What is the correct version of events in the Rosa Parks story?

[davidmich]

Hi
What actually transpired on the Montgomery bus? As I understand it, several white passengers boarded the bus and one white male passenger was left standing. Were several seats of one row then available for that one white passenger (the row from which Rosa Parks refused to move) or were all seats taken and only one seat (Rosa Parks’s seat) left available for that one standing passenger?
Wikipedia doesn’t explain fully and the other websites seem to confuse things.

I look forward to your feedback.

After working all day, Parks boarded the Cleveland Avenue bus, a General Motors Old Look bus belonging to the Montgomery City Lines,[27] around 6 p.m., Thursday, December 1, 1955, in downtown Montgomery. She paid her fare and sat in an empty seat in the first row of back seats reserved for blacks in the “colored” section. Near the middle of the bus, her row was directly behind the ten seats reserved for white passengers. Initially, she did not notice that the bus driver was the same man, James F. Blake, who had left her in the rain in 1943. As the bus traveled along its regular route, all of the white-only seats in the bus filled up. The bus reached the third stop in front of the Empire Theater, and several white passengers boarded. Blake noted that two or three white passengers were standing, as the front of the bus had filled to capacity. He moved the “colored” section sign behind Parks and demanded that four black people give up their seats in the middle section so that the white passengers could sit. Years later, in recalling the events of the day, Parks said, “When that white driver stepped back toward us, when he waved his hand and ordered us up and out of our seats, I felt a determination to cover my body like a quilt on a winter night.”[28]

“By the terms of Alabama segregation, because there were no seats remaining in the white section, all four passengers would have to get up so one white man could sit down. “

“Although only one white needed a seat, all four blacks were required to move because the segregation statutes also stated that it was illegal for any black to sit in the same row as a white on a city bus.
When none of the four blacks moved, Blake walked back and again asked them to move.”

“At this point a few white people boarded the bus, and one white man was left standing. When the driver noticed him standing, he spoke to us (the man and two women across the aisle) and told us to let the man have the seat.”

[davidmich]

@davidmich

Hi
What actually transpired on the Montgomery bus? As I understand it, several white passengers boarded the bus and one white male passenger was left standing. Were several seats of one row then available for that one white passenger (the row from which Rosa Parks refused to move) or were all seats taken and only one seat (Rosa Parks’s seat) left available for that one standing passenger?
Wikipedia doesn’t explain fully and the other websites seem to confuse things.

I look forward to your feedback.

After working all day, Parks boarded the Cleveland Avenue bus, a General Motors Old Look bus belonging to the Montgomery City Lines,[27] around 6 p.m., Thursday, December 1, 1955, in downtown Montgomery. She paid her fare and sat in an empty seat in the first row of back seats reserved for blacks in the “colored” section. Near the middle of the bus, her row was directly behind the ten seats reserved for white passengers. Initially, she did not notice that the bus driver was the same man, James F. Blake, who had left her in the rain in 1943. As the bus traveled along its regular route, all of the white-only seats in the bus filled up. The bus reached the third stop in front of the Empire Theater, and several white passengers boarded. Blake noted that two or three white passengers were standing, as the front of the bus had filled to capacity. He moved the “colored” section sign behind Parks and demanded that four black people give up their seats in the middle section so that the white passengers could sit. Years later, in recalling the events of the day, Parks said, “When that white driver stepped back toward us, when he waved his hand and ordered us up and out of our seats, I felt a determination to cover my body like a quilt on a winter night.”[28]

“By the terms of Alabama segregation, because there were no seats remaining in the white section, all four passengers would have to get up so one white man could sit down. “

“Although only one white needed a seat, all four blacks were required to move because the segregation statutes also stated that it was illegal for any black to sit in the same row as a white on a city bus.
When none of the four blacks moved, Blake walked back and again asked them to move.”

“At this point a few white people boarded the bus, and one white man was left standing. When the driver noticed him standing, he spoke to us (the man and two women across the aisle) and told us to let the man have the seat.”

This seems to be right.
“Although only one white needed a seat, all four blacks were required to move because the segregation statutes also stated that it was illegal for any black to sit in the same row as a white on a city bus.
When none of the four blacks moved, Blake walked back and again asked them to move.”

What I cannot find, despite numerous searches, is the actual city segregation ordinance/statute number (the number that follows every ordinance )which must have been cited at Rosa Parks’s trial.

[Machine_Elf]

ISTR reading an account which claimed Rosa Parks’ refusal to give up her seat wasn’t as spontaneous as history makes it out to be - that she was selected at a meeting of civil rights activists over some other candidate woman to be the person who would refuse to give up her bus seat (to serve as a test case), and that she would take the next available opportunity to do so.

There’s no account of this on her Wikipedia page. Am I imagining all that?

