Sam: Good call.
Cynic: Perhaps you should apologize (a la D.C.).
Or instead of relying on hyperbole, they could just say what they mean.
So it’s American to criticize the President, but it’s anti-American to criticize the Dixie Chicks? Or is it just anti-American to criticize those who would criticize the President? Or maybe it’s just anti-American to criticize those with whom Diogenes agrees?
Look, you’ve certainly made no secret that you oppose all things Bush and Bush-related. He could be for feeding the hungry, and you’d argue for diets. That’s fine, as long as people realize where you’re coming from. But given your respect for the power of free speech, it’s surprising that you can’t see that your words have a real effect on people other than Bush? The right to free speech doesn’t mean that it’s always right to speak freely.
Guinastasia, I was trying to draw a line between criticizing the President and using unnecessary hyperbole (like that used by Diogenes) that minimizes the efforts and sacrifices of our troops. To the extent that I was unclear, I apologize. I do think that minimizing the war effort hurts the troops. If you don’t believe me, I suggest you talk to some troops and see what they think. I assure you that I have talked to many, and they’ve been relatively unanimous. Same goes for some Veitnam vets I know.
quote: Diogenes the Cynic
I would never do anything so white trash as to run over CD’s with a tractor.
You have never been to Texas have you? Farmers aren’t white trash. Now if you wanted get white trash with the cd’s you would have to get real real drunk and shoot them with a shotgun after you pissed out all of your $6.99 a case beer on top of them.
You would concider me white trash. I own a pickup truck, have cowboy boots, cowboy hat, country music collection, a big belt buckle and to really make the case I even have a musical talking bass.
Down here in Australia we’ve got a drag-queen rip-off of the Dixie Chicks who play in vaudeville clubs up and down the country.
They call themselves the CHIXIE DICKS!
It’s a pretty funny show - and no cow is sacred let me tell ya! 
I am a southerner. I was born in Shreveport La. which is right next to Bossier City, the site of CD crushing hick-rally. My mother’s whole side of the family is rural, southern rednecks. They are (with the exception of my mother) pretty much, the stereotype. They say “nigger.” They think everything in the Bible is literally true. (I’ve been dragged to several revivals but never got saved) They thought Clinton was the anti-Christ. They assert, with all seriousness, that we should use nukes on Iraq. I have a brother-in-law who was disappointed that Trent Lott apologized for the Strom Thurmond flap. In my BIL’s opinion, Lott “sold out and turned traitor.” When I was a kid, my grandmother became insensed if she saw me playing with black kids. These people belive in demons. My grandmother (God rest her black soul) was sincerely convinced that I was demon" possessed" when I confessed my atheism to her as a teenager. When Clinton was president, I heard male relatives talking about how much they would like to asassinate him, and they weren’t kidding.
I also know southerners (like my mom) who aren’t like that at all. I know southerners who are educated, erudite, smart, funny and kind.
When I talk about “white trash” I’m talking about a very specific kind of southerner who I know well. in fact, it wouldn’t surprise me a bit if some of my relatives were at that stupid rally. Trust me, some of my relatives deserve every bit of that appellation.
I didn’t say anything about farmers, but my father and my wife both grew up on farms, and both of their families are great. (Well, my wife’s older brother is a white-separatist gun nut, but he’s a pretty nice guy if he puts a lid on the racist shit) I have nothing bad to say about farmers. I have plenty bad to say about anti-free speech morons.
Well, after that stellar contribution to the thread, I wonder if little ole retarded me dare say anything.
I like the DCs. I think their music is very enjoyable.
I don’t particularly like when celebrities of any stripe stick their politics in my face. I don’t stick mine in theirs, so I’d like the favor returned. I don’t own DC cds, but I wouldn’t destroy them if I did. I think destroying cds in rage is kinda goofy, but that’s because I’m cheap and would rather get some money for them on Ebay.
Boycott? An overreaction, to me. But I imagine some former DC fans are simply tired of being condescended to. “Oh, we’ll let you buy our records, but we hold your values in contempt.”
So, more Dixie Chicks records for me, less revenue for them, and heck, while all that farm equipment is out, mebbe we’ll jest have ourselfs a tractor poll! Hooey!
Julie
It’s not anti-American to whine about it, but it is anti-American (IMO) to destroy CD’s. As I said before, that’s the equivilent of book burning. It’s the deliberate physical destruction of speech you don’t agree with. I’m not saying it should be illegal for them to do it but I have the right to mock them as ignorant asswipes.
How the hell does it “minimize” or hurt the troops. to criticize the president. Let me ask you something. Did you ever get angry about public criticism of Clinton while we had troops in Somalia or Kosovo? Was Rush Limbaugh “minimizing” the troops with his daily diatribes against the president? Did it bother you then? Huh? Did it? Did it? I doubt it.
The troops are currently in danger because of the amorality and stupidity of the president. He’s the one who’s minimizing their value by callously exploiting them for personal gain.
On preview, I see that i have inadvertently insulted a fellow doper, so let me rephrase my rather flip and unconsidered “their fans are retarded” remark. I’ll just say that anyone who would run over a CD with a tractor or call for a boycott of an artist over something so trivial is intellectually and philosophically retarded in my book.
My apologies to jsgoddess.
I’m a bit confused by the whole thing. What’s the point of destroying the CDs, which are purely music (possibly debatable in this case), when it’s the singer’s opinion you are upset about? Get on the radio and talk about how you disagree with her all you want, but what does that have to do with destroying the CDs?
I would have respected the Dixie Chicks a lot more if they just stuck with their guns and refused to take it back.
