Got a cite for this? As someone who has worked with programs for Undocumented aliens, and investigated working & living conditions, I can tell you that (at least in CA) it just ain;t so. If ICE comes by on a raid, and the records show that the employer is paying “the illegals” less than Min Wage and off the books, it’s very bad. You then have a slam dunk case against him, and the IRS gets into the act, and they are not a nice bunch of dudes when it comes to assessing and collecting unpaid Employment taxes.
If the employer is paying them just the same, and he has a bunch of copies (no matter how bad) of “papers”, he has plausible deniability, he can claim he didn;t know. No IRS, either. Just a few dudes rounded up and trucked off. Nothing but a small and stupid employer will take the risk.
No doubt, a fair number of any sort of this labor works “under the table”, but that would even apply to dudes who were born here.
Also, good crop workers are paid on a piece work system, which although involves long hours of hard monotonous labor, can pay much better than Minimum wage.
I have seen Joe Frickin Friday’s cite before- losing undocumented workers would only net a small increase in prices at the retail level.
Note also, that quite a few Migrant Farm Workers have a Green card (maybe a third or so). They would continue to work.
Not true, most Cities and Counties here in CA have Code Inspectors and etc who inspect all housing on a regular if infrequent basis. And, how do you just rent to “illegals”? Rent to just one legal resident, and he’s calling in some agency on your ass.
Again, I want a cite that most illegals work under the table.
You seem to be implying that there was a time before the current situation, when there wasn’t an exploited underclass who were doing dirty jobs at wages that “real Americans” wouldn’t accept. True, they weren’t always Mexicans, but we’ve had the same situation with blacks, and Irish, and Chinese, and other “not real American” groups right from the beginning
This reminds me of the hard sell that was quite frequently used in the 70s and 80s. “You like drinking sodas, right? Well, for just the cost of 2 drinks a day, you can have membership…”
Of course, I’d already spent my pop money on supporting the kid from China. Then, I used my wifes pop money to get the insurance for the kid. Then, I used my brother’s pop money for my party dues. Then…
The whole process is nickel and diming us to death. Also, I still had to come up with money for my pop!
I think he’s referring to the period from about the 1940s to the 1980s, when the great wave that arrived from 1880 to WWI had aged out of the workforce, but the new immigrants under the 1965 immigration act hadn’t arrived in significant numbers yet. That was a period not only of tremendous economic expansion in the United States but also a time generally agreed to have been pretty good for the average, non-college-graduate, middle-class American. Not coincidentally it was also the time when Jim Crow and segregation were thrown into the trash bin of history. You can’t go on discriminating against people who you really need to staff your big new station wagon factory.
I don’t believe illegal immigrants consider themselves all that exploited, or else they wouldn’t be here. Considering the kind of real exploitation that goes on in the countries they came from, they probably think they’ve found the pot of gold. This explains the risks many are willing to take in order to get here.
Did you know that all the Orange harvesting in Florida is done by middle aged white men? At least, that’s what the ‘Florida’s Natural’ juice ads would have you believe…
See, it’s this sort of thing that makes me doubt the facts or the honesty of a study.
“Unrestricted room rate” is a meaningless benchmark. Surely no intelligent person thinks the cheapest room in L.A. is $239? Shit, I’ve stayed at the LAX Hilton, in fact, at least half a dozen times, and never paid $239.
Right, a brief check on a well known travel site netted me **10 pages **of room under $100, around 150 hotels. I got 4 Hilton Hotels with rates under $100. I could book the Hilton Los Angeles Airport for $110.
Next the cost of an employee is at least double the wages paid. So that’s a 5%+ increase in the room rate.
I have lived in high-immigrant and low-immigrant areas.
High-immigrant areas have much nicer private yards; much better low-end service (bag boys, car washers, table bussers); a lot more valet parking; and small enclaves of very well kept lower end housing.
I don’t want some high school kid taking care of my yard with their dad’s lawnmower during their summer vacation. The Hispanic guys I’ve had do my landscaping for the last 15 years are professionals who use commercial equipment, show up on time and do great work. I gladly pay them $15.00 an hour.
Years ago I tried some white guys who did do a good job. The trouble was that they surfed (like I do). Whenever there were waves, they call up and say that they were having “equipment problems”, (sure!)
Here in southern California there are all kinds of field crops that are harvested by Hispanics. These guys are out working in all kinds of crappy weather from heavy rain (strawberries rot if they get rained on) to hot weather. No way any one other than Hispanics are going to do this kind of work. They are paid by the box and can make good money if they work fast, but no Whites, Blacks, Asians or any one else is going to go through what they do to make a buck I don’t care what you pay them.
I’ve lived in California apartments for about 3 years total, and I’ve never even heard of this, much less been inspected. In the most literal fashion of questioning, what are you talking about?
What is it about “Hispanics” that you think makes them uniquely suited for this work? And how did America feed itself before we had the benefit of their efforts?
As a white guy (and American citizen) who has done migrant agricultural work myself, I feel safe in saying that you’re wrong.
Go to Florida and check out the citrus pickers. Sure, it’s mostly a Latino crew, but most of the ones that I’ve seen are roughly 1/3 salt and pepper. I, myself, have picked produce out in the fields and pulled suckers off tobacco to help make my living. I’m about as American and white (pretty red in the sun, though :p) as it gets.
Should illegals vanish tomorrow, their jobs would be filled. Like one of the other posters said, it would impact the economy short term, but the labor market would adjust.
Anyone who thinks he or she would like to do the agricultural job that is usually done by a Mexican can apply for those jobs here: http://www.takeourjobs.org/