[Kent_Clark]

@Machine_Elf

ISTR reading an account which claimed Rosa Parks’ refusal to give up her seat wasn’t as spontaneous as history makes it out to be - that she was selected at a meeting of civil rights activists over some other candidate woman to be the person who would refuse to give up her bus seat (to serve as a test case), and that she would take the next available opportunity to do so.

There’s no account of this on her Wikipedia page. Am I imagining all that?

You aren’t imagining it, although the story I’ve always heard is that Parks volunteered rather than “was selected.” Of course, no one at that point knew if or when she might find herself in that situation. It’s possible the local NAACP chapter had several volunteers lined up, and Rosa Parks ended up the first one to be arrested.

[zimaane]

I recall something like that as well. Rosa Parks was active in the NAACP, so it has the ring of plausibility, but it could also be conflated with some other story from the Civil Rights movement.

[Derleth]

@zimaane

I recall something like that as well. Rosa Parks was active in the NAACP, so it has the ring of plausibility, but it could also be conflated with some other story from the Civil Rights movement.

No, it’s definitely true of Parks in specific, and there was another young woman who did the same thing nine months earlier: Claudette Colvin:

@NPR

Few people know the story of Claudette Colvin: When she was 15, she refused to move to the back of the bus and give up her seat to a white person — nine months before Rosa Parks did the very same thing.

Most people know about Parks and the Montgomery, Ala., bus boycott that began in 1955, but few know that there were a number of women who refused to give up their seats on the same bus system. Most of the women were quietly fined, and no one heard much more.

Colvin was the first to really challenge the law.

[snip]

When asked why she is little known and why everyone thinks only of Rosa Parks, Colvin says the NAACP and all the other black organizations felt Parks would be a good icon because “she was an adult. They didn’t think teenagers would be reliable.”

She also says Parks had the right hair and the right look.

“Her skin texture was the kind that people associate with the middle class,” says Colvin. “She fit that profile.”

David Garrow, a historian and the author of Bearing the Cross: Martin Luther King Jr. and the Southern Christian Leadership Conference, says people may think that Parks’ action was spontaneous, but black civic leaders had been thinking about what to do about the Montgomery buses for years.

After Colvin’s arrest, she found herself shunned by parts of her community. She experienced various difficulties and became pregnant. Civil rights leaders felt she was an inappropriate symbol for a test case.

Parks was the secretary of the NAACP. She was well-known and respected and, says Garrow, Parks had a “natural gravitas” and was an “inherently impressive person.”

[Freddy_the_Pig]

@davidmich

What I cannot find, despite numerous searches, is the actual city segregation ordinance/statute number (the number that follows every ordinance )which must have been cited at Rosa Parks’s trial.

Her arrest record indicates that she was arrested for violating Chapter 6, Section 11 of the Montgomery City Code.

The court record for the parallel case of Browder v. Gayle, which involved four other women who violated the segregation ordinances, quotes Section 11 in full and also quotes several other relevant state and local laws. Here is Section 11:

Any employee in charge of a bus operated in the city shall have the powers of a police officer of the city while in actual charge of any bus, for the purpose of carrying out the provisions of the preceding section, and it shall be unlawful for any passenger to refuse or fail to take a seat among those assigned to the race to which he belongs, at the request of any such employee in charge, if there is such a seat vacant.

The final seven words of the section state that, if in fact no seats anywhere on the bus were vacant, it would not have been lawful for the driver to demand that Parks and the other passengers in her row move. Of course, I wouldn’t bet the ranch on an uniformed bus driver exercising such forbearance. Nevertheless, the story as I’ve always understood it is that seats further back were vacant; Rosa Parks was quite literally being ordered to move to the back of the bus and refused.

[davidmich]

@Freddy_the_Pig

Her arrest record indicates that she was arrested for violating Chapter 6, Section 11 of the Montgomery City Code.

The court record for the parallel case of Browder v. Gayle, which involved four other women who violated the segregation ordinances, quotes Section 11 in full and also quotes several other relevant state and local laws. Here is Section 11:The final seven words of the section state that, if in fact no seats anywhere on the bus were vacant, it would not have been lawful for the driver to demand that Parks and the other passengers in her row move. Of course, I wouldn’t bet the ranch on an uniformed bus driver exercising such forbearance. Nevertheless, the story as I’ve always understood it is that seats further back were vacant; Rosa Parks was quite literally being ordered to move to the back of the bus and refused.

’
Thanks Freddie the Pig, you’d think this kind of information would be ubiquitous by now. It’s not by any means.

[davidmich]

@davidmich

’
Thanks Freddie the Pig, you’d think this kind of information would be ubiquitous by now. It’s not by any means.

I hope you can help me find the ordinance that replaced the Chapter 6, Section 11 City Code. All I can come up with is “an ordinance authorizing black bus passenger to sit virtually anywhere they choose on buses”.

[davidmich]

@davidmich

I hope you can help me find the ordinance that replaced the Chapter 6, Section 11 City Code. All I can come up with is “an ordinance authorizing black bus passenger to sit virtually anywhere they choose on buses”.

