First off, I’ve never hidden the fact that I’m no fan of Tiger Woods. But I do find his current situation curious. Whatever he is doing doesn’t seem to be working out either professionally or (based on nothing other than his recent breakup w/ Lindsey Vonn) personally. Anyone interested in playing armchair life/golf coach and planning Tiger’s future?
I guess we could approach it at least 2 ways. What do you think is best for Tiger, given whatever you think you know about his personality, strengths, etc.? Or we could say what would YOU do if YOU were Tiger?
Tiger is such a super competive individual, I don’t think it is realistic to suggest that he just kick back and enjoy retirement. But I’m having a hard time imagining that he is going to be able to get back to golfing at any level that is going to meet his expectations. I think the best thing for him would be to find something else he can compete at. Maybe business, or some expensive demanding hobby - racing cars, mountain climbing…? Or maybe throw himself into philanthropy.
Not sure if he will be able to make the mental adjustment of seeing himself as an “elder statesman” of golf. Sorta like Fred Couples. Play the events he wants, enjoying the moments that brilliance strikes, but not grinding week in/out.
He does a pretty good job of keeping his private life private. But from what comes across in public, he doesn’t seem terribly happy or content. Which is a shame, given all he has going for him.
Personally, I think the he should hang up his clubs. But, as you pointed out, he’s too competitive to do that. I’ve never really liked Tiger, or the slobberjobs that the media have always given him (which seems to me to be akin to Madden talking about Favre, Joe Buck talking about the St Louis Cardinals, or ESPN and Tom Brady), and it’s kind of sad to see his downward spiral. I think he’s going to be one of those athletes where he stays active longer than he should, because he’s in so much denial about whether his abilities will return.
I’m genuinely curious about this… how much time does Tiger devote to his kids and their athleticism? The reason I ask, his father was such a huge influence on him, perhaps Tiger will (or should) take his Dad’s lead and help develop their talent. Lord knows he’s got the knowledge and skills to be the perfect mentor and coach.
Like I said, he does a great job of keeping his private life private, so I have no real idea how much time he spends with them. I’m no fan, but I was happy for the guy when he, Lindsay Vonn, and the kids were together at Augusta. Thought it suggested he might be having a decent home life, whatever his professional issues.
Given Tiger’s personality, I’m not sure I’d want to see him throw himself into coaching his kids. Earl’s efforts sure produced an awesome athlete, but not sure he was an excellent role model in other respects … (Nope, not a big fan of Earl either.) Seems like I hear more horror stories of overdemanding parent/coaches, than the other way around. Hard to imagine anyone making the transition from jet-setting from Augusta to Dubai - to getting fulfillment out of bringing juice boxes to the neighborhod park for junior’s soccer game!
Who knows! Maybe Tiger is phenomenally happy doing whatever he does in the weeks/months in between tournaments, all I’m reading too much into his dickish on-course demeanor. But it almost seems a tragedy - for someone to have so much going for him in so many respects, he sure doesn’t come across as terribly happy.
He should keep doing what he thinks he needs to do.
But the media and fans should probably let go of him. It’s over. Not only is he pushing 40, but he’s had that back problem for enough years by now that it should be clear it is never going to clear up, and he’s never going to be a consistent top competitor again. It’s time to focus on today’s stars, not yesteryear’s.
This thread is funny. Full of wishful thinking by a bunch of middle aged white guys who hate him. It’s like reading the comments about Obama on a right wing website. Pure make believe.
Tiger has hardly played any competitive golf in 18 months. Two years ago he won four tournaments and was the PGA Player of the Year, the leading money winner, and the scoring leader. As for age, he’s freaking 39 and in better shape than 95% of the golfers on tour. Vijay Singh is 52 and he finished T11 in The Memorial this weekend. Kenny Perry is 55 and missed the cut by one shot when he bogeyed 18. Tiger’s got ten more years of top level golf in him.
Correction: He actually won five times in 2013. After the Phoenix Open a couple of months ago, it was his short game that had gone to hell and he’d never recover it. That lasted until the Masters, when it was just fine. Why should anyone believe his driving issues are permanent? He had long stretches last weekend when he played great and was well under par. He just exploded a few times. He had five double bogeys and a quadruple bogey. That’s his 14 over right there.
Silliness - as opposed to most sports discussions!
Not sure where you see the wishful thinking. Heck, if you think what he should do is just what he’s been doing, and have an opinion as to the results he will derive, offer it up.
Sure, Vijay and OMeara enjoyed their greatest success when they were older than Woods is now. You think Tiger can expects similar results? Or you think he’d be satisfied to rake in money while pulling in an occasional top-10?
I read an opinion that he’s merely gone from an unbeatable god to an actual mortal. If so, plenty of mortals win stuff, so why not continue if he wants to?
Actually, he likely doesn’t. As far as winning majors is concerned, there is a definite dropoff in the frequency of wins past age 35 (no matter how you study the issue you won’t miss it).
