(What I think may be) the root cause to gay marriage opposition... how to fight it?

[mudkicker]

I think that’s an interesting idea. Also the fact that most people who think being gay is ‘wrong’ don’t know any gay people, or think they’re all the screaming queens type. I used to share a house with a gay guy who my dad had met - it really diluted my dad’s ‘born in 1950s Irish Catholic’ casual homophobia when he found out this guy who he really liked and respected was gay - and more importantly, that my dad hadn’t had a clue that he was.

The reason I’m mentioning my dad in relation to the OP is because he is not homophobic at all now, because of the love idea. The flatmate I mentioned had a civil partnership last year, and Belfast was the first place in the UK where these could be carried out. Naturally there were loads of protests from the religious right about this, but my dad said musingly, ‘You know, what’s the problem? It just means there’s more love in the world.’

I still think he would be uncomfortable with the stereotype of a very loud, very camp gay man bed-hopping every night, but he’s realised that gay partnerships are pretty much the same as straight ones in terms of love and commitment, and he would never want to deny anyone that.

[Nava]

@Thudlow Boink

After all, it’s a not-uncommon stereotype that “men are only interested in one thing” or that “women use sex to get love; men use love to get sex.” From there, it’s not that big of a leap to believe that, if two men are in a relationship with one another, they’re only in it for the sex. (I’m not sure how that would apply to lesbians, though.)

The lesbian version (as taken from my most-bigoted relatives, and I have a couple real bad ones), is that they’re afraid of sex and/or got raped and/or are afraid of dick.

My remarried aunt once expounded on that subject for several minutes (“their first time was bad so they don’t want to try it ever again”) before I got tired of getting stupidity with my roast lamb and said “oh, you mean like you and marriage?” It shut her up but of course didn’t get her to grow a brain…

[Rosalind]

@Drakkar: I have to wonder if you’re exaggerating your ideas of your gay friends’ relationships, or if they’re playing up to your ideas. Most of the long-term gay male relationships I know don’t include other men for sex. They’re pretty much exactly like the long-term straight relationships I know. They go to work, come home, watch TV or go online or to the pub, feel tired, go home, have sex or not. Hell, I doubt most of them would have the time or energy to bring multiple fuckbuddies home!

I do know a few gay male couples who are notorious for bringing ‘guests’ home, but they’re notorious because it’s not the norm for long-term relationships; besides, I’ve known some straight couples do the same, and straight couples aren’t always really monogamous, are they?

Most of the lesbian relationships I know are too, mine included, and we’re also homosexual, FWIW, since you seem to be conflating ‘homosexual’ with ‘gay male.’ Of course, lesbian couples get the accusation that, not only is not really love, but it’s not really sex, either.

I do see and hear this idea of 'it’s not real “in-love type love” occasionally. It probably comes from some straight people knowing what it’s like to love your best, same-sex friend, and what it’s like to love your lover, and feeling the difference. Some people, from conversations I’ve had, don’t really get that it’s possible to have that romantic love with someone who has the same type of genitals as you, purely because that’s not been their experience. They don’t mean anything malicious by this - it’s just contradictory to their own experience.

I don’t think that’s the cause of much opposition to gay marriage, though. The people who feel that way might not take gay marriage seriously, but they wouldn’t actively oppose it unless they had some other reason to - usually religion, IME. Though, to be fair, the only people I’ve met who are totally opposed to gay marriage are outright homophobes in other ways too, so it’s never just about the sanctimony of marriage.

[5-HT]

My parents, both lifelong republicans, were against gay marriage. The funny thing is, neither of them are at all religious. My dad seems to focus on it as an economic issue, (I think) vastly overstating the impact providing benefits for gay couples would have on small business (he is also a small business owner). His stance has softened over time however, and he really doesn’t seem to care one way or the other about it now.

My mom is harder to figure out. It’s possible that she simply has some leftover beliefs stuck in her personality from when she was more religious in her youth. She seems to change her reason for opposing it frequently. The most developed one that I can remember was that marriage exists to promote child rearing and set up the healthiest possible situation for that child to be raised in.

As far as I know, she still feels that way. She won’t really discuss it with me anymore. My best friend from college is a lesbian living in California who is both married and raising a child(who her wife is in the process of adopting), and my mom has never expressed any hostility towards her. She never said anything about it when I went to the wedding, nor when I became godfather to her son. I don’t know if that means she is just suppressing her true feelings in this one case, or if she’s really coming around on the issue.