um what are you talking about. it’s a right-sided perception of the aclu explaining their political philosophy … which ultimately controls their motives and actions. Why is this not relevant?
I submit again… the difference between a Christian nation and a Christian government is a big difference. And I’m not sold we’ve ever been either.
The Bill of Rights is about protecting our rights in general. If we let them go a little here, a little there… because the sound bites sound convincing… we’re in for a real shocker. The Bill of Rights are HUGE. And ANYONE who defends them is doing good work.
First, your citation needs a citation as it’s an opinion piece. As such offers little in the way of “why I feel this way” and more of “let me tell you how I feel”.
Second, this is gonna blow all up. And it’s gonna be funny as heck. I want me some popcorn so I can enjoy the good entertainment when it shows up.
I expect some good smack down talk soon. Unless the vitriol tones down…
Defending the rights of the invidual, in other words.
They don’t oppose “school choice,” they oppose the scam to funnel tax payer money to fund religious indoctrination.
I have no idea what this means, but I am confident that it’s bullshit.
I’m sure you’ll agree that this all complete bilge, though? “Purges and gulags?”
I don’t detect any vitriolic tones here. the citation is an opinion piece based on the political philosophies as well as actions of the aclu. If anyone wants to understand why the right is cautious of the aclu’s motives, this should give you a good understanding as to why. It’s a beginning, at least.
If you knew anything about christians or the right, you would understand they have a deep distrust for communism. They see it as an infringement on religous freedom and basic human rights. if the aclu co-founder claims to be a communist, this will automatically raise flags. big time.
I consider myself a libertarian. I believe in the civil liberties that the ACLU tries to protect. Hell, I think many of my views are even more radically libertarian than the ACLU’s.
But I often find myself amongst the ranks of the ACLU bashers.
You see, every time the ACLU manages to get a new right recognized as “fundamental” by the Supreme Court, they’re doing more harm than good. They fight for power to be centralized in the Federal government, and for increased judicial intervention in social policy. I believe that power should be decentralized as much as possible, and that the legislature is the proper body for lawmaking.
When such decisions come down, it reinforces people’s belief that the Federal government should be the organization in charge of individual liberties. It encourages voters to pay less attention to State politics. It encourages State governments to trample on individual civil liberties, secure in the knowledge that if they go too far, the Fed will step in to help. And it encourages the Federal government to step up efforts to regulate smaller and smaller details of the individual’s life.
The Federal government should not be in charge of individual liberties. There is not a single universal morality out there. People in different places have different stances on different issues. The smaller the divisions in government are, the more accurately the government can represent its constituency. People in California want to be able to smoke pot but not have guns? Great. Do it. People in Montana want to be able to own guns but not smoke pot? Fantastic. Vote for that State legislator next election. If your state legislature is limiting your rights, the proper forum of redress is the voting booth, not the Temple of Justice in D.C…
If the ACLU would stick to lobbying the Federal legislature (and State, I suppose), and litigating in State courts, I would get behind them 100%. But when they litigate in Federal court, they are trying to apply a morality to me for which I never voted. It just so happens that I tend to agree with those morals most of the time, but I don’t want the Federal government dictating them to me. And I certainly don’t want non-elected officials dictating them to me.
It isn’t a beginning, it’s totally devoid of fact. As you said, it’s an opinion piece. It isn’t the actual political philosophy of the ACLU, it’s how that person perceives it.
That’s rather amusing, considering basic human rights and freedoms are what the ACLU is all about.
IF you believe that what’s wrong with us today is we don’t worship the Christian God properly, and IF you believe that the USA was founded so you could force everyone to worship God as you see fit, then the ACLU is a serious threat.
Thank God.
Why don’t you tell us what you think communism is, and how expanding the rights of citizens promotes it?
Communism is the lack of capitalism which takes away a man’s rights to life liberty and the pursuit of happiness. it is the removal of personal and religious freedom.
That’s the short version.
Where am I wrong?
Until a year and a half ago I was a fundie. What’s changed since then?
Incidentally, organizations change.
Didja know that at one point the Free Masons was a group of masons? At one point Democrats were the racist ones. Republicans worked to end slavery - and weren’t bothered by Jim Crow. Organizations change.
Let’s have fun with this then. Thomas Jefferson was a slave owner. How does that inform your interpretation of our current government?
Sadly, this post seems to have been ignored. JohnnieEnigma, you may want to hit that link.
Incidentally…stop saying “communism.” I do not think it means what you think it means.
Inconceivable!
that’s the thing, I don’t think what you’re suggesting. I think that non believers should do their thing and believer should be left alone to do their own thing. How is my praying in public a problem for anyone else? I never did get that whole ‘separation’ thing anyway… I’m mostly focusing on religious freedom. It does not mean that I’m trying to take away anyone’s rights to not believe.
I did read it, it’s very encouraging. Thanks for posting it…
If your faith is such that you place no restrictions or expectations on others, then you are fine.
If you are in a public school or gov’t cafeteria and you want to bow your head to pray before you eat - there’s really not a thing wrong with it and I would totally support that right as it is CONSISTENT with the first amendment.
If you want to expect others to do the same - you start stepping out into thin ice.
Believers SHOULD BE left alone to do their thing - insofar as they allow non-believers to do theirs. And not expect their tax dollars to fund it.
A lot of people do not like the radical re-interpretation of the Constitution that occurred in the 20th century (especially the second half). They further do not like the idea of a bunch of unelected judges changing what the Constitution was understood to mean. The ACLU was an instrumental part of this radical re-interpretation of the Constitution.
Whether you agree with or disagree with the results of this radical re-interpretation you cannot deny that it happened, or that the ACLU was an instrumental part of this re-interpretation.
I am sure the media in the Muslim world gets as much play out of our fight over religion as we do over their’s. And so their perceptions of us are very skewed away from reality. The polling shows that 82% of Americans prefer Christianity over other beliefs or lack thereof. see page 49 of pew research .
So when the headlines reads “10 commandments are removed from the court house lawn” and repeated over and over and over it is no wonder we are considered a bunch of f…king infidels. In the matter of separation of church and state the ACLU are a bunch of morons on a power trip disrupting 82% of the peoples lives just because they can.
Teenagers today have nothing better to do today than shoot each other. The ACLU has been stopping the use of public schools by Boy Scouts and Girl Scouts so teenagers can’t find fellowship there. What next for the ACLU, attacking Future Farmers of America because working in the soil infringes on the rights of illegal Mexicans, or 4H clubs because picking clovers will contribute to global warming.
Jesus H Christ, The ACLU should focus on z (the effect their actions have on the young in our society).
I am going to press the submit button now and I don’t care what anyone thinks of my 2 rants worth.
That it applies to everyone, not just white men? Damn those activist judges…
I do not understand what you are trying to communicate.