You mean by getting government into people’s bladders? I like Mayor Bloomberg’s economic stances and his rejection anti-Wall Street demagougery but socially he is authoritarian.
No, we crossed that line in the early days of the War on Drugs . . .
Weeeeelllllllpppp.
Well, say what you will about his totalitarian aspects, but there’s no denying that, well, it works. NYC is a real nice place to live, and most of his actions are addressing real problems.
This. Moderate conservatives didn’t disappear, they’ve just been co-opted by the Democrats’ expansion into the vacuum left by the ever-more-extreme right wing. What will be Obama’s crowning legacy was, only 20 years ago, the pet project of Newt Gingrich.
The strange part is that this shifting of positions hasn’t been reflected by shifts in popular support. Historically, when one party gets more extreme due to internal forces, and the other party stakes the vacated territory, you see the party representation contract and expand to match. Moderates being forced out of the Republican platform isn’t the curiosity, it’s the lack of consequences that’s odd. This problem should be self-correcting.
And then I read this:
The Republican mindset is no different from the Soviets. It’s not about good or bad, right or wrong, it’s about toeing the party line.
Forgive me, I just recently re-watched “The Eternal Lightness of Being.”
There are still some moderate Republicans in some national parks somewhere, and private preserves. Hunting season is May through August.
When the democrats started standing up for civil rights in the 50s and 60s, it took some southern whites 30-40 years to switch parties. So there is a delay when a party stops representing you and you switch. You’d assume with the internet and all the 24/7 news agencies the switch would be faster though.
I’m confused by the lack of consequences too. The GOP wins just as big a share of the electorate now as they did back when they were more sane. So maybe there are no consequences. The way they rip on Christie for working in a bipartisan way with president Obama to deal with a hurricane is insane. Yet, no electoral consequences. Only about 10-15% of the electorate is tea party, so that leaves about 30% of the electorate who vote GOP who are less extreme. I don’t know if they will change positions anytime soon. Who knows.
Cap and trade was also a conservative idea. So was the DREAM act (or at least the DREAM act was bipartisan). If Obama accomplishes those, he will have two more moderate conservative ideas to add to his record.
Yeah, that seems to reflect my current reality the best.
Oh well. Can’t unmake an omelet. Can’t unring a bell. Can’t unmake a bed.
Or can you?
The funny thing is, when you get right down to it, socially liberal and fiscally conservative positions are consistent. Both ultimately advocate less government activity, whether it’s in regulating someone’s private life, or in spending public money.
That’s my issue with the Republican party as it stands today. They’re both fiscally conservative to the point of callousness and cruelty, and yet want to dig all up in people’s private business because of pretty extreme religious views.
There’s not much to like there, to be honest. The Democrats have their problems as well- the constant class-warfare like anti-white, anti-wealth rhetoric is very scary to someone who happens to be white and middle class or higher. It gives the impression that if the Democrats are elected, they’ll tax you more, and give it to others who didn’t work for it. I’m not saying that’s what will happen, or even that it’s the stated plan, but that’s the impression that the Democratic rhetoric gives.
So I’m stuck somewhere I don’t like; I don’t want to vote for the Republicans, because they’re just crazy talk, with all their positions on social issues that aren’t their business, and because of their borderline insane positions on things like the UN, international diplomacy, etc… (and I’m usually a pretty hard-line foreign policy person!)
I don’t much like the Democrats either- their rhetoric seems to be against me and mine in many ways, and I have the impression that I’ll ultimately suffer from their policies in the long run.
This isn’t intended as a snark but ‘people like you’ have been doing pretty fine while the bankers were looting the economy to destruction. Taxes at historic low etc. Now the bill is due. ‘People like you’ (again - no snark) should be looking to hold those responsible to account and looking to make those who really made out like bandits pay up, not worry that those crushed at the bottom of the heap by forces beyond their control might get a little help.
A sober, moderate conservative would admit that centralized government plays an essential social role by standing up to the potential oppression of citizens by private power. Those who have guns, money, or social status will always attempt to dominate those who don’t. Many times this domination is benign, but sometimes it isn’t. That’s where government has a role.
A moderate conservative would accept the premise that effective government checks on private power is an essential part of democracy, but would stand ready to act as a similar check on government overreach. Both sides should want the government to be better in its approach. The problem with modern Republicans IMO is that they uniformly don’t believe the government can act well in dealing with private power; they think it should have no role at all. Reagan was wrong; centralized government can be a solution to a whole host of problems beyond the obvious ones (common currency, single military, etc.)–obvious issues which IMO modern Republicans cede to government solutions more for the sake of tradition than any abiding belief in government’s effectiveness.
Show me a Republican willing to say, for example, that a strong central government role for the social safety net–SS, welfare, and Medicare/Medicaid–is essential given the career instability of the modern US economy, and I’ll show you a moderate Republican.
I’m hardly wealthy, unless you’re living under a bridge. Middle class, or maybe just inside the upper middle class line depending on whose line you use.
What I meant by “people like me” was that a lot of the Democrat rhetoric seems to paint things as “us vs. them”, and “us” comes across, at least around here, as non-white and lower middle class or worse off.
That’s what I was getting at- the rhetoric isn’t exactly inclusive, unless you’re in specific groups. Not that the Republicans are any better either.
I was going to say Rubio until his latest “The earth may or may not be billions of years old or a few thousands, we’ll never know” response
I think we have to be very careful with who we’re calling a moderate on the GOP. If its not climate change, torture, creationism, rape babies, or taxes, they’ll have something else they’re extremely fanatical on.
Rubio may be a moderate on immigration, having once supported the DREAM Act, but he’s an extremist in creationism. Same with Bobby Jindal, who looks moderate on some issues, but believes in exorcism.
And no, both sides DON’T do the same thing. I bet someone like Obama or Pelosi believes in evolution, thinks higher taxes aren’t socialism, and believes babies coming from rape are not god’s gift. Chris Christie seems like a brusque pragmatist when it comes to working with the president on storm cleanup, but I wonder what his position is on some other issues
Same with Huntsman, he believed in science and was libertarian on social issues, but his economic policies were to the right of Reagan. But in today’s climate, that counts as moderate. Which again, Reagan would be a moderate in today’s GOP.
Republicans were once moderate? I’m not sure I know of any moderate republicans in this era. Did they once exist? Yes. Do they exist now? I doubt it.
I’m quite willing to bet that Rubio will ignore creationism once he takes office. While an unfortunate stance, it should be noted even Bush administration court appointees struck down attempts at introducing ID in schools.
That is unlike Rubio’s apparent advocacy of teaching young earth creationism in public schools, a theological belief which should not have a bearing on politics unless he say advocates that government health insurance pay for exorcisms.
It is not a sure deal when one considers that Rubio is close to the Tea Party and it was with a lot of their support that he won in 2010, Once again, these are not your father’s Republicans, woo woo is their mantra.
Nope, Jindal already signed into law what Rubio is just dreaming about.