What is the best martial art?

When I was little, me and my two brothers (one younger by 2 years, the other older by 2) watched Karate Kid. Of course, we loved it, and wanted to “train”. So, once a day, we’d get on a bed, and have practice sessions. We even had neat little karate outfits (all right… they were pajamas). But so we’d fight… usually my older brother would win. But, then I got an idea. I decided to fight blind! And let me tell ya, my older brother didn’t know I could hit that hard. He gave up immediatly.

So, in my experience, fighting blind is the best method.

Ah yes, it’s a beautiful feeling. :slight_smile:

…Those halcyon days of feeling invincible, only to have the illusion shattered by somebody who shouldn’t be able to. How many times have you walked away tending your wounds saying “I was sure I coulda beaten him…”


Joe Cool
How will I laugh tomorrow,
When I can’t even smile today?

There is ONE long lost martial art that at times can be so deadly, yet effective. It’s called common-sense. :o


“What’s right is only half of what’s wrong
and I want a short-haired girl
Who sometimes wears it twice as long”
George Harrison - Old Brown Shoe

A serious answer to your question necessarily considers your personal objectives, expectations, goals and life aspirations with regard to your external and internal intellectual-emotional-physical conditioning and identity. Without that consideration, answers may assume any fixed, narrow—and amusing—point to your quest.

SO, WHAT DO YOU WANT FROM “martial arts” ?

aHHHH, THE ART OF DEFENSE. MARTIAL FORMS SPECIFIC TO DEFENSE ARE THE ONLY COURSE OF DEFENSE THAT INTERESTS YOU?

Hands down, the best “martial art” is
Making the other guy miss more than you do and inflicting the most damage possible in the shortest amount of time possible.
This is also referred to as “opening a can of whoop-ass” but it is a very little known art and can be hard to find a dojo in which to study it.

I myself have run into masters of this art (or at least advanced students of it) on several occasions. These guys kicked my ass all over the place.

Luckily, I seem to have a knack for this art, which comes in handy in my line of work.

“Winners never quit and quitters never win, but those who never win and never quit are idiots.”

All these threads about the martial arts…
That’s fine, but when you go into the self defense thing, that irritates me. In a dark parking lot, whatever, you come within 20 ft, I will pull my pistol, and tell you to back off. No martial arts master has a 20 foot leg. Stop acting like martial arts are some kind of miracle for self defense. If you are that uptight, get a gun and learn how to use it. And yes, if you let somebody into your “personal defense zone” you deserve to get your ass kicked, and your gun taken away.

Yeah right, Mr. Smarty Pants. You’re standing 10 ft. from my car and I’m wondering why you’re lurking around my property, so I’ve already pulled my my pistol and blow your freakin head off when I see you go for yours. What now?
Who teaches people this shit?
Peace,
mangeorge

well, mangeorge, point 1 is dont lurk around my property, (or yours) and 2 is WTF does that have to do with my comment re: martial arts? Never mind, I dont need a Pit thread on this…

Guess I misunderstood you, Klaatu. I thought you said that you were going to pull a gun on me if I came within 20ft. of you in a “dark parking lot, whatever”. I was only trying to defend myself as I was innocently walking to my car. Sorry, next time I’ll just let you shoot me.
Peace,
mangeorge (Dodging them 9mm’s)

I’ll be as terse as possible.

All oldschool martial arts are bad. This is because they are all narrow in scope. Since fighting is more than simply punching, kicking, trapping, grappling, or submission, the ultimate martial art is the casserole martial art (which I hear is what Bruce Lee’s Jeet Kune Do is).

If you want to defeat your enemies, the best methods for this were touched in previous posts; attack by surprise & with superior weaponry. Either of these when used alone is enough to practically ensure victory, and when used in conjunction the two tactics are virtually unstoppable. The only “art” to this is the art of not getting your butt in jail afterwards.

Now if you want to prepare yourself for all unarmed circumstances, learn the following attacks:

Rock throwing (Long long distance; a good rock-thrower could defeat Bruce Lee, yet no martial arts school I know of teaches this)

Side Kick (Long distance)

Round Kick (Indirect and more intimidating than sidekick, even if overall less effective. Allows you to move in on your opponent)

Jab (Close range)

Rearhand punch (Close range, combos well off of a Jab)

Kick to knee (close range against people who don’t like your jab and are too stupid to protect their legs properly)

Takedown (Clostest range, works well if you outweigh him)

Pummeling (Pretty easy for most people to grasp once they’ve got their opponent on the ground)

Submission (often a better alternative to Pummeling which requires much more knowledge; you basically put pressure on the guy’s joints and bend him out of shape)

And learn to defend from all of them by standing with a good solid guard and getting your brain conditioned to parry things which will harm it. Sparring at any martial arts school is probably good for teaching you defense.

