What’s the deal with Sabbath=Sunday?

In response to badchad’s arguments against Polycarp, it is not merely Pauline teaching that made the Christian churches decide to worship on a Sunday. At the Council of Nicea (I believe), it was VOTED upon by the attending church fathers, with the Emperor Constantine there to “guide” them, that Christians would not follow the laws of Moses because the Jews had killed the Savior and were obviously no longer God’s chosen people. (Amazing the things you learn when you’re doing a research paper on Clerical Celibacy your sophomore year in college)… So the old Mosaic law of Sabbath is sundown Friday to sundown Saturday was tossed out (as were the laws on keeping kosher and many others) and the Christian Holy Day of the week was made Sunday in memory and honor of the Risen Christ.

And no, I do not believe in the whole gobbledygook about the Jews, but that was the reasoning.

Wandering Agnostic:

In response to badchad’s arguments against Polycarp, it is not merely Pauline teaching that made the Christian churches decide to worship on a Sunday. At the Council of Nicea (I believe), it was VOTED upon by the attending church fathers, with the Emperor Constantine there to “guide” them, that Christians would not follow the laws of Moses because the Jews had killed the Savior and were obviously no longer God’s chosen people.

I don’t doubt it as while Paul said Christians weren’t bound by the law, I don’t recall him saying to worship on Sunday. Of course this still makes no sense because Jesus was supposed to be one and the same as the Jewish god who wrote the Ten Commandments, which he explicitly said to follow. Yet they voted otherwise. :dubious:

They shall all drown in lakes of blood, muahaha.

And what is your point? I’ve stated already that, for the Orthodox Church, Sabbaton is still to be observed in addition to the new observance on Kyriake.

And once again, since you’re so hot on quoting Scripture, where specifically in Scripture does it state that one is to only consult Scripture. Likewise, where in Scripture does it state that we are to specifically ignore the decisions of the Apostles in the Book of Acts where they determine that Christians (at least those who are Gentiles) are only bound by the old Law to the extent that we are to abstain from drinking blood and to avoid sexual immorality?

"I think that Seventh-day Adventists have Saturday as the Sabbath. Remember that the seventh-day adventists believe the pope to be the anti-christ, so they believe that Sunday is a day of babylonian worship to Satan."

Lithium - Your first thought on adventists is correct… Seventh Day Adventists practice the Sabbath from sundown on Friday to sundown to sundown on Saturday. They do this because the Sabbath just happens to be from sundown on Friday until sundown on Saturday.

People who practice the Sabbath are disturbed when people claim another day to be the Sabbath, especially since the Big G made it a point to have “Keep the Sabbath Holy” engraved on stone tablets and carried down a mountain by Moses.

The rest of your thoughts (bolded) need work as not all Adventists believe that the Pope is the antichrist or that Sunday is a day based on pagan practices.

As an agnostic and a student of theology I find the practices of all religions to be strange… especially if you view them from the perspective of an informed outsider.

I do understand that the Sabbath is the seventh day of the week and that for thousands upon thousands of years, Jews have been keeping it because their god told them to do so.

Muslims also follow the same Sabbath law and in recent times Seventh Day Adventists and SD Baptists have also chosen to practice the Sabbath on the Sabbath, often to the derision of other Christian denominations.

bibliophage
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If you want to say that Christians aren’t bound by the Old Testament, then fine. “We don’t have to keep holy the Sabbath” is quite different fro “the Sabbath is now Sunday”, however. And

And apparently there’s a keyboard shortcut for posting one’s post that I do not know about. Perhaps I accidently pressed tab enter. Please ignore the above; I’m working on a complete response.

bibliophage-
There’s a bit of a difference between “Why do Christians worship on Sunday?” and “Why do Christians consider Sunday to be the Sabbath?”

ImNotMad2-
Leaving aside the issue of whether “Keep holy the Sabbath” should have been translated as “Keep holy a Sabbath”, Christians often refer to Sunday as the Sabbath, not simply a Sabbath. For instance, a writer to Newsweek claimed that if we are to follow the Old Testament’s rule of death to homosexuals, we should also apply the death penalty to those that work on Sunday. I don’t understand how soeone could think that when the Old Testaments that those that work on the Sabbath should die, it was referring to Sunday.

dogface-
The problem is that fundamentalist Christians refer to the Old Testament whenever it’s convenient. When they want to condemn homosexuality, they quote the Old Testament. And something high on their agenda is getting the Ten Commandments posted anywhere they can. Why are they so adament about posting the Ten Commandments, when they don’t even follow them themselves? I realize that logical inconsistencies are not necessarily a problem for Christian fundamentalists, but why would anyone promote a code of conduct which he believes he is not bound by?

