Were most Soviet soldiers prohibited from reading maps?

Factual Questions
1

I remember in basic training during the 1980s, one of the things our instructers told us was that the Soviet soldiers were generally prohibited from learning about maps, lest they defect.

The gist of it was that map reading was reserved for officers and others of high rank. The sort of people who had proved themselves to the State. Lower ranking soldiers were at a risk of defection, so the story went, and thus were prohibited from learning about maps or possessing them.

Is this story bullsh!t? I heard it during basic training at the height of the cold war. One thing that doesn’t make any sense to me is that since map reading is a basic skill for soldiers, why would the Russkies deliberetly hld their soldiers back?

2

On the face of it, the story doesn’t make much sense. People would certainly be expected to know where the borders of their country lay even without maps. If your informant meant that they were deprived of maps while outside the Soviet Union during time of war, this would make even less sense; if the idea was to keep them from knowing where the enemy was, how could they fight in the first place?

My guess is that it grew out of a genuine odd-but-true fact about maps and the Soviet Union. I heard on a National Public Radio news program some years ago that one result of the fall of the Soviet Union was that people in the former USSR were now getting access to much more * reliable * maps.

The Soviet government used to have a serious problem with internal migration; people would want to move to where the jobs were, while the government, struggling to keep up a planned economy, would try to keep them put. One result was that people had “internal passports” which specified in what territories of the Soviet Union they were allowed to live and work. Another was that the government paid people to work as informers and turn in neighbors and coworkers who let it slip that they really weren’t supposed to be living in their area.

Yet another result was that the maps which were generally available to the public were intentionally riddled with errors. People attempting a cross-country trip by car found it a daunting task as they found that cities and geographic features were misplaced. People felt discouraged from taking trips as they knew that planning their route was liable to be guesswork. I remember the report said that maps would sometimes indicate which way a river flowed–and show that it went from the sea, uphill into the mountains.

The Soviet government was also given to restricting public access to areas because of security concerns. The U.S. government does the same thing, of course, but on a far lesser scale; imagine if there were dozens of tracts like Area 51. I once heard on a news report that the Soviets restricted approximately 19% of their territory from all foreign visitors and the U. S. State Department, in retaliation, marked off 19% of the U.S. as off limits to Soviet visitors. This included the entire State of Mississippi.

3

For which I’m sure the Russkies were profoundly grateful. :smiley:

4

Well, the Soviets were certainly cagey about releasing detailed topographical maps; an old client of mine, when emigrating from the Soviet Union, was not allowed to take out a copy of her dissertation (on the land mollusks of Azerbaijan, of all things). Reason? It was classified because of the maps.

As to the OP? Well, it sounds bizarre, and I can’t see why they would logically do that. When speaking of Soviet security matters, though, not everything is logical.

5

I also heard that story during my basic training in 1989, but I never took it to mean that Russian grunts would defect. Rather, I concluded that useful information of all kinds was strictly hoarded in the paranoid Soviet Union.

6

Man, what a strangely fascinating country. Only in the Soviet Union do you get nuclear hand grenades, shieldless submarine reactors, spacecraft designed to carry guns, and a flat tax rate

:wink:

7

In Soviet Union map reads you! :slight_smile:

I think Bryan Ekers´answer sounds rather plausible,

I heard the same thing about the maps being restricted back when I did my military service.

8

I’ve heard similar things about Arab armies. The basic idea is that knowlege is power, and officers need power over their troops. Most Western armies manage using discipline and motivation insead.

Besides, grunts won’t frag the only guy who knows where they are.

9

My father, a geophysicist that did much work in the Soviet Union and does work in the Central Asian Republics has some stories about this.

Soviet oil folks: “You have detailed topo maps of <so-and-so area> in our country? Can we have them?”

10

I heard the same story, like Bryan, when I was doing GMT in 1989.

I also heard the story that Soviet tanks, except for the command tanks, did not have radios. This was absolutely false, but it’s based in historical fact; at the beginning of WWII, most Soviet tanks, except command tanks, didn’t have radios. After the debacles of 1941, however, the Soviets very quickly learned this was a dreadful error in judgment, and that all tanks need radios, so from that point on they constructed all tanks with proper radio equipment. I believe that’s where the “only command tanks have radios” myth came from.

