Was J. Edgar Hoover a cross-dresser?

We think he was gay because “one of his hobbies was antique collecting”? What??

I get to say it: Welcome to the SDMB, KenP!

I take it the column being referenced is Was J. Edgar Hoover a cross-dresser?

I think you missed Cecil’s point. He mentioned that “There were hints about this throughout the FBI boss’s career, some of them admittedly a little silly.” He then listed some of the silly things, the antique collecting among them. It’s only after that where he continues "On the more serious side . . . "
RR

Please include a link to Cecil’s column if it’s on the Straight Dope web site.
To include a link, it can be as simple as including the web page location in your post (make sure there is a space before and after the text of the URL).

Cecil’s column can be found on-line at the link provided by RiverRunner.


moderator, «Comments on Cecil’s Columns»

KenP - Did John Wayne collect antiques? Does Norman Mailer collect antiques? I think not. Q.E.D.

Nit pick.

Cecil says “… the alleged transvestitism of John Edgar Hoover … has never been established, and reputable historians say it’s an urban legend.”

What Unca meant to say was “false urban legend.” An urban legend is a tale that has been passed around a lot, with a claim that it is indeed true (usually in the form of “THIS IS TRUE!!!” – if it’s in an e-mail message).

But ULs can be true, false, or many shades of gray in between.

20/20 ran a story a couple of years ago which reported that J. Edgar Hoover cross dressing thing was part of a larger KGB plot to embarrass the United States. Another story the KGB successfully planted was that Americans were adopting babies from South America solely to harvest their organs. This particular rumor caused the death of several US citizens at the hands of angry South Americans.

Has anyone else heard about of plot?

(I did a Google search and this book review page seems to confirm the KGB/Hoover cross dressing link)

It is true that both rumors existed.

I wouldn’t call the rumor of J. Edgar’s cross-dressing totally implausible. At the peak of his power, Hoover may very well have appeared in drag a few times at swanky Washington nightspots. This would be a grand show of his clout. If you recognized him, you’d be loathe to say diddly as Hoover could ruin your life a million times over before you could ever touch his. As LBJ said about not firing Hoover: “I’d rather have him inside the tent pissing out than outside the tent pissing in.”

My point being … er

As an aside: Appearing in drag for a party once or twice doesn’t mean you’re a cross dresser. Similarly, NOT appearing in public in women’s clothes doesn’t mean you don’t get a sexual thrill by doing so. Whether or not Hoover was a cross dresser is, as Cecil says, harder to demonstrate than that he was gay (which Cecil gives short shrift to the evicence for). And being gay doesn’t make you either a good or a bad head of the FBI.

Making fun of Hoover is all well and good entertainment; his record as a blackmailer and (possibly) victim of blackmail as head of the FBI is what he will be remembered for.

Cecil:

Nice job on J. Edgar Hoover and the supposed evidence that the Cosa Nostra blackmailed him. The whole thing does not stand up when common sense is applied.

I would just add, that Hoover went after the mobsters in 1957 after the Apalachin conference in upstate New York was raided. Bobby Kennedy had little to do with it, because he was not attorney general until 1961.

By that point in time (1957), there was not much percentage in hunting Communists and all the fun had gone out of chasing bank robbers, so it was a fairly politically motivated decision on his part. He needed a new platform to keep the FBI and himself in the limelight.

Quite true. But the English language doesn’t always work by truth. My observation is that the phrase “urban legend” has become an idiomatic expression denoting a falsity. Cecil’s language contains many such idioms, presumably necessary to bring his level down to the rest of us. If he uses a phrase in its current sense and usage, you can’t nit pick him for doing so. :wink:

On this topic, I can’t help but remember Harry Shearer’s brilliant play, J Edgar!, that was broadcast on his fine radio program, Le Show. It stars Mr. Shearer ( Sat. Night Live, The Simpson’s. Spinal Tap), John Goodman, Kelsey Grammer, Dan Castanella, & Christopher Guest.

“A sidesplitting musical about one of the most powerful men of the 20th Century. Learn about his secret love life, his need for personal privacy, and his obsession with knowing the private affairs of others. If you weren’t so busy laughing and humming the tunes, the show might upset you.”

It’s one of the funniest things I’ve ever heard. The links I get are all selling the CD, so, not wanting to be commercial, I’ll just say to Google for Harry Shearer: J Edgar!

If yer into that sort of thing. :stuck_out_tongue:

I can name several individuals who appeared in drag and sang a little song at a party I attended. It was all a grand gag, and I doubt any of the individuals in question are actually homosexual, nor do I think they got any big wild kick out of crossdressing.

On the other hand, J. Edgar was not well known for his sense of humor.