What exactly is a Fundamentalist?

Great Debates
21

sqweels:

I’ve generally used the term to mean this, but not necessarily in a religious context.

I use it when someone’s adopted a position on some issue (e.g. Creation vs Evolution, Star Trek vs Star Wars, Holden vs Ford, whatever) and they refuse to compromise regardless of arguement, evidence or threat of violence. In my experience they also seem to have a total inability to acknowledge the existance, let alone validity, of any contrary point of view.

e.g. “You say Luke Skywalker is better than Capt. Kirk again and I’ll belt you one!” - fundamentalist trekkie.

22

I know exactly what you’re talking about and I am a fundamentalist, only I don’t agree with everything that other fundamentalists do. There are different degrees of fundamentalism.

23

Really? I’m curious to know whether anybody would self-term themselves as Fundamentalists if, say, they did not accept the literal truth of the Bible (every jot, every tittle) as it appears in the “approved” extent texts.

I was only drawing attention to some of the peculiarities of my parents in that list I posted. Every one of those things, they did. Yet, my folks are kind, generous, loving, and sweet. I have never seen them argue or have a disagreement. They show affection to each other and to myself and my brother and sister. I love them.

But, on the subject of religion–there’s no reasoning. It is a matter of faith to my father and mother, that their interpretation of the scriptures is the correct one. They would not condemn any one to hell for denominational differences, that would be God’s perogative, but they would not listen to, nor attempt to understand why one should have drawn different conclusions than they have.

In the matter of their beliefs, they are completely (and proudly) closed-minded. And they refer to themselves as Fundamentalist. It is not a term of opprobrium to them.

By the way, Lynn, real Fundamentalists have their Bibles in a zippered slip case made of vinyl. Bibles signed by John R. Rice… On Sunday morning, when the pastor says “Turn to this passage in the scriptures…” you’ll hear the zippers unzip in unison. ZZZZZipppp!

24

Beakeroni, there is a difference between fundamentalists. Of course I don’t know what other’s motives are, but I have met many fundamentalist Christians that I don’t agree with in specific areas of the Bible. Generall speaking, most of our differences are minor, but sometimes they’re not. BTW, were you ever a fundamentalist?

25

Beakeroni wrote:
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Really? I’m curious to know whether anybody would self-term themselves as Fundamentalists if, say, they did not accept the literal truth of the Bible (every jot, every tittle) as it appears in the “approved” extent texts.
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[/QUOTE]

Taking the Bible as literal truth doesn’t automatically turn you into an abortion-clinic-bombing, gay-harassing, Disney-boycotting, Rush Limbaugh-listening, anti-science moron. And I know there are those who would argue this.

In a literal interpretation of the bible, there is still room for allegory and symbolism. There seems to be some confusion on this point, but, yes, you can believe in a literal interpretation and still translate things as allegory.

One big factor in how obnoxious you act depends on how you translate the doctrine of sin. For example, I believe that in the sight of God, all sins are equal. So it’s going to be difficult for me to go out and attack homosexuals for their sin when I believe that my sin is equal to theirs, that I’m no better than they are. It would be hypocritical and sick.

Another factor is how you view the Old Testament law. Some Christians believe the law is just as valid for them today as it was for Jews before Christ’s death. Personally, I don’t believe it is. The new covenant and all that. But the loud, scary Christians tend to gravitate towards following the law. At least, when it’s convenient for them.

Anyway, I didn’t mean to turn this into a theological argument, but I wanted to show how there are a lot of things at play here besides “literal interpretation”, and that terms don’t always mean the same thing to everyone. And it drives some of us under-represented fundamentalists insane.

[more hijacking] David, you seem like a reasonable, literate skeptic. May I nominate you for the job of authoring the skepti-tracts? <g>[/hijack]

26

Kiva said:

I already do so on a regular basis, actually (not so much tracts to hand out, but all sorts of articles you could print out if you wanted to).

If you haven’t already, check out the many and varied things I’ve written on http://www.reall.org

27

Really? I’m curious to know whether anybody would self-term themselves as Fundamentalists if, say, they did not accept the literal truth of the Bible (every jot, every tittle) as it appears in the “approved” extent texts.

I was only drawing attention to some of the peculiarities of my parents I love them.

But, on the subject of religion–there’s no reasoning. It is a matter of faith to my father and mother, that their interpretation of the scriptures is the correct one. They would not condemn any one to hell for denominational differences, that would be God’s perogative, but they would not listen to, nor attempt to understand why one should have drawn different conclusions than they have.