It’s possible the old “Soviet soldiers can’t read maps” myth came from; maybe at some point in the past, they withheld maps from common soldiers. It’s certainly conceivable they might control maps a little tighter. But I think it’s silly to think they absolutely would not let enlisted men read maps - the Soviet army was a competent army, and a competent army needs maps.

11

I heard the “only command tanks have radios” myth as well at some time, but when an intelligence officer came in to give lessons on “the adversary”, he dispelled that rather quickly. (Actually, he gave us a really good scare by describing that tough and effective fighting force.)

Obviously, one can’t soldier without knowing about maps and I do not doubt that Soviet soldiers knew how to read them. OTOH, I’m pretty damn sure that detailed military maps were classified documents - as they are in the West. That might have been how the legend got started.

But thinking back, most of us grunts did precious little card reading once we were out in the mud. Not that it was “discouraged”, but for most, it just wasn’t the job at hand. And as any infantryman will tell you, there are better uses for your copious free time than satisfying idle curiosity about where you’re actually at.

12

The version I was told is that WW2-era Soviet maps, at least the ones available to lower-level officers, were deliberately inaccurate to fool the Germans who might capture them.

13

Oh common! Prohibited from learning about maps? They were able to read maps and they were trained to do so. Though a regular private would not have an access to detailed maps in a combat situation, that’s for sure. A private is expected to follow the directions of his comanding officer, isn’t he? … :slight_smile:

-----one result of the fall of the Soviet Union was that people in the former USSR were now getting access to much more reliable maps.-----

Than’s sound like a bullsh!t for me. I don’t remeber ANYBODY complainig about the maps during Soviet times. The thing is that after the fall large amount of restricted territories become open to regular folks, and while in the USSR you could not really get a map of them, take along travel through them, now you can do both.

-----The Soviet government used to have a serious problem with internal migration; people would want to move to where the jobs were, while the government, struggling to keep up a planned economy, would try to keep them put. -----

It is not exactly the case. Government wanted them to stay put so it can count the “chickens”. That’s a control issue. And people of course wanted to move around, that’s in human nature. Job availability did not play any role there, one of the “advantages” of planned economy was that it guaranteed you a job. And the wages were pretty much the same around the country.

----One result was that people had “internal passports” which specified in what territories of the Soviet Union they were allowed to live and work. —

Not exactly. There were no social security numbers in USSR… The internal passport is the only document that contains all the information about you, including when and where you were born, if you are married or not, do you have any children, and yes, where you live. It does not specify any territories where you are allowed to live and work, though… You could move around as long as you notify the state where you live. If you got a job offer accross the country you could go there, but had to stamp your passport that you left one area and moved to another…

—Yet another result was that the maps which were generally available to the public were intentionally riddled with errors. People attempting a cross-country trip by car found it a daunting task as they found that cities and geographic features were misplaced. People felt discouraged from taking trips as they knew that planning their route was liable to be guesswork.----

That’s just funny… Few of my friends, who attemped a cross-country trip by car just for the sake of it, did not have any complaints about the maps. They were pissed off by the state of the road. :slight_smile: There are no freeways in Russia, mind you. Only a mad traveller would go from Moscow to Vladivostok by car on a regular basis. At the same time, the europian part of the country is much more developed in this sense, and people drive around freely…

----I remember the report said that maps would sometimes indicate which way a river flowed–and show that it went from the sea, uphill into the mountains.-----

There is only one river that does that. I don’t remember the name, though, I would have to check on that. It goes from the North Ocean, but not uphill into the mountains. The thing is it actually goes down, since the altitude in this area is way below the ocean level. It is a very strage natural phenomena and has something to do with the currents in this area of the ocean. Hard to believe, isn’t it?

14

Yes, stuff and nonsense. Reading maps and figuring out where you are is important to any modern army. The Soviet army was no different. I would expect the artillery folks especially would need thorough training in this regard! I will echo what folks have said about the availability of detailed topo maps. Generally not available unless you had a very very good reason and they were controlled as classified documents. The former Soviet Union is not alone in controlling access to detailed map information. Many authoritarian regimes felt they had to do this for one reason or another. Whether it was to deny intel info to their “enemies”, or keep their people ignorant is anyone’s guess.