Want to play "guess the diagnosis"? (I've been to the clinic)

Culture results are back and show no UTI. Here’s what I sent to my PCP:

Good morning. I went to a X walk-in clinic on Thursday with sudden blood in my urine, urgency, and no pain. This began to resolve in a few hours, before I began Macrobid.

You should have the urine dip results, but if not:

Bilirubin, 3+
Ketones, +1
Ph: 9.0
Glucose, negative
Specific gravity, 1.015
Blood, 3+
Protein, 3+
Urobilinogen, 2.0 mg/dl
Nitrite, positive
Leukocyte esterase, 3+

Despite these findings, the lab result just came back stating, “Mixed genital flora isolated. These superficial bacteria are not indicative of a urinary tract infection. No further organism identification is warranted on this specimen.”

  1. How should I understand the discrepancy between the urine dip’s positive findings for nitrite and leukocytes and the culture result of no UTI?

  2. Should I continue the antibiotic course?

  3. If not a UTI, what is the differential? Small kidney stone passed with blood but no pain? Damage from colonoscopy?

  4. I would like labs to rule out kidney dysfunction and bladder cancer.

  5. Other ideas?

Thank you.

If it were me, i would want to be examined for kidney cancer, too. But due to the urgency, i bet it’s something local to the bladder.

Yes. I have a routine visit in early July that should include a CBC. I wouldn’t jump to imaging first.

You should. I have procrastinated about such things in the past. It never turned out really bad … so far anyway … but it leads to needless worry. Assuming you have insurance that will cover it, just go get it over with.

One of my short stories is entitled “Diagnosis: Borscht.”

Just remember: it’s never lupus.

Those are good questions you asked.

  • Nitrite specificity can be as low as 85% (meaning a 15% chance of an incorrect identification of infection). Leukocyte specificity has ranged from a shockingly low 17% to a high 98% chance of correctly identifying an infection.

  • I’d typically tell my patient to go ahead and finish the antibiotic treatment as long as they weren’t having any significant side effects from it.

  • Differential now shifts (in my mind) to kidney stone or urinary tract cancer (unlikely but we still need to think about it). Idiopathic (no cause found) is still likely on the list, but that’s what we call call a diagnosis of exclusion in that we should rule out those other causes first. Also a viral bladder infection is a possibility.

  • As for what’s next, I’d wait for a reply from your doc, but I’d be leaning towards wanting a bladder ultrasound and/or cystoscopy as the next step(s). And a quick BUN/Creatinine to ensure your bladder is functioning normally, along with CBC. Referral to urology at this point would not be unreasonable though many primary care docs are willing and able to get a few more tests before recommending that.

  • There are many other possible much less common causes, contributing/confounding factors that we could discuss/debate at this point, but in my mind it’s not worth going into until the next round of studies are done and reviewed.

Curious: why hesitate on this. It’s non-invasive, right?

Minimally invasive. Cystoscopy, which to my understanding is the way to go, is a camera catheter in the bladder. No lab test can show and ultrasound is far less definitive.

Obviously QtM knows much better than I do, but with Cytoxan in the past and by age I would say that answering the bladder cancer question is job one, do not delay. Superficial lining bladder cancer is much better to deal with than one that has gotten into the bladder wall. Time to diagnosis matters.

Globular source? Stone? Find out definitely a bit later no lasting additional harms. This cancer diagnosis delay? Big deal.

Definitely! Cystoscopy should be in your future!

I am a male and at the time of the bleeding episode I was in my early 30’s. They wasted no time scheduling a cystoscopy.( male version of that anyway) Nothing showed up and the Dr. decided I must have passed a small stone. I had no reoccurrences.

Thanks, everyone. I’ve been waiting for a bit more information before posting an update.

As noted, I sent my questions to my PCP. While waiting for her response, the clinic called to clarify that what the culture report meant was that the sample was contaminated and thus couldn’t convey any information. The person I spoke with told me to talk with my PCP and also to consider a repeat urine test. The nurse I’d seen sent a message via the portal that included “If you have new or worsening concerns about your health, … please call or return to the clinic or office where you received care. If your symptoms get worse, or if a new problem starts, call the clinic.”

I left a portal message for my PCP: “[Clinic] clarified Saturday that the urine culture was contaminated, so I’d like to repeat that again as well.” She quickly replied to ask, “Do you want to repeat that urine at our follow up appointment [sic; it’s an annual exam, not a follow-up] on 7/10/23?” The back story here is that her team has decided not to order labs prior to a visit, which I guess I understand for routine tests, but not for non-routine events. Note that she didn’t offer me an earlier appointment. I replied, “Good morning. No, I’d like a repeat urine test, plus urine/blood tests for kidney stones, kidney function, and bladder cancer ASAP.”

