What do we, as a society, do about pedophilia?

Great Debates
81

Since children are not capable of consenting to sex, pedophilia is wanting to rape children by definition.

No, they can’t.

Good-bye.

Regards,
Shodan

82

wanting to fly is the same as wanting to die from falling from the sky and dying an horrible death because of gravity.

Since people cant fly in reality, people who dream of flying are people who want to die, since flying is impossible.

Great logic you have there.

83

Well, sort of. Falling is a necessary consequence of trying to fly without wings or planes. Raping children is a necessary consequence of having sex with them.

Someone may want to fly without wings, but they won’t be able to, and so the consequence is included necessarily. Likewise with filth who want to have sex with children.

It is less objectionable when someone wishes himself into attempts to fly without wings, because it is self-limiting behavior. Not so with the subhuman scum who wish themselves into raping children. Their behavior must be limited in other, less directly connected ways.

Put it this way - I hope everyone who wants to rape children tries out the notion of wishing for the impossible by going up to the top of some skyscraper and jumping off. If they reach ground level, then it will be clearer why reality doesn’t respond to contradictory wishes.

Forgoing the usual for obvious reasons.

84

Your premise doesn’t follow. Homo/heterosexuality is not related to pedophilia/ephebophilia in terms of why ephebophilia is somewhat more understandable.

The differentiation between pedophilia and ephebophilia is in that suffers of the latter are attracted to people who show signs of sexual maturity but not necessarily emotional maturity. The differences between a 18-yr-old person and a 14-yr-old person are small compared to the differences between a post-pubescent 14-yr-old and a pre-pubescent 10-yr-old–those differences are still there, mind you, and still form a sound basis for punishing adults who have sex with teenagers.

It’s plausible to consider that at least some ephebophiles are simply possessed of neurotypical sexual desires and incredibly poor judgement, and can be trivially rehabilitated. Conversely, there is almost no chance a pedophile has neurotypical sexual desires.

85

Andrew Vachss speaks on the subject. He is considered one of the world’s experts on it.

86

Well, yes, sure. Because it is abnormal.

It’s not even a heterosexual normative; gays also want partners who are sexually developed.

87

I’ve figured out my problem with the whole “being attracted to a 15 year old is not the same as being attracted to an eight year old” argument.

The problem with pedophilia is not that it is abnormal or unusual. The problem is that it hurts people. And getting raped at 14 is not that much less traumatic as getting raped at 8. People who are sexually assaulted, especially by trusted adults, at that age usually end up with some serious trauma.

When I look at “barely legal” sites, I’m not seeing a lot of “here is an attractive lady who also happens to be relatively young.” I see the fetishization of the age itself. I see a lot of stuff saying “watch this innocent young teen get mercilessly banged” and “she just turned 18 yesterday and now she’s giving daddy a blow job” and things of that nature- that’s not about getting off on sexy ladies. This is getting off on the destruction of innocence, the breaking of taboos, and other shady stuff like that.

Yes, cultures in the past married girls off young (though by no means universally). Those cultures also, coincidentally, tended not to give a flying fuck about the quality of women’s lives. They could care less if a woman gets a fistula from giving birth too young, or if she suffers unfix-able psychic harm. These are cultures where the difference between wives and slaves is relatively hard to distinguish, where women are forced to work and perform sex acts under the risk of being beaten or killed, with no option to change their situation. Citing cultures that treat women as disposable property doesn’t really uphold your case.

88

Not at all. Raping children is a necessary consequence of… well, raping children. Consensual sex is not rape.

People who want to have sex with children are not “filth”, just like people who want to have sex with women arent. I dont judge people based on their sexual orientation.

You still ignore my point. Even if ALL sex with children is “rape”, wanting to have consensual sex with a child is not the same as wanting to rape, just like wanting to, say, have a mansion in Beverly Hills and be millionare is not the same as wanting to rob a bank to buy one. They are two different thoughts.

And what would you call “neourotypical desires”? Being attracted to what YOU are attracted is a “neurotyipical desire”, while everything else is a “mental illness”?

Is it wrong to have “non-neurotypical desires”? Is it wrong to not share what many people like? Of course not! Its just a different expression of human sexuality, nothing wrong about being different.

Even if pedophilia is a “non-neurotypical desire”, that doesnt mean that pedophiles cant control themselves or are more likely to offend than a person with “neurotypical desires”. Most crimes in the world are done by heterosexual people (i.e., with “neurotypical” desires) and not by pedophiles.

Most people who do harm in the world have “neurotypical sexual desires” and are attracted to grown-ups, not to children.

Indeed, but that doesnt mean that being attracted to non-sexually developed is “abnormal”, just like not being attracted to the opposite sex is not “abnormal”.

Why do you define “normality” in terms of sexual development and not in terms of intrinsic feelings and actual behaviour?

I think that a pedophile who is platonically attracted to little girls and would never ever harm one, is more normal than a straight man who hits his wife and treats women like shit. Do you agree or no? If not, why?

89

Those sites are targeted to heterosexual men, who mostly tend to like young looking girls. Its really common. I dont like introducing psychoanalisis to the things people lile. If all the girls in those sites are over 18, I dont really care WHY people watch it. People are complex, I dont think it would be a good idea to generalize.

I never cited any culture like that. And I recognize the abuse that a lot of women and children had to suffer throughout history. Did you read what I wrote?

90

The question must be asked. Why not?

It is a given that pedos are a danger to children, that they cannot be cured, and that they will re-offend if released from prison. Why burden society with the cost of keeping them alive?

I know that sounds hard-assed and all that, but it’s a serious question.

91

I think the discussion is more about what to do about those who are sexually attracted to children but have not actually done anything about it.

92

People attracted to children do not necessarily rape kids, just like people attracted to women do not necessarily rape women. Pedophile is not the same as child molester/predator/whatever you want to call it. Many pedophiles know that its horrid to harm another person. Not only that, they repulse child abuse just like any other people. People dont choose their sexual orientation.

93

Someone earlier (can’t be bothered to look it up) mentioned among the variety of human sexuality, people who absolutely need a particular kind of shoe for sexual satisfaction (not saying that’s wrong, just looking at where it comes from). To me (but please correct me if I’m wrong!), that suggests there must be two different origins of sexuality:

  1. You’re born that way. The evidence that I know of strongly suggests this is the case for the spectrum of homo- & heterosexuality. It seems likely to be something that develops in the womb.
  2. It develops later, when for some reason the brain connects something (be it age/object/other) to sexuality. I’m sure there is no hormone secreted during pregnancy that can make an unborn baby like only red stilettos with black lace. (OK, no cite & we know little about the brain etc, but I can be fairly sure of this, right?)

So what happens for people who want sex with children? One, two, or both? Some posters were already saying it had been decided one way or the other, so if there is more information out there, I would like to know. It would be useful to know in terms of diagnosing as well, I should think.

Regardless of origins, we clearly need to find a better way of dealing with peadophiles and perhaps other people who are just not safe in our society. But I think for this longterm solution we need the answer to the question of the origin of peadophilia.

94

Because it’s illegal, basically. Maybe the law could be changed. Maybe not. It would probably be better for society, as a whole, if proven pedophiles were killed. That kind of conflicts with our current system of ethics in America - but it’s right on the edge. I would bet money that more than fifty percent of all Americans would be okay with the death penalty for pedophilia (not just for committing pedophilia - I’m talking about executing people just for being pedophiles.)

I am referring here to genuine pedophilia. Not an attraction to 15 or even 14 year olds. Basically, 12 and under.

95

Killing people for having a different sexual orientation.

[noparse]http://www.somethingyoushouldread.com/images/visuals/nyplate_vomit.jpg[/noparse]

[noparse]http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r70/chihlidog/puke.jpg[/noparse]

96

Hey, I’m not saying that I am in favor of doing this. But I think the majority of America, whether they want to admit it or not, probably is. Pedophiles are about the only people, with the possible exception of terrorists, that lots of Americans seem to openly fantasize about killing. I feel like even terrorists don’t get people worked up in the same way.

97

I think that part of the reason this is perceived as an acceptable alternative is because people generally believe that a very, very small percent of the population falls into this category- like 1/100th of 1%. While still a significant number of people overall, it is so deviant and rare that such an extreme solution could be justified. However, what if the actual number of individuals that possess these tendencies is much larger- perhaps closer to 10%?

98

There is no such thing as consensual sex with children, because children cannot give consent. Therefore all sex with children is rape, and the desire to have sex with children is the desire to rape them. QED.

Yes, they are filth, and the worst and most disgusting kind. Just like people who want to rape women are filth. Rapists are filth. Child molesters are filth.

In the case of rapists and child molesters, you are making a serious mistake.

I’m not ignoring it; it’s wrong. It is possible to be a millionaire without robbing banks. It is not possible to have consensual sex with a child. Therefore the wish to have sex with a child is the wish to rape that child. “Sex with a child” and “rape of a child” are not different thoughts; they are the same thought in different words.

No it is not. The desire to rape is not just a different expression of human sexuality, and there is a great deal wrong with it.

Being attracted to the non-sexually developed is abnormal, both in the statistical and the clinical senses of the word.
[QUOTE=Clothahump]
It is a given that pedos are a danger to children, that they cannot be cured, and that they will re-offend if released from prison.
[/QUOTE]
I don’t think it is quite a given. IIUC, there are characteristics of pedophilic offenders that correlate strongly with recidivism. Our own Dr. **Qadgop the Mercotan ** cited the guidelines some time back.

As I recall, the best predictors were if the offender had attacked more than five children, attacked children outside his family, and attacked male children. Perhaps later I can see if I can dig up the cite.

Regards,
Shodan

99

There are no new Human problems. Every Human problem has existed since the first Humans existed.

But there can be new solutions.

100

Showing photos of vomiting drunk frat boys is not an argument.
If you can’t express yourself in words, then you probably are not posting in the correct forum, (or board).

[ /Moderating ]