Last of all: If you want to learn to kick butt, then you would probably do best of all to train in “martial arts” only half as much as you do now and instead spend the time to Stretch Out, Run Fast, and above all BULK UP. Bigger is stronger. Stronger is more damaging. Stronger is also more able to properly perform attacks (my punches sucked before I worked out; I’m still not that strong but now I can do it much, much more convincingly). Bigger is also harder to move and harm. Muscle absorbs force. Gain weight! Gain power! Crush your enemies!

With all the comments about proper, hard training and choosing a style fitted to your build and purposes taken as a given; and avoiding my personal bias towards handguns (also with the appropriate training), I’d look at:

Those styles which allow for more fluid motion - and training - such as fu jow pai, rather than the rectilinear tae kwan do and similar highly stylized forms; or

Savate - basically formalized French legionnaire streetfighting, with some emphasis on shortening the other chap by breaking their knees, almost always a useful tactic.

A French style?
Man, don’t the French always lose? Don’t they always take the chickenshit way out and surrender?
I can understand using Israeli street-fighting techniques, but French?
WTF?


“Winners never quit and quitters never win, but those who never win and never quit are idiots.”

KUNG-FU

Kung FU was the famous martial arts that the infamous Bruce Lee was trained in. However, it takes lots of concentration, and skill, and time. Time is the most important. If you don;t want to practice on fucusing your chi for 4 hours straight, then you will never become a good martial artists. It’s all about inner power, and energy. Trust me…

Judo… In the movies TKD and KF look great but you’ll get your ass kicked in real life. In my experience all “real” fights end up as a grappling sort of endeavor, usually on the ground… The martial art that best addresses real fighting is Judo. Submission holds, arm and leg locks, chock holds… Either learn judo and keep your smart-assed attitude or learn to value of being the shy quiet type…

Discussion, so far, here is all about forms of militating. Also, even though the overall discussion holds points about dealing with winning and failing, the overriding aim seems to be invincibility (or at least the rush feeling of it). Any additional arts or perspectives or insights to offer on this page?

I wasn’t originally going to post here since Tom-n-Debb had pointed SilentKnight to the same topic on Great Debates. Also, this topic invariably degenerates into silly unsupported statements that essentially are “My sensei/lineage/style is better than your sensei/lineage/style.” (see things to avoid below).

It is important to note that I teach crime survival/self defense as my primary goal. Unlike what has been stated before, this doesn’t mean I don’t teach discipline, respect, self esteem, etc. They are part and parcel of hard training. However, if you do not want to train to for hard self defense than by all means ignore everything I am about to say, because it will not apply to you.

The Golden Rule of Martial Arts Styles

Forget about particular styles. What you are seeking is hard training and proper mindsetting. Every style can both offer this, or not. Therefore, it is critical to evaluate the the instructor and the school not the style.

Things to Look For

#1) Hard physical training.

#2) Sparring. The harder the better. Find the sparring/fighting that you are willing to tolerate. Don’t get anything lower, don’t get anything harder.

#3) Scenario based training. You probably won’t find that many schools that do this, but if you do then you likely just found the school for you. Scenario based training is NOT “Okay, now somebody comes after you with a overhead strike.” Scenario based training is NOT “Okay, now somebody comes after you with any strike.” Scenario based training takes you from the interview or initial assault to the conclusion.

#4) Learn everything you can about violent crime. Do not assume that you know, everybody thinks they know (I have met thousands who think they know). Find out for sure. There are lots of good books on there on the subject. My favorites because of good writing style and comprehension:

“Strong on Defense” by Sanford Strong
“Gift of Fear” by Dr. Gavin DeBecker
“The Truth About Self Protection” by Massad Ayoob
“Real Fighting” by Peyton Quinn

#5) Use the knowledge you learned from #4 to avoid the things in the list that follows. Use #4 to develop your own b/s sensors. Apply them … always.

Things to Avoid

#1) Easy promises. Self defense against a serious violent attack is never has a quick and easy solution, that can be picked up with a snap of the fingers.

#2) People who say “Trust me” or “Martial arts training will carry you through.” If they cannot articulate the reasons that sound reasonable, solid and match up with what self defense MUST be then it is b/s.