Hell, if they’d have done that I might have even gone out and bought a few of their CDs just to compensate for the negative effects of the boycotting jingoistic rednecks.
Holy…
What’s wrong with running over cd’s with a machine is that…THEY WERE ALREADY PAID FOR, WTF does Natalie Maines care if you run over something YOU ALREADY OWN? I understand the symbolism, of course, but it’s just a foolish statement.
In as far as the statement is concerned, she was neither right nor wrong, as opinions are just that grey, she was, however, stupid. Who does she think she’s singing to, Boston blue bloods and Manhattan socialites? The statements were just daft, and poorly thought out, and likely made in the heat of the moment, during a concert.
Her fans aren’t retarded (although I about spit out my tea laughing Diogenes, thanks) she, however, is of very questionable intelligence IMO.
I’m glad she’s not from Chicago.
Could we get them to throw a few Britney Spears, Christina Aguillera and/or Avrile Lavigne CD’s under the tractor? Please?
I like the DC’s too, though this case of verbal diarrhea was just another example of celeb idiocy.
Here’s the problem in a nutshell; Natalie voiced her anti-Bush rhetoric in front of a foreign audience, apparently thinking to bond with her fans. Sort of one step further from the usual line of “Hey, we love you, London!” And that’s what bothers me. You wanna bitch and moan about domestic politics? Fine, do it here. You wanna bitch about domestic politics, and think you can do it with some anonymity by taking it next door? Not only no, by hell no. We’re family here. Keep it in the family. You don’t take dirty laundry and air it for the neighbors to their endless entertainment. And, like Natalie, if you can’t seem to figure out that the first amendment applies to governmental restraints, fine. I have the right to cost you bucks, baby. Me and all my pals, too. So, I’ll just add your name to the list, right alongside Julia Roberts, and you can forget getting any more money from me.
To me, it’s not about freedom of speech, expression, etc.
It’s freedom to commit career suicide, and she certainly exercised that right.
Entertainers, like many of us, are running a business. If they would like to continue to prosper, they should temper their statements to the public. If they don’t care, then they should run of at the mouth whenver they want.
It’s basically the same thing as a gun shop owner putting Gore for President signs on his shop window. If you know that a majority of gun owners vote Republican, you are setting your business up for failure. But, you certainly have the freedom to do that if you wish.
What’s sad is that I’m not even sure that Maines was giving her true beliefs, but rather playing to the European crowd. That’s the dumbest part of this whole meaningless fiasco.
I enjoy the Dixi Chicks music, and if they come to town soon to play, I likely will not go. It’s not because I’m boycotting their music, but because this whole thing has left a bitter taste in my mouth. But you can bet I won’t be throwing away their $15 CD’s that I own.
I sort of wondered if she retracted her statement for the sake of her bandmates. There ARE two other people in the band, whose livelihoods were affected.
Not that it makes the whole take a stand/back down situation any better. If she was against the war, or specifically had a problem with Bush I believe she should have just succinctly said so instead of making a rather childish remark.
I did not know who the Dixie Chicks were much less who constituted their fanbase. But now I get It. I could not understand why such a furor over such a silly little statement. But considering the fan base, I now understand.
Although I think 99.9% a little high.
No doubt they were selling “Freedom” Fries and “Liberty” Dressing at the cd-crushing ceremony :rolleyes:
They weren’t fans of Clinton. Why would they?
Oh, but not you though, right? :rolleyes:
The POTUS is well liked by her fans. Her actions were cowardly and stupid. She wouldn’t have said the same thing in Texas. Even she realizes this, and has apologized. How can you not see it?
:eek:
This board is becomming more like the Democratic Underground every day. A conservative like december can’t make a single slip without being pitted by 20 people. Meanwhile you can go ahead and say whatever you like without being challenged.
Wait. Aren’t you the one usually complaining about being labelled un-american because of your views? The people trashing the CD’s are exercising their right to free speech. This doesn’t make them ignorant, pig-eyed, or un-american.
If you can’t tell the difference between this and book burning then there is little hope for you.
Nice. :rolleyes:
This is just sad. Can’t have a debate about the Dixie Chicks without making wild accusations that the POTUS is a murderer.
Oh, really. Would you do something so black as to start a riot? Or so hispanic as to steal? :wally
Debaser- Well Done
Sorry, but apparently I wasn’t clear (again). Again, I don’t have a problem with criticism of the President per se. I have a problem with excessive hyperbole when it minimizes the effort our soldiers are making. When you say things like this:
It minimizes the effort that our soldiers are making. Our soldiers are putting their lives on the line for a cause, and you’re saying that their risks and sacrifices are for nothing. At the very least, that hurts troop morale. Saying that there is no reason for the soldiers to be in Iraq also casts you as blind to opposing arguments. I’m in favor of the war in Iraq, but at least I can admit that there are valid arguments on the other side. Can you not do the same?
Yes, yes, and yes (and yes and yes and yes). In fact, I was pretty vocal about it (although I wasn’t on these Boards yet). Not everyone is blinded by their hatred of a particular president. And frankly, because you seem intelligent, I’m disappointed that your posts on political subjects always seem to descend into childish name-calling.
Now I’m the one ranting. Sorry for the hijack.
If I limited my CD collection to artists and groups I agreed with politically, it’d be a very small collection, heavy on Rush and Nugent…
That being said, it’s kinda sad to see another good country artist (among the best in recent years) make the classic K. D. Lang error*. On the other hand, she’d make a hot lesbian. This should be a lesson to all: if your political views differ from those of your fanbase, just smile and nod.
(*Before her coming out, she came out as a vegitarian, and against the cattle industry. Imagine how many rodeos she played at after that revelation…)