What happens if Bill Barr is fired or resigns?

[Snowboarder_Bo]

@Aspenglow

No one is asserting that any taint attached to the trial process, so there is no basis for a motion for mistrial. Barr is trying to subvert the sentencing proceeding, not the trial.

Also, why would the defendant bring such a motion? Barr’s pique arises from not being able to go easy enough on the defendant. That’s as topsy-turvy as it gets in the legal world. Barr is not Stone’s defense attorney.

You’re answering as tho I asked about Roger Stone; I didn’t.

I meant any federal defendant right now. The AG of the US just said he could not assure the courts that the Justice Department was doing their work with integrity. How is that not something that a defendant could argue in court: “I am being treated unfairly by the whole prosecution effort: Bill Barr just said so”?

@Aspenglow

Barr’s corruption is already creating problems that will reverberate throughout our criminal justice system. I heard a noted criminal defense attorney say today that he had tucked Barr’s 4-page memorandum to the sentencing judge advocating for a lighter sentence into his briefcase in order to use it as a basis to argue for lighter sentences for his own clients in the future. I’m sure he’s not the only one who will use this tactic. And why should they not? Sauce for the goose…

Aye; I hadn’t even started down that path yet but it’s obvious that a lot of people will have. I have no real need to think about it but surely defense lawyers saw the opening for what it is.

[Red_Wiggler]

I’m glad that large numbers of the bar and the judiciary are raising objections but Trump and his administration don’t really deal with “underlings.” They just blithely continue to issue orders.

[eenerms]

He will go back to retirement.

[Euphonious_Polemic]

@Sherrerd

Yes, that attempt will be made. But it’s now over 2,000 ex-Justice Dept. officials who have called on Barr to resign. The number doubled from Sunday (when the letter was released) to Monday:

https://www.cnn.com/2020/02/16/politics/prosecutors-doj-officials-barr-resign/index.html

Of course it’s true that the Trump base will believe anything they’re told—but that doesn’t really help Bill Barr conduct business at a DOJ that is increasingly appalled by his Trump-handmaiden shenanigans.

Big deal.

Those 2000 names will simply be added to Trump’s purge list. It will be helpful to the Trump Maga-hats to identify the non-loyalists when the time comes for the round-up.

Aspenglow This will bring some additional pressure to bear. (USA Today)

Quote:

@Apenglow

A national association of federal judges has called an emergency meeting Tuesday to address growing concerns about the intervention of Justice Department officials and President Donald Trump in politically sensitive cases, the group’s president said Monday.

Philadelphia U.S. District Judge Cynthia Rufe, who heads the independent Federal Judges Association, said the group “could not wait” until its spring conference to weigh in on a deepening crisis that has enveloped the Justice Department and Attorney General William Barr.

“There are plenty of issues that we are concerned about,” Rufe told USA TODAY. “We’ll talk all of this through.”

Another list of disloyal judges who will be replaced by Dear Leader Trump.

They’re making the purges easy! I imagine Miller et al are preparing lists as we speak.

[Aspenglow]

@Snowboarder_Bo

You’re answering as tho I asked about Roger Stone; I didn’t.

I meant any federal defendant right now. The AG of the US just said he could not assure the courts that the Justice Department was doing their work with integrity. How is that not something that a defendant could argue in court: “I am being treated unfairly by the whole prosecution effort: Bill Barr just said so”?

<snip>

Ah, ok, I did misunderstand. I think I answered your actual concerns better with the second part of my answer than the first.

In short, yes. Criminal defense attorneys are definitely going to use Barr’s comments/behaviors as a basis to argue for lesser sentences than what’s recommended in the sentencing guidelines. That’s the real damage here.

Sentencing guidelines exist for a reason, to standardize sentences for like crimes. Someone in Omaha committing the crime of bribery will receive a similar sentence to someone in San Francisco. Barr just undermined his whole department by making his argument for Stone. He’s literally working against the stated principles/guidelines of the DOJ.

@Euphonious_Polemic

Big deal.

Those 2000 names will simply be added to Trump’s purge list. It will be helpful to the Trump Maga-hats to identify the non-loyalists when the time comes for the round-up.

Another list of disloyal judges who will be replaced by Dear Leader Trump.

They’re making the purges easy! I imagine Miller et al are preparing lists as we speak.

Trump can’t fire judges. Remember, their appointments are for life – which is what make the judiciary simultaneously safe and dangerous. Safe so long as they adhere to Constitutional norms and traditions, dangerous if they don’t. But Trump can’t just “purge” them. They have the independence to stand up against him – and I’m very glad they are doing so.

[Snowboarder_Bo]

@Aspenglow

Ah, ok, I did misunderstand. I think I answered your actual concerns better with the second part of my answer than the first.

