trevena, who represents the girl’s mother, Inga Akins. “It’s incomprehensible … She was sitting calmly at the table. There was no need for that.”

(I absolutely agree with the above. The child had discharged, she was able to comply with police officers direction to calm down, she did so and was met with physical force.)

The Police Department declined to comment, citing an official complaint by Akins that has sparked an investigation by the supervisor of the four officers involved. Two are new officers who were being trained that day. Police spokesman Bill Proffitt said the investigation would be complete in about two weeks and the findings would be made public.

The tape’s existence is a fluke. The girl’s teacher, Christina Ottersbach, was videotaping her class as a self-improvement exercise, district officials have said. Educators simply kept the camera rolling when the girl began to act out, prompting Dibenedetto to intervene and Ottersbach to escort her other students to another classroom.

(The removal of other students may have been unnecessary, I’ll explain later in this post)

Later, Ottersbach retrieved the camera from the classroom when the girl began to make a mess of Dibenedetto’s office.

The tape, which lasts about 30 minutes, begins with Dibenedetto alone in the classroom with the girl, saying the child’s name frequently as part of her commands.

(Again, please keep in mind that this is a 30 minute sequence with an hour of build up prior.)

“You need to stop,” she tells her, using her hands to make the sign language signal for stop. “You don’t get to wreck the room.”

(Keep this comment in mind. The AP states:“You don’t get to wreck the room.”)

Using her radio, she calls for help from teacher Patti Tsaousis. She also asks the school office to call the girl’s mother and tell her the school will have to call Pinellas Schools police if the behavior continues.

Word comes back that the mother would not be able to make it until 3:15 p.m. It is shortly after 2 p.m.

(The mother will not be present until 1 hour and 15 minutes after the 1 1/2 hour behavior sequence. The adult has 1 hour and 15 minutes left to deal with the conduct, bringing the entire episode to approximately **2 hours and 45 mintues. ** Keep that in mind!)

A short time later, the girl is heard off camera breaking a ceramic or plastic apple on Ottersbach’s desk.

“Oh, you broke her apple,” Dibenedetto says. “That is so sad.”

(Was she wrecking the room? Was she allowed to continue?)
Throughout the 23-minute segment in the classroom, the assistant principal tells the girl many times to stop, that her actions are “not acceptable.” She tells her she needs to take her to her office to prepare for her mother’s arrival.

(Good choice of words. **No follow through ** on the part of the AP)

The girl responds to each request with a curt, “No.” When the girl reaches out to strike them at times, Dibenedetto and Tsaousis tell her to stop and hold their hands up in defense.

(Ineffective response. At this point the child is still wrecking the room, she is now physically acting out against adults with no follow through.)

Dibenedetto and Tsaousis have two breakthroughs - once when they persuade the girl to clean up a small mess she made near Ottersbach’s office and another when they finally get her to leave the classroom with them.

(Can’t see this, can’t comment)

In the second instance, Dibenedetto brings herself to eye level with the girl and tries to get her to talk about why she’s upset. She gives the girl the option of walking with her or Tsaousis to the office. When the girl relents, the educators praise her for making an “excellent choice.”

(Eye contact should have been made the instant the child refused the math activity. I cannot see the video, cannot view the first exchange so I don’t know if that attempt was made.)

The Times interviewed several top educators, including two district officials who had seen the video and two professors at the University of South Florida’s College of Education.

All praised Dibenedetto for using patience and good training in a tough situation. They said she gave the girl wide latitude to opt for better behavior, used clear commands, called for help from another educator, removed the other students from the room for their safety and to eliminate an audience for the girl, reinforced commands with hand motions and successfully avoided physical confrontation.

(She gave the child TOO much latitude in the sequence. The moment the message was given “You don’t get to wreck the room” and the child continued to wreck the room, the appropriate step would have been for the adult to take control away from the out of control child by removing her from the room. There is no reason whatsoever that the child could not have been removed from the room early on. The situation was permitted to last** 2 hours and 45 minutes**. It could have been interrupted early on. There are appropriate and effective steps in behavior guidance. The teacher rightly gave the message “you don’t get to wreck the room” however this occurred, so far as I can tell, **more than an hour after the behavior began. ** By that time the child escalated. We don’t know what took place during that one hour build up. After the teacher told the child “you don’t get to wreck the room” the teacher allowed the behavior to continue. The appropriate measure at that point is for the adult to take control away from the child by physically guiding the child…in this case physically removing the child from the room to a safe place where she could discharge. The length of time the sequence was permitted to continue, exacerbated the child’s behavior. For those of you who claim that a teacher cannot rightly remove a child from a room, I would ask you to consider those cases where a child has become physically ill, fainted or what have you, in the classroom or on the playground and a child is carried to the office to recover or receive medical attention)

Touching the girl, they said, would have escalated the situation.