I’d be interested to know how much revenue the bus lines and Montgomery lost as a result of the 11 month bus boycott.

[davidmich]

@davidmich

I’d be interested to know how much revenue the bus lines and Montgomery lost as a result of the 11 month bus boycott.

I’ve seen other websites say it was a 13-month boycott. That sounds more precise.

[TSBG]

I’m sorry not to have a specific cite, but I know I saw something about the bus boycott claiming that it was the bus companies who brought it to an end–they wanted the revenue back.

[davidmich]

@TSBG

I’m sorry not to have a specific cite, but I know I saw something about the bus boycott claiming that it was the bus companies who brought it to an end–they wanted the revenue back.

Thanks TSGB. Who were they going to claim it back from? The City? Were they suing the city for loss of revenue?

[UDS]

No, they wanted their revenue stream back. They weren’t looking for compensation for revenue lost during the boycott; they just wanted to earn future revenues, which could only happen if the boycott ended.

(This is how commercial boycotts are supposed to produce an outcome, btw.)

[davidmich]

@UDS

No, they wanted their revenue stream back. They weren’t looking for compensation for revenue lost during the boycott; they just wanted to earn future revenues, which could only happen if the boycott ended.

(This is how commercial boycotts are supposed to produce an outcome, btw.)

Thanks UDS. By the way I’m still trying to find the ordinance/statute that replaced the Chapter 6 section 11 ordinance. Do you happen to know? All I have is " The city passed an ordinance authorizing black bus passengers to sit virtually anywhere they chose on buses" but not the actual ordinance code/number.

[Saint_Cad]

@davidmich

Thanks UDS. By the way I’m still trying to find the ordinance/statute that replaced the Chapter 6 section 11 ordinance. Do you happen to know? All I have is " The city passed an ordinance authorizing black bus passengers to sit virtually anywhere they chose on buses" but not the actual ordinance code/number.

Why does that have to be a new ordinance and not simply repealing the existing ones.

[Really_Not_All_That_Bright]

@TSBG

I’m sorry not to have a specific cite, but I know I saw something about the bus boycott claiming that it was the bus companies who brought it to an end–they wanted the revenue back.

You are probably conflating the bus segregation issue with the lunch counter sit-ins, which did result in voluntary desegregation by several businesses and cities. The Montgomery City Council did not voluntarily desegregate buses; the ordinance was enforced until it was overturned in Browder v. Gale (mentioned by Freddy).

@Freddy_the_Pig

Her arrest record indicates that she was arrested for violating Chapter 6, Section 11 of the Montgomery City Code.

The court record for the parallel case of Browder v. Gayle, which involved four other women who violated the segregation ordinances, quotes Section 11 in full and also quotes several other relevant state and local laws. Here is Section 11:The final seven words of the section state that, if in fact no seats anywhere on the bus were vacant, it would not have been lawful for the driver to demand that Parks and the other passengers in her row move. Of course, I wouldn’t bet the ranch on an uniformed bus driver exercising such forbearance. Nevertheless, the story as I’ve always understood it is that seats further back were vacant; Rosa Parks was quite literally being ordered to move to the back of the bus and refused.

The full text of the code section - and Section 10, which provides useful context - is also here.

@davidmich

I hope you can help me find the ordinance that replaced the Chapter 6, Section 11 City Code. All I can come up with is “an ordinance authorizing black bus passenger to sit virtually anywhere they choose on buses”.

Whatever it was, it appears that it no longer exists. Chapter 6 of the Montgomery Code regulates business, and Article VIII covers vehicles for hire. There are divisions governing taxis and “alternative transportation services,” (presumably ridesharing) but nothing about buses.

Montgomery’s bus service is now run by the city rather than private entities. Generally speaking, Southern states, counties and cities under desegregation orders did not amend their laws, they just stopped enforcing the ones that were struck down. Alabama famously did not repeal its constitutional prohibition on interracial marriage until 2000, or 33 years after such laws were declared unconstitutional by SCOTUS.

[DSYoungEsq]

@davidmich

Thanks UDS. By the way I’m still trying to find the ordinance/statute that replaced the Chapter 6 section 11 ordinance. Do you happen to know? All I have is " The city passed an ordinance authorizing black bus passengers to sit virtually anywhere they chose on buses" but not the actual ordinance code/number.

Presumably, the city simply re-worked the sections in question. What you want is the “legislative” history of the sections in Chapter 6.

[Really_Not_All_That_Bright]

The code no longer follows the “chapter, section” format, so it’s essentially impossible to find the legislative history unless you know exactly what you’re looking for.

[md2000]

There was a website that said 75% of the bus riders in Montgomery were black. The boycott must have hurt financially. Unlike many modern transit systems, I cannot imagine smaller cities in the US south subsidizing the bus service to any great degree…