We've had something of an embezzlement in our diocese...

…so new measures have been taken in Mass collections.

We now have specially made little plastic bags — one per collection — to dump the money in. The smallness of the bag is “not smart” as one usher charitably put it, because it holds up the Mass while we desperately try to cram the bills, envelopes, checks, and change into it, and then seal it ,shut, and put it in a basket that is then brought up to the altar along with the Bread and Wine.

So, I’m looking for any suggestions you might have to speed up the process.

I’ve thought about bringing in one of the white plastic bags which we use at home to line our trash baskets. With it’s wide mouth, it’d be a cinch to dump all the money into it, and then stuff that in the Diocesan bag.

Any other ideas?

How about something like a mailbox on a stick, locked shut, with a slot at the top for contributions?

How about replacing the collection people?

Yeah, I’m not sure how the bags are going to stop theft from the basket - what stops thieves from just palming a few bags and hoping they get the $100 bill instead of the three sweaty singles from the Johnson tots?

I’d make a simple box with a slit - lightweight, of course, for easy passing. It doesn’t have to be locked even or indestructible, but just have an opening a whole hand can’t fit into without effort. You could even use a wicker or rattan tissue box holder, if you want to keep it basketey looking.

But if they’re bound and determined to do the plastic bag thing, can’t they have a stack of them in the lobby, so you can prepare your donation before the service starts?

Pay Pal.

The church I only very rarely ever attend has boxes like Boyo Jim describes. BUT the congregation is also enormous, so they actually can, so it’s practically unfeasible to take colelction during the srvice because it would take so long. So the boxes were made bigger and were set up at the end of every other row of pews. People put in their contribution as they arrive and take their seat in the aisle or as they leave.

Each box has a plaque that says: “Donations/ Suggestions” because they get notes too.

How exactly did you figure out that someone was taking the donations? How are they doing it - skimming off the top of the collection plate?

Just don’t do what one of the churches in my city did. They called in the police and conducted a sting operation. It turns out, it was one of the elderly ushers who was taking the money. He was having some issues with dementia and was doing things totally out of character for him. The whole thing turned out badly for everyone involved.

From the way you describe it, everyone uses their regular method of donation - loose cash, envelopes, checks, etc. - then once the collection is done all the proceeds are stuffed into a small sealed bag, which takes the time. I think your idea is a good one. Or perhaps someone could devise a funnel-like thing that would allow the bigger bags to be dumped quickly into the smaller bag.

My parish offers EFT (electronic funds transfer) if you want to automate your giving. That might be instituted and pushed a bit at your parish.

StG

The embezzlement happened at some other church, not ours, and I imagine those responsible have been relieved.

Our Church is small, so I cannot figure how big churches in the diocese handle the bag matter. Some folks transfer funds electronically, some like us use checks, others drop in cash.

I think I’ll go the trash bag route to see what kind of reaction I get from the pastor.

Thanks for your suggestions, though.

I just can’t see how a plastic bag makes anything more secure.

Police escort? Marine detail?

I guess it’s a means of sealing the money, for counting later - by designated people, and with accountability.

I think the point about the trash bag is that it’s easier to shove all the collection into a bigger bag (with a bigger opening), then you only have the one bag to put in the small bag in the offertory.

StG

Professional golfers.

Oh, I’ve heard there’s a sort of specialist in these matters: I believe he’s called a “bagman.”

In my parish we use deepish wicker baskets that get handed along the pews. It’s pretty noticeable when someone actually starts reaching in to take money out. Once the collections are completed, the money is brought back up to the front of the church and placed in a box beside one of the side altars, where it remains in full view of the whole congregation until it’s taken into the parish office at the end of mass. Previously the money was left at the back of the church, but there were too many thefts (parishioners or people coming in off the street - nobody was too sure).

Use two counters to tally the collections. They each sign off and put the take into a locked cash bag. On Monday the secretary/bookkeeper counts the take again to make sure it’s the same, then deposits the whole thing into the bank.

You’ll have three signatures and a bank slip with (presumably) the same amount on each.

After that, you’re on your own.

Are these specially-made plastic bags ones the diocese provides? Are they like a bank deposit bag…self sealing? How big are they? The plastic deposit bags we use at work are fairly good sized…maybe just a bit smaller than 8-1/2 x 11", and they hold quite a lot of cash and checks…though you do need time to straighten everything into a nice pile. That’s what’s slowing the process down, right? Standing at the back of the church, trying to get everything in a neat enough pile, while the organist vamps another 8 bars of the offertory? ** Lillith Fair**, join in any time! (she’s both our organist and the financial officer at our church). It sounds like it would be easier to use a small garbage bag, but they aren’t self-sealing, and darned unattractive sitting atop the altar. So maybe someone in the church could construct an attractive box…with a lock…that the offering plates could be dumped into in a hurry, and then the box placed on the altar until the counters pick it up after the service…and of course, there are two counters…sort of a We Three Kings type of vessel.

A church I once went to had cloth bags held open by a wire loop sewn into the neck, to which a pair of wooden handles were affixed - like this - it makes it easy to pass along the rows, easy to drop things in, but hard to take things out without being noticed.

But it sounds like the problem you’re describing might be with the people taking up the collection, rather than members of the congregation, in which case you need administrative integrity, rather than physical preventive measures. When I was treasurer for a while, I used to insist someone else witnessed the count-up - they usually protested that they trusted me to do it alone, but it wasn’t only about trust, it was also about me being able to account for myself and being pre-emptively immune to all possible suspicion or accusation.

As far as holding up Mass, I hadn’t heard it before attending where I go now, but they consider it inappropriate to take the money up with the bread and wine*. The individual baskets get dumped into one bin and that it taken discreetly up the side aisle to some inner sanctum somewhere. So this would allow time for the bag sealing and transfer while Mass continues.
*I still am not quite sure why it was deemed inappropriate since it’s one of the gifts to be celebrated.

8½" x 11" seems about the size of the bag we’re using - and it looks like it was printed for all the churches in the diocese. We’re a small church so we have just 4 baskets for 1-collection Mass, 8 for 2-collections. We don’t waste any time trying to be neat. I hold the bag open and each usher in turn grabs the stuff from his basket and stuffs it in the bag. We are about as subtle as the money changers in the temple that the Lord threw out. :smiley:

When the job’s done, I place the bag in a special basket (deep enough to hide the whole bag). So the procession proceeds to the altar - altar boys with candles, usher with the collection bag, parishioner with the bread and wine. The usher tucks the the basket under the left side of the altar (as we look at it), more or less out of sight.

Like I said earlier, next Sunday, I’m gonna use the trash bag, and not many will see it. Then I’ll stand back to await developments. With luck the Pastor will say the Mass and if things go much faster than usual, he’ll appreciate it.

Dominus vobiscum.