Wanted Dead or Alive in the Old West

[D18]

A key cliche in westerns is the Wanted Dead or Alive poster. There’s been many times on the boards when we’ve discussed things considered to be part of western life that really weren’t based on reality.

So, teneral question: what’s the Straight Dope on fugitives being wanted dead or alive in the old west? Fact, myth, or exaggeration?

Specific question: In Django Unchained, Christoph Waltz’s character just offs fugitives without even trying to capture them alive, claims they were wanted dead or alive, and can I have my reward, please. Even if the dead or alive thing was based in fact, the idea of just slaying a fugitive seems far-fetched. So, was that in any way grounded in reality?

[Senegoid]

Let me add a closely-related question to that: Were there really “outlaws”?

Today, I think the word “outlaw” is commonly understood to be simply a synonym for “criminal”. But I’ve read that, in terms of the Old Wild West, it had a more specific meaning: It meant that a criminal had been officially declared to be “outside the protection of the law” (by who? the sheriff?) and thus could be shot on sight by any gunslinger.

Is that true? Were people really declared “outside the protection of the law”? If so, that gives legal cover to all those bounty hunters who captured those outlaws, however dead they captured them.

[Frank]

@Senegoid

Today, I think the word “outlaw” is commonly understood to be simply a synonym for “criminal”. But I’ve read that, in terms of the Old Wild West, it had a more specific meaning: It meant that a criminal had been officially declared to be “outside the protection of the law” (by who? the sheriff?) and thus could be shot on sight by any gunslinger.

Is that true?

No. The meaning in your first quoted sentence is the same as the meaning in the Wild West. The “outside the protection of the law” meaning was very early English common law, and has not been applicable since, hell, 1000 years ago?

[aceplace57]

United States District Judge Isaac Parker had deputies that went after fugitives in the Oklahoma territories. Most were arrested and brought back alive to face the court. There was no appeal from his court.

109 deputy marshals died in the line of duty. It was a dangerous job.

Isaac Parker

In 21 years on the federal bench, Judge Parker tried 13,490 cases—344 of which were for capital offenses. Suspects pleaded guilty or were convicted at trial in 9,454 cases. Of the 160 sentenced to death by hanging (156 men, and 4 women), 79 were hanged. The rest died while incarcerated, appealed, or were pardoned.

The jurisdiction of the Western District of Arkansas included the Indian Territory, which today composes much of the present-day state of Oklahoma. While the legal systems and governments of the Five Civilized Tribes and other Native American tribes in the Indian Territory covered their own citizens, federal law applied to non-Native American United States citizens in the territory. During the Parker court, notable lawmen served as deputy marshals, including Old West gunman Frank Canton, Zeke Proctor, Frank Eaton, Bass Reeves and Heck Thomas.

With respect to the Indian Territory, during this period the Western District was the court of final jurisdiction. From 1875 until 1889, statutory law did not provide for appeals of Indian Territory cases from this court to any court of appeal.

As a reflection of the frontier violence, as many as 109 deputy marshals were killed in the line of duty during that time.[3]

[Frank]

@aceplace57

United States District Judge Isaac Parker had deputies that went after fugitives in the Oklahoma territories. Most were arrested and brought back alive to face the court. There was no appeal from his court.

109 deputy marshals died in the line of duty. It was a dangerous job.

What has this to do with the subject of the OP? Yes, being a U.S. Marshall between 1875 and 1896 was a dangerous job. Some were killed in such places as California, Alabama, Tennessee, and, of course, Oklahoma. So what?

I’ve avoided answering the OP because I don’t know. I did answer a question I do know the answer to. Your post has nothing to do with anything so far posted in this thread.

[aceplace57]

So, teneral question: what’s the Straight Dope on fugitives being wanted dead or alive in the old west? Fact, myth, or exaggeration?

Exaggeration. Based on the court statistics from Parker’s court. Fugitives were located, arrested, and transported to Fort Smith Arkansas to face trial. Parker was the Federal law for the Oklahoma Indian territories. He was appointed by Ulysses S. Grant.

How many fugitives died in conflicts with deputy marshals is unknown. But the statistics speak for themselves. 13,490 cases were tried in that court in about 20 years. Deputy Marshall’s brought back fugitives whenever possible. They weren’t bringing back corpses tied to horses as often depicted in movies and tv.

[aceplace57]

One of the most iconic images in tv and movie Westerns is a lawman or bounty hunter riding into town leading a horse with a body strapped to the saddle. I’m sure it happened occasionally, but most rode back to Fort Smith in chains to face trial.

Unlike the movies, murder warrants did get issued in the old west. Its a myth that old West shootings were tolerated. That you could shoot somebody down in the street, have a drink in the saloon, and casually ride out of town.

Frank Stilwell

Two days after Morgan’s death, Frank Stilwell was killed by Deputy U.S. Marshal Wyatt Earp in a Tucson train yard. Arrest warrants were issued for Earp and four others in his gang suspected of murdering Stilwell. Murder indictments were issued at Pima County for Wyatt Earp, Doc Holliday, Warren Earp, Sherman McMaster and John Johnson. Earp agreed to turn himself in but instead fled the Arizona Territory for Colorado. Wyatt Earp admitted late in his life to killing Stilwell at close range with a shotgun.

[samclem]

@aceplace57

Exaggeration. Based on the court statistics from Parker’s court. Fugitives were located, arrested, and transported to Fort Smith Arkansas to face trial. Parker was the Federal law for the Oklahoma Indian territories. He was appointed by Ulysses S. Grant.

How many fugitives died in conflicts with deputy marshals is unknown. But the statistics speak for themselves. 13,490 cases were tried in that court in about 20 years. Deputy Marshall’s brought back fugitives whenever possible. They weren’t bringing back corpses tied to horses as often depicted in movies and tv.

Your statistics only applied to Oklahoma, not “the Old West.” Show me some data for others states and territories.

[samclem]

@aceplace57

One of the most iconic images in tv and movie Westerns is a lawman or bounty hunter riding into town leading a horse with a body strapped to the saddle. I’m sure it happened occasionally, but most rode back to Fort Smith in chains to face trial.

Unlike the movies, murder warrants did get issued in the old west. Its a myth that old West shootings were tolerated. That you could shoot somebody down in the street, have a drink in the saloon, and casually ride out of town.
Frank Stilwell - Wikipedia

Well, that’s just one incident. Expand it to perhaps hundreds and I might accept your theory.

[grude]

Wasn’t Osama Bin Laden wanted dead or alive by the USA?

[Nonsuch]

There was once a string of stagecoach robberies in and around Tombstone, Arizona Territory. According to Jeff Guinn’s account of the gunfight at the OK Corral, these robberies so distressed the Wells Fargo company that they put out a bounty for the robbers dead or alive — a grossly illegal act that could have made the company an accessory to murder. (Most of the robbers ended up being killed in unrelated incidents and the reward was never claimed.)