I’ve contemplated this for a while now, and mentioned I might start a thread. So, here I ask what you all think will be the breaking point, both personally and nationally, that will finally move Congress or the public to say “enough” and fight back in earnest. Every day is a new atrocity perpetrated by Asshole 1 and his minions, and it’s easy to get almost desensitized, especially when we all feel helpless to stop it. We take it, day after day, and at some point it’s got to come to a head.
Personally, I’ve already passed that point, and while I’m not in a position to do much more than protest, write letters, etc., if there was something greater put into motion, I’d be willing to jump in. I would quite literally rather not be here, than live in a Christo-fascist state.
So, what do you think the breaking point will be for the country at large? What’s your personal line in the sand? I think if donnie tries to run for a third term, if the Courts don’t shut it down, I fully believe we as a people will have to remove him forcibly.
I’m in @czarcasm’s camp. MAGA assumes everyone would do to them what they are doing to others. Being held accountable is completely unacceptable. And they will absolutely break the country to avoid being in that position. Whether it be phrased as “an emergency” act to “delay” 2028 elections or even sooner, they’ve made sure that short of a nation-wide civil war, that their King is King, all others merely pretenders. And our legislative and judicial authoritarians give only just enough setbacks to briefly claim they’re protecting the voters interests.
Another vote for there not being some “last straw” on the horizon. I figure the Republicans will be smart enough to destroy democracy and the rule of law but maintain the illusion that they still exist. They’ll allow the Democrats to still exist and even win some elections. But the Republicans will make sure they’re always in real control.
But as long as the fig leaf remains in place, most people will be willing to look the other way and say things aren’t as bad as they seem.
Nothing. They could go full Holocaust and start herding people into death camps, and their victims would just mutter complaints about the Democrats or “the younger generation” or “liberals”, then shuffle into the gas chambers without resistance.
There is nothing that will constitute a “last straw” with the MAGA cult. Anything DJT does or says will be considered to be the TRUTH and how the Baby Jesus wants things to be.
Anything unpopular or that impacts the base will be declared the fault of Democrats/Liberals/Socialists/Obama/Clintons/SleepyJoe.
SCOTUS will roll over and allow anything he decrees. The GOP controlled Congress is even more of a lap dog. The idea elections in ‘26 or ‘28 will result in a change to the make up of Congress or the White House are nothing but fantasy.
We are well and truly fucked. Democracy is dead and autocracy is getting more and more power with each passing day.
ETA: I forgot to mention how 90% of our news media has rolled over and avoids anything like holding the administrations feet to the fire.
Too many people think that there is always a way to win a battle or, worse, the battle will just go the other way because of some imaginary balance in the universe or the intervention of some divine power…and there just isn’t. Sometimes the actual war is lost, and you fight to lessen the pain and delay, as much as is humanly possible, the inevitable.
I’m going to vote against the crowd here and say that there will be a straw. But straws being straws, we can’t predict what it will be. It will be something small, something normally tolerable but it will happen in the right/wrong place on the right/wrong day and soon it will be on every news channel. Maybe it will be a traffic stop gone wrong. Maybe it will be some politician being disrespectful to a crowd at a town hall. Maybe it will be some obviously manipulated jobs numbers while people are suffering. Who knows? But there will be some bullshit that happens that will tip the scales. I am sure some people assumed the Berlin Wall was going to be standing forever until that one guy was asked about when it would be coming down and he said “umm, now I guess?” History is funny like that and soon it will be our time to laugh again.
All this reminds me of the early days of Putin’s reign: at first, it was said that the country would now be ruled democratically, and indeed there were some previously unknown freedoms. Then came slight restrictions, followed by more and more things being banned. The judiciary became increasingly controlled, and freedom of the press was increasingly restricted. Putin believed that his country needed a so-called “guided democracy” (направленная демократия). This guidance became increasingly strict, and surveillance became increasingly rigorous. Today, it is a criminal offense to even mention that a life without children can also be enjoyable for a woman, domestic violence against women is not punished, homosexuality may not be mentioned in any form, etc., etc. This is not meant to be a hijack, I just want to show how democracy can be dismantled. I think it will be similar in the US. Freedom of expression is increasingly being controlled, and the judiciary is being manipulated. I don’t believe there will be a civil war or violence against the state in the US. People will adapt, and eventually no one will remember what life was like in the days of democracy.
I will approach the question a little differently.
Rather than a last straw that compels the American public to rouse themselves and “fight back,” I’ll say that the last straw that wakes people up to the fact that something really bad is happening will be the arrest of Obama, Biden, Clinton, AOC, and/or one or more other prominent figures in the so-called “opposition” (possibly extended to media figures, e.g. the reversal of John Oliver’s naturalization and his removal from the country).
When that happens, people will finally say — whoa, wait a minute, what’s going on?
But by then, it will be too late. There will be no “fighting back,” in the sense of there being any kind of centralized, coherent resistance. The country will collapse into internecine bloodshed instead.
I doubt it; most of the country would rather die than resist. It’s impolite to resist, you know. MAGA will kill half the country with barely a voice raised to them in defiance, much less actual resistance.
I understand what you are saying here and yes, it will be a major bridge too far.
But the MAGAts and GOP in Congress will cheer any such moves. SCOTUS will do nothing. Media will not be up in arms as you would expect.
Basically it will all be normalized and any opposition will be hushed. As long as the masses have their screens and other distractions nothing will come of this.
Americans are fat, lazy and complacent. They will never fight back in large enough numbers to bring about change.
It will take an actual atrocity, not just a metaphorical one. Cutting healthcare, cutting USAID, cutting education, those are “atrocities”, but they’re slow atrocities. No one dies immediately, it takes time for the consequences to show up.
But ICE or some other agency actually opening fire on US citizens, en mass? That might do it. Blood on the streets, in quantities that significantly exceed the usual number of police shootings.