“the day islam struck america”
“9/11” means November 9th in more countries than not - and this is very weird because November 9th was the Krystallnacht (sp?), or “Night of the Breaking Glass”, when the Nazis lead raids on Jewish businesses and homes. It’s generally regarded as the start of the Holocaust.
Especially weird considering the strong alliance and affinity between Muslim leaders and the Nazis.
It’s Kristallnacht and which strong affinity is this?
>>Napier:
Especially weird considering the strong alliance and affinity between Muslim leaders and the Nazis
MC Master of Cermonies:
It’s Kristallnacht and which strong affinity is this?<<
Hmm, I’m wondering the same thing.
According to Nazi definition, Muslims were not “fit to live.” Sadly, this is still truth as it is an issue here among the skins (what most people in the US call Neo-Nazis). Violent crime against “foreigners” is higher among people of Turkish and Bosnian descent (as well as various African nations) which make up a huge percentage of our Muslim population (ca. 1.5-2 million).
Unless you meant affinity as far as an extremist branch that believes in the same basic prinicple that “because someone is XXX, that someone should die” but you’ll find examples of that type of person in virtually every group/politic/religion/country.
In answer to the original question, we refer to it as 11th September. I grew up in the US, so it’s September 11th to me. For the record, nine-one-one and nine-eleven irritate the bleep out of me, too.
A question for non-Americans:
If the Bush administration hadn’t taken the terrorist attacks against us on 09/11/00 as a first step in this supposed “War on Terror”, do you think your respective countries or the International Community as a whole would have paid much attention to it?
Personally, when I read the OP, I assumed the answers would have been along the line of “that thing that happened about a year and a half ago in New York” because A) I didn’t take America’s ensuing hawkishness into account and B) terrorism is more expected worldwide.
I mean, a building being blown up in Ireland, Israel, some Eastern European country or even Russia would have gotten about a week’s coverage at best and then be promptly forgotten stateside. I was sort of expecting the same attitude from the world (it’s only fair… right?) and was a little surprised that I was wrong.
So… is it our ever stronger militant posturing that’s keeping this in the world’s collective consciousness or actual empathy?
Gah, I meant 09/11/01.
I’m not stupid… really. I can be quite intelligent at times.
How original of you, Spiff. Are you saying that the United States deserved to have that mass murder?
It started out as “September 11” in Australia (well, no, that’s not entirely true. It started out as “HOLY FUCKING SHIT!!!”, which I’m sure was universal). I’ve also heard “Nine-Eleven” a bit, but “Nine-One-One” seems to have taken over. I think it’s seen more as a name than a date, so there’s not really the confusion one would think. It’s similar to Australians saying “Union Pacific Railroad”, despite the fact we use the term railway. It’s just a name.
Do people outside the US understand the significance of the 9-1-1 designation? Is this a universal emergency phone number in other countries too? I really think this is the reason the name has stuck around in this format.
Yes, we know about the 911 emergency number. It’s 000 here in Australia, and I believe 999 in the UK. I don’t think any serious connection has been made between 9-1-1 and 911 though.
We have 111 as our emergency number here, so like Australia there’s no mixup with the American version. We see the “911” as the emergency number often enough in TV shows from the States.
The sheer magnitude of the deaths, the way in which it happened, would have brought long-lasting international attention to the events of September 11 for longer than just the length of a few months, I would say. There is still talk here of events such as the seige of the Branch Davidians at Waco, and the Oklahoma bombing. Plus, you have the conspiracy-fertile ingredient of the Internet. While television created a global village, the Internet made everyone’s backyard accessible to all.
Most people around here (not me, though) say “nine-eleven” when referring to the emergency number, so I do think that’s the only reason they refer to the date as “nine-eleven,” instead of a more conventional “September 11th,” etc. IF the date had less significance, say “9-12,” I seriously doubt that the name “nine-twelve” would have been used.
In Germany (and most of W Eupoe, I think) it’s just Sept. 11. Everyone knows what that means and it’s taken very seriously.
9/11 would still have gotten more international attention and more media coverage than other terrorist attacks because of the magnitude and locale. Bombings in Israel are, unfortunately, commonplace and they don’t usually take out several thousand people in a matter of hours. 9/11 was unique.