(Nonsense. The adult should have picked up the child (there are ways to do so without being kicked excessively by the child) and removed her to another room where it was safe to discharge. What escalated this situation was the fact that adults expected an out of control 5 year old to magically gain control on command. Children who are in full blown tantrum do not have the capacity to gain control until after they have discharged. This situation was permitted to continue 2 hours and 45 minutes which is unreasonable and absurd.)

The two educators “can’t control what the children do, but they can control how they respond to it and, to me, they responded admirably,” said Robert Egley, an assistant education professor at USF in St. Petersburg. “I give them an A-plus.”

(From the information I have in this piece, allowing a behavior squence to continue for 2 hours and 45 minutes is NOT admirable)

Trevena, the lawyer, disagreed, saying it appeared to him the two educators followed the girl too closely around the room. “It almost seemed like there was an intent to provoke the child,” he said.

(No comment. My best guess however, is that there was no genuine intent to provoke the child but the length and duration of the sequence exacerbated the child’s emotional/psychological state. When children are in full blown tantrum, make no mistake about it…they are AFRAID of their feelings, AFRAID of feeling out of control and **it is the responsiblity of the adult who is present to SUPPLY CONTROL) The AP failed to supply boundary the child was incapable of internally supplying. **

Akins, the girl’s mother, said she had complained to the school about the assistant principal’s treatment of her daughter. She said the administrator has been too harsh with the girl. The police had been called to the school at least once before in response to the girl’s behavior. The girl has since transferred to another public school.

(Like it or not, teachers are not automatically instructed in the use of guidance strategeties and techinques during the course of their education. Not only that, state standards do not always require early childhood professionals to be trained in the use of appropriate guidance techniques and strategies or child development. In many states a certain degree of education…in this case specific to the young child under age 8…is NOT REQUIRED.)

Dibenedetto could not be reached Thursday for comment.

More clear cut, Trevena said, are the police officers’ actions and the Police Department’s reaction. “It should have been denounced (by department higher-ups) as absurd, as excessive,” he said. “That, I think, is even more alarming.”

After being placed in the back of a police cruiser, police released the girl to her mother after the State Attorney’s Office informed them a 5-year-old would never be prosecuted.

(I would re-write the above to state…after being allowed to remain out of control for neara 3 hours time, after finally discharging and being capable of complying with the direction of a police officer, a young child was met with physical force, made to sit inside a police cruiser like a criminal and that, friends, is totally inappropriate.)

Educators declined to discuss the Police Department’s role in the incident. But they all agreed that once police are called to a school, the situation is theirs to run. “I wasn’t physically there,” said Mike Bessette, an area superintendent whose responsibility includes Fairmount Park Elementary. “I take it they felt they needed to do what they did.”

[Last modified April 22, 2005, 01:06:17]

My best shot at analyzing the text above. I would have very much liked to view the videos. If my comments seem off base for those of you that have viewed the video, I’d like to hear about your observations.

One more thing. I noticed earlier in this thread Diogenes the Cynic, justifably and rightly express agitation and outrage at the comments made by adults on this thread, for the comments themselves lack any semblance of insight or compassion for the 5 year old child. We do not know the background of the child, family history, medical history, we do not know if the child was ill or fatigued, we do not know if the child is a victim of trauma, or had been separated for lengthy periods of time from her mother. We do not know if the mother is a single parent seeking opportunities to improve the quality of life for her or her child or if Mom is for all intents and purposes, an absentee parent. It is difficult for some adults to witness comments of contempt on the part of other adults toward a young child.

What we do know is that a young child during a period of 2 hours and 45 minutes, was permitted to escalate, trash objects and materials, and after she had discharged and after she was able to meet the requests of police officers, her compliance was betrayed and met with physical force.

For those of you who blame the mother. Parents are not responsible for controlling the behavior of their children when placed under the care of other supervising adults. The adults entrusted with that supervision are responsible for guiding a child’s behavior, supplying consequences and helping the child to develop self control. We might assume that the child has been under the supervision and in the care of the school in question for approximately 8 months. If that is so, and that is just an assumption on my part, 8 months is plenty enough time to develop strageties and plans for dealing appropriately with the conduct of a young child still learning the skills needed to develop her own self control.

regards,
widdley

I don’t have anything near **widdleytinks’s ** experience (I found that analysis pretty cogent, BTW), but I have a couple things to offer.

Diane, you wanted evidence that five year olds don’t know right from wrong. I understand what you’re saying, but you should note that (to the best of my knowledge) no jurisdiction considers five year olds capable of the *mens rea * element of a crime. Either they don’t know right from wrong or they can’t control their behavior well enough to be held accountable. Given that, and the fact that we have no idea whether this girl additionally suffers from some mental problem, the absolute vitriol directed at her early in the thread was rather disturbing.