She made no reply all of yesterday. At 11:30 this morning, I called the clinic, explained that I was following up per instructions, and was given an appointment an hour later for a repeat urine. This I did after the med tech explained to me in dumbed-down language and tone how to do a clean catch. Frankly, I’ve done plenty of these in my life; this was the only one to be contaminated, but fine.

Then the nurse (it’s all the same nurse in this story) came in and was quite brusque with me. She asked why I was there, and I explained. She said I should contact my PCP. Ah, I thought, I’m getting the “You’re trying to exploit the system” response, so I said that I was following up as suggested by the clinic, and that I had contacted my PCP but she was not responsive to my request for the repeat urine. She told me that if I couldn’t get through on the phone, I should use the portal. I politely explained that I had used the portal but my PCP wasn’t engaging about my request and I wanted to be sure the antibiotic had been effective (a concern this nurse had raised as a reason to do a culture on the last visit). She said that if my symptoms had abated, it was a UTI and the medication had been effective. I said that the bleeding had stopped before the first dose, that I’d taken the 10 doses, but I wanted to have the repeat testing that had been suggested. She snapped that acute onset bleeding with quick resolution was consonant with a UTI diagnosis and that I no longer had the UTI. I did not say “absence of evidence isn’t evidence of absence” because that doesn’t build rapport. I did say that I’d consulted with medical friends and wanted to get the test information because of the overlapping signs of UTI, bladder cancer, and kidney issues. I reminded her that my urine was cranberry juice-colored (which she had seen and commented on). She said, “Well, one of those people should order tests.” I said that they were out of state and my friends (not just you all; I have MD friends), and that I’d attempted to have the repeat testing done but my PCP offered only waiting two weeks and that I wasn’t comfortable sitting with a potential infection for that long.

She whipped her computer screen around and said, “There’s no evidence of infection” from the dip they’d just done. Might have been nice to lead with that. She started to turn the screen back to herself and I asked, “Wait, may I look at that a little longer? I need to put my glasses on.” She seemed quite angry and generally was interacting with me in the way that people seeking opioids are treated, but I’ve worked in hospitals, so I just ignored the tone. Today’s salient results, which she hadn’t yet showed me, were:

Bilirubin: Negative
Ketones: Negative
Blood: Negative
Ph: 6.0 (reference range: 5-9)
Protein: Negative
Urobilinogen: 0.2 (this is in range and 10% of what it was the first time I went in)
Nitrite: Negative
Leukocyte esterase: Negative

This is great, and I have no idea why she didn’t lead with this. She then said there was no reason to send it for a culture. I said that I’d like it sent because the dip isn’t always very accurate and I wanted more information to help confirm the diagnosis. She challenged this and I said, because if further assessment for bladder cancer or kidney function is needed, I want to do it soon, and I’d rather not have a cystoscopy if it wasn’t needed. She again pushed back on ordering it, and I said, “Look, I’m trying to do my medical diligence here.” She punched at the keyboard and said, “There, the order is sent.” I thanked her. She replied, “If this one’s contaminated too, we’re not doing another.” Okay. I thanked her again for her help.

She left the room, apparently done. I waited a little, then walked out to the hall and found her. I asked if I could have a printout of the dip results (which the med tech had brought me on the first visit). Without a word, she printed it and handed it to me. I thanked her; she again didn’t say anything.

I found this all quite peculiar, since I was being adherent with treatment, had followed the instructions she’d given, wasn’t trying to score drugs, was polite and not reactive, and as a person with insurance, was paying for all of this. The clinic was empty when I arrived and left; I wasn’t keeping her from other patients. So fine, I won’t go back there on this issue.

It’s now 36 hours since I wrote back to my PCP; there’s still no reply. Ah, well.

That’s really weird. Did she feel you were challenging her medical authority?

Good luck.

Thanks. I don’t know. I think I got the “you’re trying to game the system” response, though what I did was consonant with her written instructions. Or maybe she finds it repugnant that I apparently didn’t cleanse my bits sufficiently for the first test. I’m sure by the end, she did feel like I was challenging her, but she came into the room curt and aggressive.

I have trouble getting a good urine sample. If there’s not a little bacterial contamination, there’s usually blood. My bits are fragile and bleed easily.

Also, I’d want a cystoscopy in your position. I suppose I’m a bit of a hypochondriac, but I’d want someone to look for evidence of a tumor or a recent injury.

Yes, the effluence of bloody urine made it hard to see what was going on and certainly made the process more difficult.

My reading over the last few days (medical sources, not Dr. Google) makes it clear that though it’s not frequent, colonoscopies are known to be a cause of UTIs, especially in women.

I’m so sorry you’ve been through all this. It’s frankly unacceptable from both your PCP and the nurse.

I have a superb PCP with a fantastic, responsive support staff. PM me if it will be useful to you to have their information.

My best to you.

Huh. That’s a little weird. But i guess it’s not crazy.

Thank you!