In the matter of their beliefs, they are completely (and proudly) closed-minded. And they refer to themselves as Fundamentalist.
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THANK YOU … that summarizes what is at the core of my current distress … I would like very much to believe as do so many others whom I consider sincre, intelligent,“GOOD” people… however I can not honestly ignore what is necessary for my own honor / integrity … I do not feel comfortable in either continuing the assoication (guilt / gratitude / true affection for etc)… yet I always have these inner doubts… sorry this forum gives me a place to vent / explore / confess (whatever)

Kiva QUOTE : Anyway,I didn’t mean to turn this into a theological argument, but I wanted to show how there are a lot of things at play here besides “literal interpretation”, and that terms don’t always mean the same thing to everyone.

SO how do you deal with those conflicts in a resonable fashion without appearing to be attacking the foundation of their Faith ??? I am just trying to find a middle ground …
BOY is this way off the OP’s orginal intent sorry

28

I know what you are feeling. Here is my story.

I was reared in a Fundamentalist Baptist household. I attended Fundamentalist Baptist schools throughout my youth. My parent’s church proudly identified itself as Separatist. I attended a supposedly “Non-denominational Christian College” which, of course, turned out to be Fundamentalist. (Pensacola Christian College, in case you want a name.)

One problem. I have never understood why I should be:

  1. Ashamed of my “sin.”

  2. Willing to accept Christ as my “personal saviour.”

  3. Willing to accept the teachings of anyone who would say “follow me, as I follow Christ.”

  4. Do those things that a Fundamentalist Baptist minister says are right, and not those things that are deemed improper.

What it comes down to is, why ought I not use reason, instead of blind faith in an interpretation of an unprovable book?

The kernel of my apostate thinking was the realization, based on my observation, that *all men are born selfish, not sinful.

Think about that, and what Jesus might have meant with “The Sermon on the Mount.”

I am still searching. I do not have the answers. I have a question, however, and it is this: “Is there any device, whereby we might be able to rise above ourselves?”

I look around and I see those that have a model of behaviour that they subscribe to, and as a result they are good and decent. I look around and I see those that follow the same model, but fail miserably. They do not see that they are failing, they believe themselves to be good and decent. They, unfortunately, are ass-holes aspiring to be an ass. Same beliefs, different results.

My brother-in-law is Mormon, my mother-in-law is Charismatic Pentacostal, as is my other brother-in-law. My family is entirely Fundamentalist Baptist. I feel as though myself and my lovely wife are out on the “sceptical limb”, with no pat answers to respond to the questions of “what does it mean to be under the direction of a higher authority?” and “where are you going when you die?”.

[hijack] Hey, JenkinsFan, why are you still here? I would have thought that the Straight Dope regulars would have driven you out by now! It is great that you have a high tolerance for those who think differently from you. Straight Dope Message Board needs you. I, for one cannot believe that you have not retreated to the LDMB! [/highjack]

29

Yaaargh! @##$&@# vB code!

30

The Jackel wrote:

That’s the big question. I don’t know either.
I know it looks like I’m being too touchy, but it really is painful to see people you respect and admire massively generalizing about one. I want to say HEY, LOOK! I’m not really like that!! Accept me!
And that’s just pathetic.

I guess the trick is not to generalize. But that’s impossible…it’s so convenient to be able to put one label on thousands of people. I do it all the time.

But it’s wonderful that you’re looking for a middle ground, even if there isn’t one.
Yes folks, yet another hijack!

David, I really like your writing, and have, in fact, on previous occasions, given stuff from the REALL page to friends confused by pseudoscience. Great stuff. Thank you.

31

Kiva: Thanks! I’m glad we could be of service.

32

Believe me or not, but I’m here simply because I love people. I know a few judgemental Christians have given our Saviour a bad rap, but if He didn’t love people He would have never came and walked in our shoes, gone through our problems, and ultimately give Himself for us. If He can go through Hell on earth for me, the least I can do for Him is proclaim His sacrifice. BTW, I consider it a priviledge to talk to such a group of diverse and interesting people.

33

A few? I’d say the vast majority of Christians starting with St. Paul have been judgemental, obnoxious, and self-righteous! So far as I can tell, the essence of Christianity is the belief that there is only ONE way to God, and that is through Christ. Not a lot of room there for other belief systems. If one were interested in giving Christ a better reputation, he would not pester, persecute, nor kill in His name.

Of course, one very good way to convince someone to believe the unbelievable is to witness at the point of a sword.

Not that you are doing any of those things, Jenkinsfan. But I wonder why you would wish to join with those who historically have done all those things? Wouldn’t the saving grace of God have eliminated the impulse to kill or persecute? Becoming a new creature, wherein the old things are passed away, etc?

What sort of a difference in your life has a belief in the saving grace of Christ made? Do other people notice a change? Is the change for better or for worse? How would you be able to tell?

The thing about Fundamentalism is this certain smugness. “I’m right, you’re wrong! God is on my side.”

Like I’ve said, a Fundamentalist does not regard the label Fundamentalist as being a bad thing. No umbrage taken. Proud to be a Fundie, and all that.