The girl’s behavior reminded me strongly of my 21 month old daughter. Again, I wonder if she is emotionally delayed or has some other mental or emotional disorder. Anyway, it struck me that the AP’s behavior was exactly the opposite of what I consider useful for my child in such situations, and what gets me results.

When my kid acts like that, it’s because she’s been thwarted, and is therefore frustrated, and she wants attention and my compliance. In the video, I see the AP alternately thwarting and giving in to the girl, and giving her absolutely constant attention. It seems like a perfect recipe for escalating a tantrum. Also, I think the initial reaction of evacuating an entire classroom, while letting the disruptive child remain and basically do what she likes, would only have instilled the notion that by her behavior she had gained immense control, over both peers and erstwhile authority figures.

Of course, the problem is that the system is set up so the teacher and AP were not able to invoke effective measures. For instance, the surefire way to stop a tantrum at our house is to withdraw attention. That requires a safe environment where the child can’t hurt herself or destroy property. Apparently the school had no such room. If I have to move my daughter, and she throws a tantrum because she objects, I pick her up and hold her under her armpits, facing away from me. When she can’t kick or claw, and thrashing causes discomfort, she quickly submits. Again, this didn’t seem to be an option for the school staff.

It seems to me that this was an unfortunate collision of a troubled child with a useless (in her case) set of system rules. I don’t really blame the school staff. I don’t jump to blame the mother either - my first thought was that she might well have been in a situation that prevented her from coming, not that she capriciously refused, and that seems to be the case.

I do agree, the police should have attempted verbal commands first. It was pretty clear the kid was not “out of control” when they arrived, and shackling a five year old has great potential for causing trauma.

I was able to view the video up to the part where the child apparently breaks an object…ceramic apple? If anyone can advise me on how to make the video play straight through, I’d appreciate it.

What I see from the beginning to the point where the child breaks an object off screen is this…

The adult states limits and fails to follow through. Instead she allows the child to lead her around the room via her in appropriate behavior. What I see is an adult failing to take control, to make good on the limits she states and the child interprets this to mean the adult isn’t believeable. Again, this is the only portion of the video I’ve seen.

Had there been just one adult in the room, the situation would be very difficult to manage. There are TWO adults present in the room. Given that, the two adults could have easily and non-forceably created a physical “fence” around the child. While one adult is providing “back up”, the adult leading the sequence (keeping in mind that the adult you see stating limits is in no way leading anything) should have walked steadily straight toward the child, taken her by the hand and physically lead her while stating something to the effect “Jacia (?) I see that you are upset. We’re going to sit down so you can tell me about it.” (At that point she would be physcially guiding the child to sit down by taking her hand and bringing her down into a seated position along with the adult.)

Again, if anyone can tell me how to make the video play straight through, I’d like to see the entire sequence. What is see at the beginning, is an adult who is not believable, who is not in charge. The child is taking charge. My best guess is that the child continued to lead the adult “by the nose” so to speak, until her conduct became increasingly threatening (tearing papers, hitting) and when the adult decided to zoom in, it was too late. The child already had discerned that the adult was not to be believed, the adult would not intervene, make good on her statements (which she didn’t) and that essentially “anything goes”. Why this might have happened is anyone’s guess. The child appears to be a typical peer, and not special ed student. The adult in question is purely ineffective…watch how many times she tells the child her conduct is not acceptable and instead of making the child responsible for her actions by stopping her and having her pick up the things she’s taking down or apart, **the adult ** cleans up after her! I do not see a tantrum at all.

Apparently, this isn’t the first time the child has failed to comply with adult direction. I must say that it doesn’t take age 5 very long to decide who is believeable and who isn’t. It doesn’t surprise me that she fails to comply. Perhaps she’s been down this road before.

One important thing to keep in mind as you are able to watch the video in it’s entiretly, which I can’t. Children only repeat behaviors from which they profit. That is to say, they gain something by their behavior. What did Jacia (?) gain? Not having viewed the entire video sequence, I can only hazard a guess based on years of experience.

In the end, what did Jacia get? You answer that, and you have the reason for the conduct.

Scenario: Is Jacia the child of a single parent Mother? Perhaps. Is her mother a busy Mom? I believe that someone said Mom was going to school? What did Jacia ultimately get in the end of the sequence? My money says…she just might have gotten… her Mother.

regards,
widdley

Why thanks. Believe it or not, some people actually make a career out of interpreting and troubleshooting children’s behavior!

regards,
widdley

You win the “Take Your Pitiful Exaggeration to West Hell” award! Overreact much?

oh and…

If its any consolation to you, we’re glad you don’t live here too.

