A few weeks ago I was out with some friends from work. First a meal, then as the top brass buggered off we went to a pub, then at closing time we went to a casino where there was a live guitar player. I had to stick my fingers in my ears even though I had had plenty to drink (the logic being that I should have a hightened tolerance for noise)
Apparently it’s normal for it to be that loud. For me it was about 8 times loouder than what I would call loud. I had to shout at the top of my voice right in people’s ears to make myself heard.
What’s the deal?
You are not supposed to talk during live music anyhow, that is just rude to the artist. (Just a pet peeve when I am trying to listen to music - I utterly can’t stand people who are gabbing while an artist puts out there heart & soul - if you don’t want to listen to the music - go somewhere else)
Often the level of sound in a club depends on background music, the type of venue, the soundsystem, and the sound engineer for the gig.
But when an artist is playing, I think the main factor is that the artist is playing, and they should be what everyone can hear - not other people’s conversations or other noises within the venue.
Because if it weren’t that loud, all the people in the audience who have destroyed their hearing from a lifetime of rock concert attendance would complain that it’s not loud enough.
I’ve been wearing ear plugs to gigs for about the past 3 years for the sake of my hearing - so I don’t lose more of the mid range in my right ear - but with ear plugs the sound level is perfect most of the time.
One of the reasons is the problem of mixing to live drums. The other instruments have to be at a certain volume to mesh.
My big problem with live music is that the sound is mixed for someone sitting at the mixing desk. I’m sick of not being able to hear the guitar of a rock band because the bass player is hitting resonant frequencies with parts of the building. I’ve ended up sitting with the sound man so I can tell what’s being played.
Lexi-If they were at a casino then it was probably supposed to be background music. The only time when talking wouldn’t be very appropriate would be if you were at a concert. Oh, and if the player was doing some crap gig at a casino then he probably only had enough heart into it to get his paycheck.
We talked about this a little in recording class. Sometimes it’s partly because the musicians’ hearing has gone to hell after years of standing in front of drum kits with their guitar amps up to 11. However, it’s probably got more to do with these things:
Rock’s SUPPOSED to be loud, right? We gotta annoy the 'rents with it!
Most people seem to think that louder equals better. Why, I don’t know. I personally hate really loud sounds.
Lots of people have partially lost their hearing already due to listening to loud music all the time, so it doesn’t bother them as much.
Not enough people have complained to the venues or bands or whatever.
It’s been a downward spiral, I imagine. As music gets louder, people lose their hearing more and need the music louder, which makes them lose their hearing more . . . It’s all rather stupid.
If you plan on attending any rock concerts anytime soon I’d highly recommend getting some earplugs. You can get musician’s earplugs that cut out all frequencies evenly so that everything sounds about the same but quieter.
Pride of the Peaches - true enough - a casino would be a pretty crappy gig but even a casino, there probably were friends of the musician there. I’ve shown up to support friends at crappy bars that usually don’t have a live band, after all - a musician has to start somewhere. So even if they were playing a coffeeshop that seats 12, there were people there who wanted to see the musician play.
If the sound system isn’t up to par, or the soundman & the board is located somewhere where they don’t get a sound indicitive of the rest of the building that can be a real problem.
But with a full band, when you have them practicing in your basement, all you can hear is the drums, vocals are the hardest to hear, so once they get the levels so you can hear everyone, and not hear the background noise of the bar (and talking people) - it gets a bit loud. I’ve seen it too where a DJ is playing sound man for the night and doesn’t understand how to mix for live music, small places where there aren’t usually bands make this mistake quite often. DJ music and live music require a very different mix, because pre-recorded music is already mixed.
But this was just a guitarist, so I suspect, they were using levels & volumes for a full band for a simgle instrument - and I’ve been to pubs where the sound people only know how to mix for a full band, so if a soloist with a guitar comes up - it sounds ten times as loud as a full band.
An experienced soundman makes a world of difference in how loud the music is perceived, even so, live music is loud (even to the half deaf) - wear ear plugs.
One venue I go to has a little vending machine that sells earplugs - which is great if you forgot to bring your own.
Believe me - I could be screaming my head off and the artist wouldn’t know. As I said, it was so loud that I had to scream, inches away from someone’s ear to be heard. And this wasn’t a concert. It was a guy playing in a bar-room where people were supposed to be talking and drinking. It was that kind of atmosphere. I was there to drink not listen, as were most others. If I were at a concert (I am not the type) I would shut the hell up. I am not rude like that.
A real guitar or an electric guitar? Real guitars aren’t that loud, but you may be sensitive to the frequencies; with electric guitars, you just turn the volume knob.
I have great difficulty dealing with and filtering out background noise.
I think it boils down to noise competition. The artist and sound person want to discourage conversation and focus attention on the music, so the volume goes up. People want to continue their conversation, so they talk louder and louder. The volume goes up more, the talking turns to shouting, etc.
Pretty soon everybody starts at full volume, because why waste time trying to accommodate to the other assholes?
In my experiece the worst culprits are guitar players, they are nearly always too freaking loud so it’s sometimes a struggle to get the vocals audible, let alone get a proper balance. In small venues we often resorted to a ‘kick drum and vocal’ mix, no guitars cymbals or snare though the PA at all.
Well I always did a walk around, you’re right ,you can’t tell what it sounds like to most of the audience from the mixer.
As for earplugs we used balled up loo roll Ear plugs are a bit too effective if you’re supposed to be listening to the band. Get a balance with your bare ears then bung them up for the rest of the evening. If you’re doing gigs every night you’d go deaf otherwise.
As to the OP. Rock music is LOUD. Raves are LOUDER. This wasn’t a rock gig or a rave, it was a casino. Seems to me that that much loudness was inappropriate and likely to drive punters away.
Remember the now old saying, “if its too loud, you’re too old”? Anyway, I agree with you now that I’m older. I really dislike ear splitting music. A friend and I were at a Uriah Heep concert and he almost got sick because it was so loud.
I don’t understand it at a bar though. You need to verbally communicate to a waitress or bartender your drink order when the noise is at 117 db. I guess one needs to just write it down and show it to them.
Ear plugs are a bit too effective if you’re supposed to be listening to the band. Get a balance with your bare ears then bung them up for the rest of the evening. If you’re doing gigs every night you’d go deaf otherwise.