The Tooth Fairy and minions in Rise of the Guardians, but they’re actually hummingbird-shaped.
I saw it last night, and I don’t see a “seen it” thread anywhere. I will just say I thought it was very good, with a couple unexpected moments that I really liked. There are a number of smaller nitpicks I could make, but overall it’s a success, especially given the fact of Chadwick’s death. I thought they threaded the needle on handling that very well.
Yeah, that was about as good as could be expected. Angela Bassett deserves all the awards. One nitpick is that it seems like Wakanda is being hit by the Worf effect, everyone talks about how powerful they are but every fight they get into they get clowned. Also, is every Talocan herb powered?
Saw it last night, and I loved it. The emotional beats really rang true, and it was gorgeous, and it didn’t end with the laser show that I’ve grown to hate from Marvel (although I found the final mass battle pretty incoherent), and the acting was great.
Spoilers ahoy, and probably we should put a spoiler tag on the thread so we can talk about it?
My 13-yo-daughter saw it with me, and she was bothered by some of the science. I pointed out that the university student had turned in the Vibranium Detector as a class project, and that meant she’d turned in the specs, and my daughter was like, “Then anyone else could also build it!” I talked about comic book logic and SuperScience, where “replicable” isn’t one of the rules of science, but I don’t think she bought it.
That said, I couldn’t accept the comic book logic of Namor and his people. They presented us with a centuries-old society with a leader who falsely claimed to be a god, and they were elite warriors, and there was no significant conflict in the society, and he was a good leader, despite being genocidal toward the surface world.
Bullshit! I say. My headcanon is that he’s a massive liar to Shuri. His leadership wasn’t prophecied, and his backstory isn’t so divine, but rather he’s a powerful mutant who took over their society by force some time back. He leads this city through terror and propaganda, and there are other societies of underwater folk, and his citizens hone their martial skills in unending war against those other societies, similar to Aztec warriors and their relationship to their neighbors. He’s definitely xenophobic, and his concern about the surface world is plausible; but he’s also a murderous expansionist tyrant, and sees the surface world as his next opportunity for expansion and subjugation.
With that headcanon, I find him a really compelling and plausible leader.
Essentially, yes. Although one could argue their herb variant actually changed their genetic structure since the blue coloration, gills, and other benefits would seem to be hereditary - either that or the herb-variant in their bloodstream is naturally incorporated into developing embryos.
Consider the pressures of the deep sea, to live comfortably in that environment would provide considerable durability in the surface world. (although imagine if they were like some deep-sea creatures, once exposed to lower pressures they swell up or even burst - that sure would’ve bumped up the MPA rating!)
Mid-credit tag: If the Talocans inherited their abilities from the vibranium-herb variant within their parents, does that imply that young Prince T’Challa may already have the original herb-power within him? Or diluted since Nakia had not taken the herb?
It was a bit chaotic for sure. I did like the paralleling jumpcuts with one attack such as a jump-kick or punch seeming to happen (presumably simultaneously) with the same style of attack between two other characters. Unfortunately the Namor/Shuri fight didn’t have the same synchronicity as the other two at the boat. OTOH, given the opposite theme of the environment, sea vs. desert, perhaps there was an opposing equivalent in the action choreography that I missed on first viewing.
Re: the science, could Riri have gotten any credit if the specifications were considered classified? But it does raise questions on how the CIA was able to “borrow” the detector and not whisk Riri off straightaway to a classified location and be forced to reveal all the research. The ‘kid glove’ treatment seems peculiar … but I don’t recall all the dialogue from that scene with Riri and Shuri before the CIA intervened other than Riri having kept everything encrypted on the laptop that could be so easily stolen. Perhaps the CIA felt she’d be better motivated to create things they could pilfer if not forced into a CIA lab. Also, I suppose we can safely assume the garage was bugged to high-heaven (hence the rapid CIA response) and whatever power source she designed for her suit is likely to be already under development for the U.S…
Additional thought regarding Riri’s armor: Riri was told she couldn’t take her Vibranium-powered suit out of Wakanda - but isn’t Sam Wilson’s flying Captain America suit also Vibranium-enhanced? He gets a pass but she doesn’t? Guess she has to prove herself further before earning that level of trust…
Re: Namor: I really like your interpretation, it seems highly plausible. Also given the strength level of Talocans vs. Wakandans (who in turn are more capable than other nations), having rival undersea nations may be one of the few things that would keep the Talocans in check especially given that Wakanda is an uneasy ally at this point.
Another thought regarding Shuri and Letitia Wright: I think the final ending+tag was low-key brilliant as far as the controversy goes (with Wright being anti-vax and such). If Disney wants to drop the actress they just leave her character on her path of self-discovery/maturity and future stories keep M’Baku to rule with either him being the new Black Panther or more likely another character - Okoye would be glorious, but someone to fill the role until Prince T’Challa is ready to step up. OTOH Letitia can return to the character at any time if Disney chooses. Great way to leave it open.
I thought it was excellent. One thing I didn’t get was the final scene. When M’Baku announces he’s challenging for the throne, I assume that this means Wakanda is splitting it’s leadership, and that M’Baku is going to be the equivalent of head of government while Shuri is going to be head of state. This allows her to go around having adventures as Black Panther rather than having to stay in Wakanda while also avoiding having to having to formally abandon her leadership role. Does that sound correct?
