A few more:
You haven’t tried to say anything of the kind. Cunctator’s post was about OUTCOME – that the correct legal outcome of a proceeding may not seem “right.” He said nothing about lying.
You speak very poorly for your position. What exactly, is a lie? Your definition is extreme; apparently, a man is a liar if he simplifies a complex situation to a single sentence. If a client is accused of mopery, he is presumed innocent – he, in fact, IS innocent until a jury convicts him and all appeals are exhausted. His attorney will vigorously defend him, speak for him, and deal with an adversarial and error-prone press. Yes, he could go the extra mile and say “As far as I know, my client is innocent,” or “I’m sure that…,” or whatever mealymouthed offering you think would be more “honest,” but that would be (a) cut down to a few words by the press anyway; (b) shortchanging his client, who has an ABSOLUTE RIGHT to his attorney’s most vigorous defense; and © unnecessary, because “my client is innocent” is presumed to be TRUE. That’s why Geragos and other attorneys can say it and not be lying (true, there is no penalty for lying to the press as there is for lying to a client or a judge, or for knowingly presenting false testimony, but it’s very embarassing to get caught in such a lie, and it can come back and bite one’s ass in various ways).
Refusing to volunteer information is NOT lying. Letting people delude themselves is NOT lying. Relying on technical definitions that lead to a different conclusion than common definitions is NOT lying. Making unwarranted assumptions is NOT lying. Drawing an unwarranted conclusion is NOT lying. Throwing yourself on the mercy of the court is, perhaps more “honest” than keeping your mouth shut, but you show me a single profession that doesn’t require keeping the lip zipped from time to time.
I find it amusing that Starving Artist is trying to argue against lawyers that are viewing this thread for the purpose of giving advice on how to be a successful lawyer. Meaning most of the lawyers Starving Artist is arguing with might very well be successful.
The perfect analogy of this situation escapes me at the moment.
No, Starving Artist isn’t trying to argue anything. He was trying to warn you that if you have a moral problem with prevarication, you probably won’t be happy or successful as a lawyer. Secondarily, he has been trying to explain (when asked) what he means and how he could come to the conclusions he has.
He has not come onto this thread to piss off lawyers. He has not come onto this thread to debate. He offered his opinion (this is IMHO, right?). He has come to his opinion for the reasons he has stated, and for this reason he would not be happy or successful as an attorney. If you have no problem with it yourself, power to you…go forth and bill. If you do have a problem with it, you’ll probably do better elsewhere. End of story.
P.S.: You are correct, Nametag. I reread Cunctator’s statement and he was indeed talking about outcome.
I have acheived a reasonable degree of success and satisfaction during my career as an attorney. I do not lie and have never been called upon to lie in my professional career.
Question: Are all salesmen/marketing people/PR people/advertising people liars?
I am not comprehending why its less bad for our current republican president to lie about things that get lots of people killed, make up things like WMD and send my husband off to war to avenge his daddy than it is for our past president to lie about getting laid.
But then again, I’m a tree-huggin’ hippie who thinks sex is a good thing and people dying in a stupid war is a bad thing, so what do I know.
I feel like Humpty Dumpty after he fell off that wall.