Now I must ask YOU if YOU can read? I didn’t say you were going to diagnose anyone. You said “You’re wrong” when someone said teacher cannot restrain a student. You know all of the laws/rules of conduct in every school district in the United States?? Wow, you really ARE amazing!

What I did say was that if you think you’re going to be able to interpret all of the issues as hand from viewing a videotape (after mastering the oh-so-difficult Quicktime) that you were only kidding yourself. There are far more issues that no one here knows about this situation to make a truly informed decision. Anyone who wants to put forth the idea that they can figure it all out with such limited information shouldn’t be taken seriously at all. Too much information is missing. I don’t care if you have 40 years of experience, you don’t have the entire picutre. No one here does.

Oh and believe me, I gave all of your posts all of the attention and reflection they deserve.

My brother is a police officer. One of his jobs (on a rotating schedule) is to be a “school liason officer”. What this means is, for 3 out of the 9 months school is in session, my brother goes to school. Everyday, all day. He’s there for the sole purpose of having a police officer in the school for just these reasons. Two other officers take over the other 6 months of the year. (one for each 3 months) He has had to handcuff kids for being “unruly” (granted, afaIk he hasn’t had to cuff a 5 year old) and doesn’t enjoy doing so. But some times the need is there and can not be helped.

So, yes, there are indeed police officers in schools all over America. Perhaps it’s not needed in NZ…and believe me, I wish it weren’t needed here either.

IMHO, There are two elements of this situation that are unassailably true. This young lady is out of control and she is in need of professional help. Help found in private practice, not in school. Other than that, IMO, the rest is speculation and conjecture. The timing of the “cuffing” seems a moot point. Police cuff people based on not simply present behavior but past behavior and experience as well.

People who appear to have the definitive answer to this problem and postulate it as such, scare me and instill no confidence in me at all. It may take years of professional help to determine the root cause(s) of this young girls problem. We on this board are certainly not going to do it.

Offering opinion is fine but some posters are beginning to sound omniscient based on very little fact. You may make your points better with more open-ended POV’s and a little less dogma.

YMMV

Couple of points:

  1. Diogenes, widdlytinks and others who are insisting they could have restrained the child and gotten her to calm down – you’re evidently missing the part of the story that indicates the mother had instructed the school staff they could not touch her daughter “again.” The daughter had already had at least one experience at this school with discipline.

  2. It’s unfortunate that the city police, rather than the campus police, were called for this disturbance, but once they got there, they acted absolutely correctly in restraining the child. A policeman is trained to reduce or eliminate any source of threat to the public’s or their well-being as quickly as possible. They walk into a room that’s torn apart, and the person who threw the tantrum is sitting quietly. There’s no guarantee she will continue to sit quietly. If she hurts herself while in police custody, they’re gonna get sued. If she begins to throw a tantrum again, it’s not outside the realm of possibility she could get a gun or pepper spray from the police and use it. (Yeah, I know, cops wrestle full-grown men and women as part of their job, but it’s human nature to be less aggressive with a small child, and their reticence could have cost them or her.) So they restrain her.

My theory (and it’s completely a theory, based on what I’ve read; I could be wrong) is that the mother created this whole problem herself. The child’s behavior is her mother’s fault. I believe that the prior incident involving the daughter, whatever it was, made the mother angry with the school. I believe the mother told her daughter that if ANYONE at the school ever touched her again, the daughter should tell her mother and her mother would get them in trouble. The daughter realized she would have no consequences whatsoever from her actions by the authorities at the school, so she felt free to be as bratty as she wanted to be. The school authorities knew that a lawsuit was likely if they touched the girl, so they didn’t.

The bottom line, though, is that there’s a lot of backstory to this incident to which we’re not privy. Anyone who claims to know how this situation could have been avoided or defused is talking out of the wrong end of their torso.

One point - the police never bent her over the table. When they came into the room, the girl was sitting in a chair, but kicking her legs forcefully and gripping the arms of the chair. They had her stand up and put her arms behind her back to put the cuffs on. At that point, the girl starting jumping up and down and throwing herself on the table. The officers tried to get her to stop doing that; I would presume so she wouldn’t hurt herself.

One the “Today Show” this morning, they played a clip of a paid interview that the girl’s mom did for “A Current Affair.” I’m not familiar with this show, but I think it’s one of those tabloid-type gossipy shows. The mother said they had her in wrist and ankle cuffs and locked in the back of the police cruiser and refused to let her talk to her child.

They also discussed a situation of another child who left school grounds and was hit by a car. (This happened a week or two after the situation in the OP - school camera footage shows him wandering around a bit, walking towards his room, then turning and running off campus) That child’s mother is insisting that her son (who is in a coma) is afraid of all the teachers because she is just sure that they’re telling the students that if they’re bad or misbehave, they will be put in handcuffs and taken to jail, just like the girl in question. She is also considering a lawsuit. :rolleyes: