And this is where these tests can start getting some really weird results.
If you had asked me, as a child, to draw a portrait of someone, you would have been given a circle with a a couple of other circles and a two squiggly lines. That’s not because I was particularly unintelligent, it was because I realised early on that I wasn’t particularly good at drawing, and that any picture I produced would have approximately no relationship to the person I was trying to draw. So I would have presumably scored incredibly low in this test.
This seems once again like one of those “learned” abilities needed just to to take the test. If you had asked me to describe the person so that someone else could draw them, I’m sure I would have been able to describe eyebrows, ears and so forth. But asking me to draw a person would have been like asking me to lift a 5 tonne weight. I knew I couldn’t possible succeed, so why bother to try?
The question really should have been “What does being of average intelligence imply in terms of mental capacity vs. people who are smarter?”
I was just hoping by giving something measurable, that we could avoid the whole question of “Just what does average intelligence mean?”, but I suppose I just traded that for “What do IQ tests really test?”.
What I’m getting at is that I’m curious what being a person of average intelligence implies, and what can / can’t they do or understand or typically enjoy or not enjoy? Shagnasty’s final sentence of his first post is the closest thing to it, but I think I’m looking for somewhat more detailed answers.
You are referring to an IT IQ then. I know some people that cannot tie their shoe laces, but can Code and operate a computer brilliantly.
Intelligence varies and an IQ tests only gives a score to the specified questions, so you can compare the knowledge of people within that field of questions.
Some brains work better with visuals, some better with numbers and others with words.
Getting a PhD was one of the first things I wondered about when I saw the OP. Personal experience and the experience of others I know says that getting a bachelor’s degree is mostly a matter of effort (don’t give up, devote enough time, etc.), at least if you’re willing to major in something that you’re good at.
I got an acceptance letter for an MS grad program recently (haven’t accepted yet), so maybe I’ll find out how much different grad school really is.
Are there any studies on IQ and success in graduate programs (master’s or doctoral), or are there any programs that actually give IQ tests to applicants and use that as a decision making tool? E.g. “Sorry, your GPA is good enough, but we require at least a 115 IQ for the MA in Cool Stuff. You’ll need to get an IQ retest or a skills waiver for special admittance to be admitted.”
Before you respond, no, the GRE is not an IQ test. It looks like the MAT test, which is sometimes used for graduate admittance, is accepted by Mensa, so maybe it is an IQ test.
The GRE correlates well with intelligence tests, that’s why Mensa accepts it. They also accept the Miller Analogies, which is how I got in.
I still don’t think the OP was answered. An IQ of 100 means you are not likely to make it through college, at least on your own merit. We all know people with IQs of 100. They work in retail and work on cars and plumbing. I daresay few on this board have many people in their social circle with IQs as low as 100.
No, the GRE no longer considered good for Mensa. They similarly dropped the SAT after deciding it wasn’t, or was no longer, an IQ test.
Didn’t realize that the GMAT and LSAT are accepted, so maybe my idea that graduate schools don’t test IQ may be wrong, especially if the GRE is correlated with IQ, even if it is not considered a formal IQ test.
“Lord St. John Edward Hubert Featherinstonehaugh-St. Croix is trying to get to the polo match on time. His chauffeur is nowhere to be seen and the vicar is delaying his departure with pleasantries and extra helpings of cucumber sandwiches. Now, what percentage of the help should he fire this Christmastide in order to pay for fetching new gardens?”
IME intelligence is useful for grad programs, but hardly essential, and they can contain many idiots. The main difference between BA/BS and grad degrees is that you can leave any time with the former, have more options, etc. Both require effort, the latter is just something that self-selects people who may be smart, but above all either have the drive (or at least think they do) to do a tough job for several years and look forward to that.
Second: congratulations. IMHO one of the most important parts of grad school is whether your advisor is a good person, and is interested in your education/learning along with getting research done.
I’ve never heard of IQ being used in admissions. In some fields it would probably be politically incorrect. At least in the sciences, GRE mostly serves as a minimum cutoff for admissions, a guy with analytical 1500 isn’t necessarily more desirable than someone with 1470. Research experience is often most important, and other things like GRE or GPA could be tie breakers.
You only hang out with 16% of the population? Must be an exclusive club there. But I of course agree, I will only deign to be friends with someone if they complete an IQ test in my presence and score at least 2 standard deviations above mean. Can’t be too careful, these days. Wouldn’t want to hang around any mechanics or… shudder… teachers.
And there’s an interesting thing to consider with this. If a test is shown to have a strong positive statistical correlation with some trait, but the test doesn’t actually test for the trait in a direct way or fails face validity, is it actually a test of that trait? For example, if someone showed that getting a high score on the original Super Mario Bros. video game is strongly negatively correlated with getting into traffic accidents (the higher score you get, the fewer crashes you tend to have on a per year or per decade basis), would it be fair to call Super Mario Bros. a “driving test” or maybe even require a minimum SMB score to get a driver’s license? The idea sounds fascinating and even makes a little sense when you consider that video games and driving both depend on quick thinking and hand-eye coordination, but I doubt many people are going to be keen on having their right to drive riding on stomping enemies and grabbing coins in a game.
Anyway, does anyone know if IQ is used in acceptance processes for any sort of program, organization, license, etc., other than High IQ societies like Mensa, where a score of 100 is considered too low? That could help answer the OP because it would establish that there is a perception that a 100 IQ is correlated with not being able to do something, or not being able to do it well enough for some purpose. I know that IQ tests may be used to establish a person’s qualifications for benefits as a person with developmental disabilities (e.g. what used to be called “being retarded”), but in those cases an IQ of 100 would mean that you are not disabled. I’m talking about a situation where e.g. a governmental agency came down and said that even though John got an MD and passed the medical board exams, he doesn’t qualify for a license to practice medicine because a license also requires at least a 110 IQ and John has a 100.
, math problems that people who score 100 overall are unlikely to get right while those that score over 130 are quite likely to answer correctly.
My understanding of match is pathetic…long division is a challenge for me never mind anything such as calculus; does being really poor at math automatically mean I wouldn’t to do well on an IQ test?
Having an average IQ means that you probably won’t get filthy rich based on your own ideas and inventions. However, people with average IQ are more accepted by society at large, so they’ll have an easier time moving up corporate ladders or social ladders to any level that doesn’t require an exceptional intelligence. People with average IQ can have satisfactory careers in retail management, auto sales, fashion modeling and plumbing.
On the other hand, if someone with a Mensa IQ isn’t able to get a career in a higher echelon field such as engineering or medicine, they’ll likely have a rough time of it in most occupations except teaching, and may be viewed as dumb or inept by a supervisor who has an average IQ because they can’t concentrate on mundane details all day long without going crazy.
It may be worth looking at the average childhood age that 130 IQ adults had a 100 IQ at. If the average childhood age for 100 IQ, for the subsection of adults with 130 IQ, is 10, then examine your own mental processes at age 10 (assuming that your adult IQ is 130). Did you often draw the wrong conclusions and make incorrect decisions, or did you simply lack insight?
I think most employers that have an expectation that a prospective employee has a certain level of intelligence rely upon scholastic certification, e.g., must have graduated high school or have a GED; or have a BA, or an MA, or a doctorate.
Some employers do have their own internal examinations which act like an IQ test but isn’t rated as specifically as an IQ test, e.g., public employment entrance examinations.
It has not been unheard of for some organizations to use a specific IQ test for prospective employees. Some Catholic dioceses use an IQ test (in addition to a battery of other criteria) for seminary applicants.
The generalities I have heard is the average for a high school graduate is about 103 (since people on the low end who bring down the average drop out, people in the 70s and 80s are less likely to graduate obviously) while for college grads it is about 115.
However I think those are averages, no idea about the medians. A small percent of dropouts can push up the HS average while a small percent of geniuses (I’ve read people in the genius+ level are 25-50x more likely to get grad degrees than people with average IQs, and you need undergrad before grad) can pull up the college average.