I think it’s less complicated than that, M’Baku is king Shuri is Black Panther.
Weird thought I kept having during WF:
Freeman’s Everett Ross character in many of his scenes - his lines, tone, and demeanor - felt eerily reminiscent of Gregg’s Agent Phil Coulson. It was almost as if it was written with Coulson in mind (obviously not a precise fit with the CIA position and relation to Valentina Allegra de Fontaine).
Be interesting to see what happens next with Freeman reprising his character in Secret Wars and where his character’s future is going after WF. I’d much rather the Multiverse bring the O.G. Phil Coulson back into the MCU but if that’s not in the cards perhaps Fury could recruit him.
I thought it was okay. I liked the choice of Namor as the villain but his underwater realm seemed small and more like a section of EPCOT you take a boat ride through than a real lived in place. It also was shot very dark and ugly. In fact all the underwater footage looked ugly which is disappointing.
I liked how the movie was about two fantastic Nations at war. That felt different for a superhero film (and kind of neuters any plans DC might have had showing an Amazon/Atlantis war) but in the end the movie was just kind of there.
I don’t want to sound insensitive, but was there some reason they couldn’t recast Chadwick Boseman as T’Challa / Black Panther? I’m sure he was a great guy, but he wasn’t actually the Black Panther. And plenty of actors have been recast in roles for one reason or another. Anyone remember Terrence “War Machine” Howard? How man Spidermen, Supermen, Batmen or Jokers have there been over the years?
Couldn’t someone like Donald Glover or John David Washington fill that role?
Respect, mainly. And it was too soon, for many, including the cast and crew.
That, and it’s no spoiler to say they they do have a new Black Panther anyway.
Maybe if Howard had died it might have worked out differently. Or, you know, been the lead.
There have been a lot of articles about that. Boseman got tremendous props for the way he embodied the character–and he was personally a stand-up guy. As @MrDibble says, a lot of folks would’ve found it disrespectful to him to treat him as fungible and replace him with someone else.
From my perspective, they made the right call: by treating Boseman’s death as T’Challa’s death, they brought a profound emotional depth to the movie. The actors who loved and mourned Boseman played characters who loved and mourned T’Challa, and the movie became more than previous Marvel wisecracking light shows.
Well, I’m seeing it as a matinee after work this Wednesday with my brother who is white and his wife who is Black. Besides my own slant on the movie, I’ll get my SiL’s opinion on it, also. We’re going out to dinner right after the movie, so you know that is going to be the conversation with the movie fresh in all our minds.
That makes sense, though having an entire civilization of super powered people who ALSO have access to vibranium seems a little imbalanced for the MCU. Not sure why they’d need anyone’s help to destroy land dwellers.
Because there’s not a lot of them, mostly. Also they don’t seem to be as technologically advanced as Wakanda or the rest of the surface world.
? Didn’t Namor in his first appearance to Ramonda and Shuri say something like “we have more warriors than you have weeds”? Was that just shittalking to intimidate a potential rival power? I definitely got the impression that Talokans were presenting as the bigger battalions (although yeah, the footage we saw of Taloka didn’t necessarily bear that out).
I just finished watching it and for me it felt like it was at least 20 minutes too long. I know there was a need for exposition, but it seemed like there was just too much of it. I also felt the cut back to Namor toward the end took away from the emotionally relevant moment Shuri had just afterwards. One thing that I did like is that the use of languages, at least all the ones I can speak, was done correctly. It did not sound stilted or unnatural and the grammar made sense. It was cool that a movie involving different nations and people, naturally involved different languages not just people speaking with accents.
I am not sure if this still a spoiler free thread or not, but just in case it is, I really did not buy Shuri as black panther. The heart shaped herb gives you endurance and strength, but does not turn you into a ninja, as a friend I watched it with put it. There was nothing to indicate from the previous films that she had hand to hand fighting ability. We did see here with her hand cannons before, but not kicking or punching people. T’challa could do all of that without the heart shaped herb, he just could do it better with it. Her being transformed into someone who can battle Namor simply because she is Black Panther rings false.
[quote=“jadielyn, post:69, topic:968469”]
Freeman’s Everett Ross character in many of his scenes - his lines, tone, and demeanor - felt eerily reminiscent of Gregg’s Agent Phil Coulson.
[/quote]’
The Everett Ross character comes mainly from the Christopher Priest run on the Black Panther title, which does have him going out with his boss at one point, so I liked that they made a reference to that in this movie. I too wonder where they are going to take the character.
Angela Basset was great in this movie, she killed it in every scene that she was.
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Angela Basset was pretty muscular it looked like to me. Made me wonder for awhile if she was gonna be the Black Panther.
Wild thought, but I wonder if before the rewrites Shuri was going to marry Namor? I feel like it was too long, but I don’t know what could have been cut. Namor was perfect. Noble and just a little nuts. I was concerned how he’d look flying, but he pulled it off. Riri was….there, I guess.
Ok after thinking about it: why did the Talokani attack them on the bridge? How did they know they were there? Heck, how does Namor know “scientist” or that there is one? And what was the point of the Midnight Angels? Andwhy not re-enlist Okoye after her mom died?