Overseas, The War on Terror actually pushes 9/11 farther from the world’s collective consciousness . Outside the US the two aren’t really seen as cause and effect. 9/11 generated a lot of care and sympathy for the American people. But since Afghanistan, the WoT is seen as something the US gov’t just uses as carte blanche. Unfortunately the US’s image has swung from victim to aggressor in the last year.
In the UK a senior civil servant (Jo Moore) in the Department of Transport released a (later leaked) memo saying something to the effect of that the aftermath of 9-11 would be a good time for her department to release and ‘bury’ any bad news. There was a huge public outcry after this and as a result her posistion eventually became untenable and she was forced to resign.
Most likely. Because it affected not only Americans, but many other nations as well. Just because it happened on your soil, doesn’t mean it doesn’t affect us.
Having said that, I’m not sure whether Australia would have quite willingly gone into the “War On Terror” if someone else (and not Bush) was spearheading it (our PM is a bit of a brown-nose in regards to George Dubya).
Perhaps having mostly to do with our loose and selective definition of “terrorism” and our incredibly un-Democratic methods of judging guilt. :rolleyes:
People respond much more strongly to one large event (9-11, Pearl Harbor, D-Day) than to several smaller events (Past 20 years, Battle of the Atlantic, Operation Torch/Invasion of Italy). It is easier for them to see and relate to, and takes much less understanding of the issues at heart. More than that, because it was successful.
That, and the fact that it is obviously landmark as the first serious attack on the continental United States since… um… a damn long time. That, more than the source of the attack, was more shocking to Americans, sinec we don’t pay attention to those little events that lead up (quite obviously, a good chunk of people who pay attention who have been waiting for this for at least a decade) to it.
More on point, I kinda expect the vague “9-11” term to fall out of use in a few years, with something more like “World Trade Center attacks”, historically speaking.
In Hebrew we have the word pigua, which comes from the same root as “hit”, “hurt” or “casualty”. It means “terrorist attack”. Now, considering how common they’ve become around here, Israelis simply call them by their location - the “Park Hotel Pigua”, “the Sbarro Pigua”, “the Dizengoff St. Pigua”.
By that logic, Isralis refer to 9.11 as “the Twin Towers Pigua”. I suppose this means we don’t see it as an isolated event.
You shouldn’t. It isn’t. it is only isolated in relativity and audacity.
In 2002, about 450 Palestinians and 200 Israelies (most of both civilians and more accurately 460 and 190, sourced from AI’s 2002 Report) managed to kill each other. Not much compared to WTC, but build up the numbers over the past, oh, 50 years. In many parts of the world, 4000-5000 people have been killed in the past decade without anyone batting an eye.
Americans simply didn’t realize that the passing news item about the USS Cole, bombed embassies, miltary barracks, etc balmed on some Saudi dissident would actually be quite relevant. Makes you pause and think about the dozens of news items of similar standing that you ignore every day, doesn’t it?
Call me a pessimist, but I think we lost the idealistic battle. They made their message, changed our lives as intented, and we are responding via the expected means which will result in further protest and international friction.
On the other hand, at least more Americans pay a bit more attention to the international news. On the other other hand, I strongly doubt more than a handful (probably those attending university or in government) know what the ICC is.
Kinda sad, that the United Nations, once considered the most profound advent of the Second World War and often the camel’s hair that kept things together during the Cold War is now tossed by the wayside like a shoe because it makes itself impotent. I might even consider 9-11 more the Day the United Nations Died than anything else.
Before anyone thinks about flaming me for being soft, I think it is fully right to hunt down those SOBs and take their balls, just as it is to hunt down hundreds of other similar leaders and organizations (a good number of which are supported by the US). I just think the process should end at an international standard. Of course, America is terrified of that very thing.
India - we generally refer to it as the 11th of September…
Absolutely right. I think we’ve lost count of the number of people killed in Kashmirover the past decade and a half.
And yeah, I doubt my country would have forgotten about the attacks that easily, because IIRC, Indians were the community with the second or third highest number of fatalities that day.
At one time, in one place? Please be so kind as to provide proof of that.