The answer to this question is both self-evident and academic.

At the base of our seven-day-week’s temporal measurement is our earth’s annual journey around the sun. The synchronation of these two time-events has required reajustments since the times of Moses and Jesus that have made our days-of-week determinations out-of-whack.

Our “Sunday” could be “Tuesday” or our “Saturday” could be “Sunday” and so on, depending on the re-alignments that would have had to be made starting a mutually agreed upon date in the however distant past.

Our calendar holds no mystic qualities. The mystery is in the transcendent ideas that the observation of whichever day that we chose, represents.

Words have no fixed meaning. Words only have function.

Dogface:

Originally posted by badchad
Shoot guys, it’s your god and his rules. Considering the stakes don’t you think it unwise to try and your way out of them. Aside from convention do you have any good reason to take such a chance?

And what is your point? I’ve stated already that, for the Orthodox Church, Sabbaton is still to be observed in addition to the new observance on Kyriake.

I guess one point would be that only the Orthodox Church members will go to heaven while all those who spend a few hours at the office or gather firewood on Saturday will be doomed right along with me. That will be kind of funny.

And once again, since you’re so hot on quoting Scripture, where specifically in Scripture does it state that one is to only consult Scripture.

I think what you are looking for is a place in the bible that says you are allowed to contradict the teachings of Jesus/god. As you read it, Paul gives you that, but I think that should cast some doubts on he said as that would make Jesus’ commands pretty short lived don’t you think. Still I have known Christians who believed a lot dumber things and my not being too familiar with your overall views can’t comment on how well your statements here jive with them or how you decide which parts to take literally.

Polycarp on the other hand, really stuck his foot in his mouth with calling Paul and idjit, and going on and on about how the teachings of Jesus should be followed to exclusion of the rest of the bible and Paul in particular. Yet, then pulls this crap about going to church on Sunday, citing Paul with regards to following the law while contradicting Jesus as I cited above. And yeah, I’m pretty curious to see him try to talk his way out of it.

Likewise, where in Scripture does it state that we are to specifically ignore the decisions of the Apostles in the Book of Acts where they determine that Christians (at least those who are Gentiles) are only bound by the old Law to the extent that we are to abstain from drinking blood and to avoid sexual immorality?

What day did they worship?

Quote specifically from Orthodox soteriology where this is the doctrine of the Orthodox Church. Or are you yet another liar, yet another fraud? You claim this is Orthodox doctrine? Then back up your claim.

As far as can be determined, they held both the Seventh Day and the First Day to be holy.

Now, please back up your slanderous claims about Orthodox doctrine regarding damnation or retract your lie.

Dogface:

Originally posted by badchad
I guess one point would be that only the Orthodox Church members will go to heaven while all those who spend a few hours at the office or gather firewood on Saturday will be doomed right along with me. That will be kind of funny.

Quote specifically from Orthodox soteriology where this is the doctrine of the Orthodox Church. Or are you yet another liar, yet another fraud? You claim this is Orthodox doctrine? Then back up your claim.

Awful defensive don’t you think? I don’t know jack about “Orthodox soteriology” but I have a reasonable comprehension of the bible. Reread what I wrote and you should see that I didn’t make any statements on what is “Orthodox doctrine.” I did make the statement that if they are correct about both Saturday and Sunday needing to be kept holy then it would seem that most Christians who do not keep Saturday holy are repeatedly and unrepentantly breaking the forth commandment, in which the god in question was quite clear about it being a big deal to him, punishable by death and ranked above thou shalt not kill. Whether the Orthodox Church members are smart enough to follow the above mentioned beliefs (that you cited) through to their logical conclusion is a wholly different matter.

As far as can be determined, they held both the Seventh Day and the First Day to be holy.

Do you have any cites (verses) which clearly indicate that the 1st day is to be systematically to be kept holy?

Now, please back up your slanderous claims about Orthodox doctrine regarding damnation or retract your lie.

Dogface are you angry because you are “Orthodox” and think I am misrepresenting your position or are you of the default variety of Christian who would be angered because you don’t want to be damned for systematically breaking the 10 commandments for no good reason?