#3) People who say “Martial arts technique is like a Hammer of Thor (or anything equivalent) that will swat your opponents like flies.” This just simply isn’t true, at least not for the vast majority of martial artists. With piles of HARD training time it eventually becomes closer and closer to the truth but always remember this. It takes 2-3 center of mass hits from a pistol to stop an average assailant. Do you really think you can ever hit as hard as a gun?

#4) Reliance on “critical strikes”. You will land a critical strike, i.e. a strike to a vital part of the body, purely by luck. Under the chemical cocktail of a violent encounter it is practically impossible to have that level of precision.

#5) People who advocate technique based solutions because they “know” how a real fight will happen. The techniques that will work must subscribe to What Self Defense Must Be (see below). You can find such technique in practically any martial arts style. It is highly advisable have a good cross section of technique available to be used for a variety of situations. There is no rule on how a violent encounter will happen and what will happen once it starts.

#6) Everything else that you newly formed b/s sensors tells you doesn’t match up with What Self Defense Must Be (see below).

What Self Defense Must Be

Fast - things happen very fast. You are already at the disadvantage because you assailant has attacked you. Sadly, this means you have to play catch-up and that means you MUST be quick. Expect to freeze for a brief period following the initial assualt. Time works against you.

Strong/Powerful - Although obvious, you want to hit with as strong a counter-attack as possible. (see explosive below)

Explosive - It must be overwhelming to the assailant. The more the better. The more overwhelming the greater then chance an avenue of escape will present itself.

Direct/Focused - YOu must know what it is you need to accomplish (mindsetting/predetermination) and go directly for that goal.

Simple - Your animal mind will take over. Expect to experience tunnel vision, loss of fine motor control amongst other things (you can read about “other things” in the books I mentioned above). If your cause of action is not simple expect to simply be unable to do it.

Final Word

Do not take my word for it. Do the studying yourself. Find out about the reality of a violent encounter and come to your own conclusions.

I just saw the movie “THE FIGHT CLUB”, where good-looking young men meet regularly to beat the crap out of eachother. Is this a real phenomena? How do I join up?

I agree with Glitch entirely. He sounds like he knows what he is talking about. I would only add my $0.02 that the training and hard work mentioned by many others should be done for a long time, if not continuously for the rest of your life. You are looking for the “best” martial art, which you must know by now is very subjective. So I won’t tell which one it IS. However, I found it in the non-traditional martial arts (Kali, JKD, ju-jitsu, others and what I take now - Muey Thai kickboxing(oh- side note, in Thai boxing I learn the same boxing techniques that normal boxers do, I just learn kicking as well).

The main reason I find these so much more effective than the Judo and Karate I studied when younger is the method of training and the people involved. I really really like going to class! And because of that, I train/work harder and learn more, which will probably save my butt in a fight much more than if I studied the one “magical” art.

The traditional martial arts have so much pomp and circumstance involved that I got bored and quit. Why practice a horse-stance punch that you will NEVER use? Why kow-tow every 3 seconds to the teacher? None of the non-trad arts I’ve studied have that crap. Sure, you respect your teacher, but not because they are only wearing a black-belt. You respect them because they work with you, teach you, and kick your ass sometimes as well. The teachers of non-trad arts are there because of one reason and one reason only- they are good. I know I’m going to make a few people angry, but I have heard of many TKD and Karate Black Belts who got that way after a year or so…Every one of my non-trad martial art instructors has had at least 10 years of experience- some 25 or more! Plus all of them had experience teaching Police, Secret Service, Military, etc. Don’t know why that is, but its true.

Most non-trad classes are taught in sweats and tennis shoes (when was the last time you were attacked wearing pajamas and barefoot?) with no colored belts. You warm up and then start training with a partner- no line dances or anything like that. The teachers lead the way and the pace, then walk around and help with technique. After 15 minutes you’re sweating, trying new things and learning more because you are happy to be there and feel more a part of the group. No belt colors, no special awards; you work at your own speed(albeit pushed a little by the instructor) and experience fighting with all types and sizes and abilities.

I guess what I’m basically trying to say is this: Find an art that you enjoy so much you go every night you can, and stick with it. If you don’t enjoy it or the atmosphere or the strictness or the people, you will not learn much. I found it in non-traditional martial arts, and yes, that is a term you can use when asking questions of schools. Start with the Hapkido you were interested in- I’ve heard good things about it. If you enjoy it, stay. If you don’t, leave. Try one of the others I mentioned - its a good thing to learn about a few styles. Oh- and a final note- Avoid places that make you sign year-long + contracts. I feel they are scams that they tie you into because they aren’t confident enough in their own teaching to retain you as a student. They are only in it for the money, they could care less about you as a student.

Sorry about the length- didn’t mean to rant!