Majors wasn’t the topic of the OP, but I’ll address that later. People are saying he should give up the game and raise his kids (who are with his ex most of the time). He’s freaking 39! Vijay Singh won 25 PGA tournaments when he was older than Tiger is now, including the PGA. Phil Mickleson is still winning Tour events in his mid-40’s and he won two majors after age 40.
Re Majors: 18 Majors (9%) have been won by guys in their 40’s and Tiger is a better player and in better shape than all of them (with the only possible exception being Jack Nicklaus.) Tom Watson missed a short putt on the 72nd hole of the Open Championship that would have won him the title at age 60.
If people think that a 39 year old who is the best golfer who ever lived is done, year, I’ll say you are thinking wishfully, because there in no logical reason to believe that.
He’s had serious issues with staying healthy over the past few years.
He’s attempted to blow up and rebuild his swing repeatedly.
He used to be able to focus himself and play his best golf in the major tournaments, but now he struggles to just put four good rounds together in a major.
And, while none of us really know what’s going on inside Tiger’s head, it does seem likely that all of the craziness in his personal life has taken a toll.
In 2013, he showed that it was possible for him to keep playing at a competitive level, though he wasn’t consistently what he was pre-2009…and he’s suffered through another poor season-and-a-half since that comeback season.
Is it possible for him to pull it back together and win his 15th major? Sure. Is it likely? I remain unconvinced.
For most of his professional career, Tiger set himself the goal of “being the best ever.” Most often, tha was defined as surpassing Jack’s major total.
5 or so years ago, I assumed it was an eventuality. Today, I’d bet the house against. And it has been a long time since I’ve heard anyone suggest that he has any chance of passing Jack. Instead, folk talk of passing Snead’s total wins.
No denial from me that Tiger is one of - if not the best golfer ever. Heck, I’d probably say that for a stretch he was the most dominant athlete ever. But, through a combination of physical injuries and personal misadventures, it seems pretty undeniable that he is not the dominant force he once was. Moreover, his success changed the game such that there are more awesome youngsters than when he ruled the tour.
Sure, he should be able to amass multiple win seasons - maybe even have lightning strike and win another major or 2. Especially if he plays a full schedule including events like the John Deere classic… But, as driven as he seems to be, will he be happy with that level of success?
In part, this is similar to the discussion when every dominant figure nears his/her expiration date. Ought they retire when at their peak, or should they wring out every drop of greatness. Watching Tiger lately I’m reminded of how sad I felt when Dr J lost a step in his final years, and would get schooled by some mere humans.
You are right - Tiger remains young, and phenomenally gifted physically and mentally. I’m just wondering if he might be best off seeking new challenges. Heck, it isn’t as though it would be unheard of for someone in their 30s to readjust their career goals. No reason to assume he is the equivalent of a corporate lifer, needing to put in his 30 years at the same job to get his gold watch and pension.
Like I said, if you study the issue without cherry picking the data like you did (and, again, without ascribing motives to other posters) , you’ll see that there is nothing wishful about facts. Mickelson’s a rather bad example (tho not the worst) for you to pick anyway, since if you look at his majors record overall there is a noticeable drop in his consistency and % of time contending past age 35 (his 2006 season).
And Tiger is most certainly is not in “better shape”-not sure how you can even begin to justify that, given his numerous ailments of the past half decade.
He does have occasional good rounds, playing as well as he almost ever has. But rarely four in a row anymore, and never in a major. That’s how an athlete ages in any sport - some days he’s as good as ever, but the bad days get increasingly frequent until they dominate. His health problems only worsen the situation.
Yes, he was as dominant an athlete as there ever was. Once. But he’ll never win another major.
I might take that bet. Wouldn’t bet the house, and would like to get some odds, but we’re talking the chances of lightning striking on 4 consecutive days over the next decade or 2. He certainly has as good a chance as Watson or Couples of occasionally being in the mix on days 3-4.
Look at it another way, he doesn’t even have to be hot 4 days in a row. It seems as tho a bunch of his wins included one off day. So I could still imagine magic striking. But hoping for periodic luck is a far cry from his past dominance.
Also, my OP tried to ask what folk thought was best for Tiger - not what any of us prefer that he do for our motivations. He’s obviously a very different person than I, and I have difficulty imagining his motivations. But given who he was his first 30-35 years, I find it hard to imagine he would get much pleasure/joy/satisfaction/fulfillment out of being an also-ran.
Those off days would now qualify as pretty good ones.
It’s hard partly because Nike coached him well about being remote and maintaining an image that anyone can admire, speaking only blandly about anything other than his sport - the same thing they did with Michael Jordan, with the same results. Certainly golf is his life, and he’s had to be psychotically competitive since infancy, but whatever is going on inside his head is his own affair. It’s up to him, and we should all accept it.
But meanwhile there’s another generation of stars being robbed of part of the attention they’re due.
