I can’t figure out if I did something wrong here, or if the bus driver was just being a jackass.
I leave for work between 7:15 and 7:20 every day. There’s a school bus that picks up the kids in our apartment complex anywhere from 7:10 - 7:20. Every time I have either passed this bus or been behind him, when he stops the bus and puts out that ‘stop’ sign and his big red flashers are on (not to be confused with regular flashers), I stop, like I’ve always been taught to do. He comes down the complex, then turns at a small road on the right - he pulls into the road and backs out to turn around and go back to the main road.
Two days ago, I was driving down our little road to the main road. I saw the bus turning into the small road just as I came up near him. He had his regular flashers on - NOT the big red flashers. He had pulled into this road and was stopped, so I continued on my merry way - it wasn’t like he was picking up a kid, and as far as I know, the fact that he’s turned into a road and I know his route doesn’t require me to give him the right-of-way, just as it wouldn’t for a regular car. I should note that I was driving in one lane, and he was turning into the small road from the OTHER direction - this was not me behind him, zooming past while he turned around. This was HIM turning into the road from the complete other direction, something that didn’t require me to do a thing. When he turned around, he would most certainly come across both lanes to maneuver the bus.
I drove by and he honked at me, then got back behind me and flashed his brights at me. I honestly didn’t think I’d done anything wrong, other than drive by the typical rules of ‘right of way’. His red flashers were NOT on, his sign was NOT out, and if he’d been a car, I would have done the same thing.
Was I wrong? Are there special sets of rules for buses?
As a former school bus driver, and unless the laws have drastically changed, all school bus drivers are required by law to use their upper red flashers (and stop sign) when they are loading/unloading students, and all traffic is required to stop (unless it’s a divided highway).
This can be the most expensive lesson for new or unthinking drivers. If you don’t stop for the flashers and stop sign on the side of the bus when you are supposed to, in CA the fine is over $500! I think it was $524 the last time I went to traffic school!
The sign on the back of the school bus I just followed for a few miles says motorists must stop when the lights on the bus are flashing. It does not specify the yellow or red lights. About 200 feet prior to each stop the yellow flashing lights would come on then the red flashing lights when the bus came to a complete stop. And the fine in Washington (on a large sticker on the bus bumper) says $327. I’m going to say the bus driver was right in this case.
I don’t know about washington, but school buses here in Illinois can be driving around with those things on for blocks with out using the red flashers. I take this to mean use caution, not stop.
What really irks me are the drivers who stop for a school bus when they are in the opposite side of a 4 lane road. In Illinois, you DO NOT stop when you’re on the other side of a 4 lane road.
Let me clarify - the bus was pulled into the street on the other side of the road that I was on - from what I knew of his route, I knew he was going to back out and turn around and he had his flashers on.
They were NOT his ‘school bus’ flashers, they were regular flashers like I’ve seen on a car. Had I not known his route, I wouldn’t have questions because I would have passed him anyway.
The buses do say on them “Must stop when red lights are flashing”. They don’t say ‘Must stop when regular flashers are on’. These were NOT the red lights.
I always stop for a school bus. The reasons I passed this one were because he was pulled into the street - he wasn’t even ON the road I was on. Had I stopped where I was, he would have backed out right into me. So I drove through because it made more sense for me to continue while he was there than to stop and back UP for this bus to turn around.
Let me ask this - if you’re pulling into someone’s driveway to back out and turn around, do you expect every car on the road to stop while you’re doing so? That’s the mindset I was thinking - because when I’ve done that, I wait until the roadway is clear to pull out and turn around. I don’t put my flashers on and expect everyone to stop until I’ve turned around.
No - he had just turned into the street as I’d come up the road. That’s why I continued on because if I stopped, he’d back right into me, so I’d end up backing up anyway.
No turn signal - it’s a straightforward road.
I turn my headlights on every morning as soon as I get in the car - sometimes before I even turn it on. It’s still dark when I leave for work.
I think you were in the clear Avabeth and I am not so sure I like the part about “he got back behind me and flashed his bright lights” as this sounds a little too road-ragey for a school bus driver to me. Maybe I am reading a little too much into it, but if he thought you were that wrong it seems the acceptable thing for him to do would be report your tag…not come up behind you flashing bright lights.
Perhaps the local school could give you a contact person regarding bus drivers who could answer your question based on their locality R&R. And I would also ask them about the behavior of the driver.
You were in the right. (Unless there are unusual laws in your area.) The laws in every state I’ve seen say you must stop when coming upon a school bus with flashing red lights on the road upon which you are driving, even if the stop sign is not yet engaged. Turn signals mean you follow normal traffic rules. Even if his red lights were flashing, you would be allowed to pass, as he was on a different road. He was in the wrong thinking he could just back out into oncoming traffic. He must follow the same traffic laws as everyone else.