In short, yes. Criminal defense attorneys are definitely going to use Barr’s comments/behaviors as a basis to argue for lesser sentences than what’s recommended in the sentencing guidelines. That’s the real damage here.

Sentencing guidelines exist for a reason, to standardize sentences for like crimes. Someone in Omaha committing the crime of bribery will receive a similar sentence to someone in San Francisco. Barr just undermined his whole department by making his argument for Stone. He’s literally working against the stated principles/guidelines of the DOJ.

Hell, if I was a defense lawyer, I’d argue to have my whole case thrown out now: the top 2 Justice officials in America have now said the system is rigged and can’t trusted.

Hours before a court session regarding his longtime ally Roger Stone, President Donald Trump is tweeting that Stone’s recent conviction for witness tampering and lying to Congress “should be thrown out.”

The barrage of Tuesday morning tweets comes days after Trump earned a public rebuke from his own attorney general, William Barr, who had said the president’s tweets were “making it impossible” for Barr to do his job.

Trump tweeted Fox News commentator Andrew Napolitano’s comment that the jury appears to have been biased against Trump and calling out Judge Amy Berman Jackson by name, saying “almost any judge in the country” would throw out the conviction.

Trump added in a subsequent tweet. “Everything having to do with this fraudulent investigation is badly tainted and, in my opinion, should be thrown out.”

Judge refuses to delay sentencing of Trump ally Roger Stone

[Senegoid]

@Aspenglow

In short, yes. Criminal defense attorneys are definitely going to use Barr’s comments/behaviors as a basis to argue for lesser sentences than what’s recommended in the sentencing guidelines. That’s the real damage here.

@Snowboarder_Bo

Hell, if I was a defense lawyer, I’d argue to have my whole case thrown out now: the top 2 Justice officials in America have now said the system is rigged and can’t trusted.

Let’s hope it doesn’t get like this. The good news is that so many prosecutors, ex-prosecutors, and even judges are now openly and overtly disrespecting Trump and Barr over this.

That can give us hope that, when defense lawyers start making these arguments in courts, those arguments will be likewise disrespected.

@Aspenglow

Trump can’t fire judges.

How much longer will it be before Trump begins to try doing this? And what will happen when he does? I don’t imagine such attempts will succeed, but I do imagine he can create plenty of Trump-branded chaos over it.

OTOH, if Trump does succeed in kicking out some judges of his choice, there could be a silver lining. Would this not provide the necessary precedent for a future president to kick out some of the more egregious Trump-appointed judges?

(And: Do we really want to go there? :eek: )

[Snowboarder_Bo]

Just up on the AP: AP source: Barr tells people he might quit over Trump tweets

Attorney General William Barr has told people close to him he’s considering quitting his post after President Donald Trump wouldn’t heed his warning to stop tweeting about Justice Department cases, an administration official told The Associated Press.

The revelation came days after Barr took a public swipe at the president, saying in a television interview that Trump’s tweets about Justice Department cases and staffers make it “impossible” for him to do his job. The next day, Trump ignored Barr’s request and insisted that he has the “legal right” to intervene in criminal cases and sidestep the Justice Department’s historical independence.

The administration official was not authorized to discuss Barr’s private remarks and requested anonymity.

It’s unclear how seriously Barr has considered resigning or whether he is instead trying to pressure Trump to back off his provocative tweets about the Justice Department. Barr’s spokeswoman said late Tuesday that the attorney general “has no plans to resign.”

We all know that anything this administration says definitively is almost certainly a lie or simply something they made up on the spot, so… we’ll see.

[Aspenglow]

He’s already issued a formal statement through the DOJ that he has “no current plans” to quit.

[Snowboarder_Bo]

Aye, but it means bupkis.

[Aspenglow]

As has been pointed out by various pundits, Bill Barr’s problem isn’t Trump’s tweets. It’s that Barr listens to and acts on them. If Bill Barr is pissed off about what’s happening to him, he can look in a mirror.

[Fiveyearlurker]

@Snowboarder_Bo

Just up on the AP: AP source: Barr tells people he might quit over Trump tweetsWe all know that anything this administration says definitively is almost certainly a lie or simply something they made up on the spot, so… we’ll see.

Barr is lying and his concerns are all staged.

[Snowboarder_Bo]

I would agree that such is not unlikely at all.

[Sherrerd]

@Fiveyearlurker

Barr is lying and his concerns are all staged.

Yes. Barr is having a serious problem with DOJ personnel who never signed on to be the President’s flunkies.

So he’s trying to win them back by pretending to be Independent: ‘see, I criticized Trump! Well, just his tweeting, but—that counts, right? And I threatened to quit! See? Totally independent! So you can all just shut up and get back to work! Because it’s all normal, right?’

Something like that.