Not to confuse things, but I’m curious to know which is the oldest place of serving alcohol, so pub, inn, tavern etc.
It seems to be a matter of dispute between Ye Olde Fighting Cocks(St. Alban’s, Herfordeshire- at its current location since 1451) and The Man & Scythe(Bolton/Manchester, a pub mentioned by name in 1251 and in a building whose cellar dates to before 1200) with some argument on documentation. Cite.
Other claimants:
Ye Olde Howard Johnson’s Bucket of Yellow Bile Tavern and Soul Foode
There are several contenders in this list. The problem with deciding is partly that the histories of these very old pubs go back to a time when there are few surviving records, and when you go go back 1,400 years (e.g., The Old Ferryboat Inn, Holywell, Cambridgeshire, which allegedly was serving ale in 560 AD), the concept of what a pub was becomes rather different from today’s definitions.
Another contender (a real one):
The Walnut Tree, Leytonstone, London
Apparently there’s a big rivalry twixt the old houses. (Where’s Hob Gadling when you need him?) Guinness Book of World Records acknowledges Fighting Cocks as the oldest documented pub, however.
A major issue (a common dispute in American “oldest house” claims) is whether you mean continually occupied site or building. A pub was founded in 1009, that burned down several times and the current building dates from 1809 (but has never gone out of business) that is next door to a pub founded in 1684 and still in its original building, which one is the older (i.e. is the first pub 200 years old or 1000 years old)?
A pub in Dublin claims to be from 1198. I know it’s not in England so I don’t really know why I’m posting!
Guinness and Very Old Pubs of course makes a link to this ad inevitable.
Building on the last comment, it’s frequent in the (suprisingly vicious) oldest house wars for homeowners in the Eastern U.S. to claim “this house dates from 1655”, which means that there’s 9 chimney rocks and a board that old and the rest of the house was built between 1832 and 1998. Don’t dare dispute that it’s not 350 years old just because it’s a split level ranch style with formica counters.
An English friend of mine was in a spirited political debate with an American tourist. After much bantor back and forth, in a moment of frustration, my English friend quipped “Yeah, well my local pub is older than your constitution!”
The oldest proven pub is the Bingley Arms - there are written records dating from 905.
The Fighting Cocks may have been around longer, but it moved site in 1481 so it depends upon how you consider continuity. Also the records of it are not contemporary but rather they state things along the lines of in ‘ye modern age of 1100 Ye Fighting Cocks was over 200 years olde’
You could look at the age of the existing structure, you could also look at the oldest continually used pub, or you could look at the longest occupation of the existing site.
You can make a case for around 8 or 9 differant pubs based upon your criteria.
How many of them are Wetherspoons?
And people still drink in these today? They’re not sealed up as museums or anything? Astonishing.
So if it’s just 8 or 9 it would be possible then for a tourist to stop in and have a pint at each then, so that one could say that you’ve had a pint or four at the oldest pubs in England. Interesting.
Presumably a lot of those claiming to be “the oldest pub” do so in order to attract custom from tourists who want to claim to have had a pint at the oldest pub in London, or wherever – so you would be very welcome and they would be happy to give you a pint in exchange for some shiny gold £1 or £2 coins.
Hmmmm…what’s a pint go for these days?
According to this recent newspaper article, anything from £1 to £3 (i.e., $1.40 to $4.20 in US dollars).
That’s not so bad, you can spend a great deal more than that here in the states.
If you want to nitpick, none of those can be pubs:
Huh?
I believe Exapno Mapcase is pointing out the relatively recent development of the word “pub”. To which I respond, the word “building” didn’t exist in 3000 B.C., but that doesn’t mean there weren’t any buildings in 3000 B.C.
Oh, I see. And I agree. Actually, I vaguely recall looking up a while back what the difference was on 19th-century maps between ‘P.H.’ (i.e. pub), ‘Inn’ and ‘Tavern’ - it was to do with whether food and/or lodging was available.
Are any of these places listed in the Domesday BooK?