Ok I have a primary and secondary sump pump in my basement. My primary is a run-of-the-mill sump pump, and my secondary is a fancier one with battery back up.
I want the secondary to get as little wear as possible, which should only happen if the primary breaks. I don’t need to know when both fail I have a flood detector for that. This needs to be known well before that.
What need a device or devices with a loud audible alarm that will alert me if the primary breaks (e.g. no electricity pulled over x time) , or that will alert me when the secondary is being used (pulling electricity). I am no wizard at this but I assume the second would be easier to pull off than the first.
Sump Pumps should work by floats. Your secondary pump should be positioned higher in the sump than the primary. Then the secondary will only kick on if there is no power and the water level gets high enough to turn on the secondary.
As to alerts, that gets trickier. What is your budget for this project? One of the simplest things to do would be a power failure alarm. I haven’t priced one of these in over a decade. Try using this phrase “power failure alert” to search the store of your choice like Amazon, Lowes or Home Depot.
Yeah, the primary is positioned lower. In theory the secondary should never go off. I’m also aware of the floats and that the produce contact that draws power.
I looked on Amazon, and I can’t see how a power failure alarm would work. Power isn’t the issue. What I need, I think, is a “power being used” alarm. Something that goes between the outlet and the secondary sump pump, that screeches when it is drawing power.
Just to reiterate, this isn’t a “the basements flooding” problem I’m looking to fix. I have a flood detector. This is a “your primary isnt working and you need to see why” problem.
If I understand correctly: you just want to know when your secondary pumps turns on, since that will let you know your primary pump has failed?
I’m not clear why you seem to eliminate the idea of moving your flood detector or buying a second one. It seems to me that would address your problem perfectly.
Just put your flood detector (or a second one) somewhere between the level of the primary pump and the secondary pump, so it will give you advance warning that the primary pump has failed? I’m not sure what kind you have, there is a huge range out there but basic ones start at only about $29 each, which seems like a pretty cheap option to me.
Mine was about $50 with a couple bells and whistles vs a basic. They all link into wifi and most can be mounted anywhere. I get a signal on my phone soon as it detects water. There’s even an extension option to go down into a sump hole. https://meetflo.com/product/smart-water-detector
When we’re out of the country, my “home monitoring system” lets me know if the power goes out, which would also be a concern in your case. The system sends a test ping every so often and if my phone fails to get it I get a notified since the only reason for that would be a power failure. I then get a neighbour to check the house.
If you just want to know when the second pump is running, it should be as simple as wiring a mains-voltage buzzer / siren / alarm / light in parallel with the pump motor. When the float switch closes, it will activate both.
How handy are you with basic circuits? There are meters like this that can measure current and sound an alarm if the draw goes over a certain threshold. However, it would require putting together a kind of electrical panel that the pump plugs into, and which itself plugs into the wall, with some allowance for the current sense transformer and powering the measurement box. Wouldn’t cost more than $40 to put together but might be beyond your skill set.
I’m more familiar with alternating lift pump setups with seperate controllers, not so much residential basements but, if your secondary pump and float are hight than the primary i would consider driving a relay with the secondary float. One set of relay contacts to start the pump, and a second set to trigger an alarm. This would have the added benefit of triggering an alarm not just if the primary pump failed but also if it were overwhelmed. A third higher float to trigger the alarm only would signal the same thing without the added complexity of the relay but both are fairly simple in the grand scheme.
If it’s any help, this is my secondary sump pump. As you can see by the cost, I do not want this wearing out. The lit panel mostly has indicators if something is wrong with the battery, but one of them (the “Pump” one) indicates if the pump has been used. That’s great and all, but it’s just a light and I hardly ever go down in the basement. I want something audible.
There are some pumps with a cord that comes from the float switch. It’s like an extension cord with a socket on it, and the pump plugs into that. So other devices can be powered by that float switch like some kind of alarm. I haven’t seen that configuration in any of the battery backups though,. But since your backup should be installed higher up than the primary you can use a flood detector type switch at that higher water level. It shouldn’t reach that level if the primary is working. You will have to have a battery powered flood detector for it to work during power failures.
Looks like you got this covered but my secondary, battery backup does this by default. It has come on twice since I got it - once when there was hella rain and the main pump was overwhelmed so both were working but the power was still on. The second time was last week when the power went out and it was only the secondary battery pump working. If the secondary is engaged at all, the alarm goes off until I shut off the alarm, much to my dog’s dismay.
I suspect you’d have to get a new battery setup to have what I’ve got, so the add-on you found should suffice.
Now that you have this figured out, you should reconsider the goal of having the second pump run as little as possible. The pump should regularly run at least a little bit, perhaps an hour or so per month. Having it sitting in water for months without running increases the likelihood of it not running if the primary pump fails.
Or run them in a lead-lag configuration so they alternate pumping.
Is that the unit on the left side of picture in the link from your previous response? It was hard to read the manual from my phone but it looks like it comes with relay output terminals on the right side, I’d assume to trigger an announciator or some other device, in addition to the email/text notifications.
Most lift stations I’ve worked on have been configured like this but they’ve all had alternating relays and multiple floats at least. As I recall if they reached alarm level they’d fire both pumps till low level is reached. Do they make those setups for residential applications?
Yeah, that’s exactly what I am thinking of, and to be honest that level of controls and relays is probably beyond what the OP is willing to do (and I don’t blame him, it is overkill and an extra expense for a residential application).
I would, however, still recommend that the backup pump be run about perhaps one half hour per month, even if the OP has to do it manually. Could even be just a few minutes at minimum. OP, I know that you want to minimize the wear on this pump, but please run it at least once a month or two. Mechanical items like pumps need to be run every so often.